Now all the kids have gone to bed...

[Weston Blue]

Good thread.

I have argued that we should give Hughes time. I am firmly in the "we need stability camp" not the "I love Mark Hughes camp". I am however, growing increasingly concerned by the football we are playing (or not playing) and was disgusted with virtaully all I saw last night. I do not however, believe that this can be 100% laid at the door of the manager. Our over paid, ineffectual squad need to shoulder a significant amount of the blame, in particular those such as Elano who are only interested in themselves not the greater good of the club (or the fans). They are professional and should act like it.

That said, whatever the cause, we are in the shit. We need to identify the cause in order to rectify it. I hope that the powers that be in the club are a) aware of the situation (I assume they have eyes like the rest of us) and b) are close enough to it to really determine whether it is Hughes and his mgt team, or the players. They are the ones that have to make the call, they are closer to what is happening than us, and hopefully can make rational decisions based on fact not emotion (most of us on here are driven by emotion and not fact - myself included - that's why we love football and City).

Because I firmly believe in stability, I opt for more time. BUT if things do not pick up soon, and the management think it is definitely Hughes and not the pool of crap players we have who do not put their soul into playing for us, then Hughes must go.

 

[1.618034]

Fair points IP, but who do you suggest takes over. Who is available of course. No point naming Mourinho because he ain't coming, not now at least.

Mancini is available. Backyard is available. Zico has made himself "available".

I don't see how any of them are guaranteed to do any better...

It's interesting to read other's comments on here and gives a clue to what's behind the inherent support from a lot of us...

I'm certainly not for sacking him now, as I don't see who else we could get that will guarantee instantly better performances/results... But even The Special One couldn't do that. (That's 100% guarantee anything!) But I suppose, like Schrodinger's Cat, we don't know til we 'open the box' eh. But as stated already, if Hughes was sacked then it's a case of 'The King is Dead, Long Live The King'... Again!

The more interesting point though is what is going through the minds of the Arabs... They strike me as extremely shrewd cookies and will only sack Hughes if they know they can get a really big name, like Mourinho, Hiddink etc... to replace him. They will not let the club slide too far without a plan B, I just wonder what it is...?

The next 3 games will certainly have a large bearing on what they do, because if we do poorly over Xmas, their hand will be forced...

Never a dull minute!

Onwards and Upwards...

 

[mancity1]

Good thread.

I have argued that we should give Hughes time. I am firmly in the "we need stability camp" not the "I love Mark Hughes camp". I am however, growing increasingly concerned by the football we are playing (or not playing) and was disgusted with virtaully all I saw last night. I do not however, believe that this can be 100% laid at the door of the manager. Our over paid, ineffectual squad need to shoulder a significant amount of the blame, in particular those such as Elano who are only interested in themselves not the greater good of the club (or the fans). They are professional and should act like it.

That said, whatever the cause, we are in the shit. We need to identify the cause in order to rectify it. I hope that the powers that be in the club are a) aware of the situation (I assume they have eyes like the rest of us) and b) are close enough to it to really determine whether it is Hughes and his mgt team, or the players. They are the ones that have to make the call, they are closer to what is happening than us, and hopefully can make rational decisions based on fact not emotion (most of us on here are driven by emotion and not fact - myself included - that's why we love football and City).

Because I firmly believe in stability, I opt for more time. BUT if things do not pick up soon, and the management think it is definitely Hughes and not the pool of crap players we have who do not put their soul into playing for us, then Hughes must go.

Its never one or the other IMO , its a combination of both but in the end if its not working you have to replace the manager.

We cannot afford to let our form continue to slide downhill any longer its too risky there is too much at stake , the only solice we can take is that every side that has replaced their manager so far this year has made improvement in performance and results lets see what Blackburn do in the next week.

 

[1.618034]

Good to have a proper convesational thread on this topic anyway without it turning into pathetic name calling and internet fighting!

Eh? What's going on?

No arguing or name calling?

People making good reasoned points and allowing other's their own opinions...?

This will never do!

MODS!

PS Seriously though. Like everyone, I'm still in shock about Oldham Blue and certainly we're all a bit humbled by those events, hence the break-out of common sense, probably. Also a shame that Scorer did one at just that time too, reckon he was in need of a just such a reality check like most of the rest of us...

Rest in Peace Dave.

Lest we forget Blues.....

 

[aarond]

I can't decide. Head says he's taking us backwards and we look shapeless. My heart says he's got the ability...

 

[warringtonmcfc]

Good thread.

I have argued that we should give Hughes time. I am firmly in the "we need stability camp" not the "I love Mark Hughes camp". I am however, growing increasingly concerned by the football we are playing (or not playing) and was disgusted with virtaully all I saw last night. I do not however, believe that this can be 100% laid at the door of the manager. Our over paid, ineffectual squad need to shoulder a significant amount of the blame, in particular those such as Elano who are only interested in themselves not the greater good of the club (or the fans). They are professional and should act like it.

That said, whatever the cause, we are in the shit. We need to identify the cause in order to rectify it. I hope that the powers that be in the club are a) aware of the situation (I assume they have eyes like the rest of us) and b) are close enough to it to really determine whether it is Hughes and his mgt team, or the players. They are the ones that have to make the call, they are closer to what is happening than us, and hopefully can make rational decisions based on fact not emotion (most of us on here are driven by emotion and not fact - myself included - that's why we love football and City).

Because I firmly believe in stability, I opt for more time. BUT if things do not pick up soon, and the management think it is definitely Hughes and not the pool of crap players we have who do not put their soul into playing for us, then Hughes must go.

100% agree with all of the above.

 

[simon23]

people automatically blame the manager but some of the players simply are not good enough

this form now is a continuation of the poor form in the second half of the season.....sven started to build a side but only got the job half done...he added creativity and a bit of style (albeit very slow) to our game....

MH needs time to develop the team


look at the 1st team squad...there are a large number of players not upto standard

vass
hamman
gelson?
benjani
ball
garrido (just my opinion and i know people will disagree)
dunne...just to hit and miss
caceido
tbh
evans
Jo?????????????????

really Mh is only responsible for one fo those players.......TBH though it could be argues he had the last word on Jo

You could see it in hammans face and reaction last night...he knows that a lot of those players on their last night are simply not good enough.....he was so frustrated.....partly probably with himself but also his reaction to evans and TBH at points told it all..

I partly agree with you but ask yourself how many players at Hull are any better than the ones you list?Any manager can blame the players he inherits for his problems-but he just has to get on with it.Rednapp has transformed Spuds since he took over...why?He's working with the same players Ramos was!!
And I'm pretty sure that fat sam will get better results than Ince at Blackburn!

I'm just not convinced by Hughes,his man-management or his tactics but I'd love to be totally wrong...

i think that some on here believe that some of our players are better than they are.....the likes of the ones ive mentioned are nto as good as some of those teams like Hull have......infact the only players whow we have who id descirbe as top draw or certain prem quality are , Hart (even he has a lot to learn), Richards (though not at the moment), ireland, swp, robinho, elano and kompany (Not including the likes of Jonno petrov and maybe boj as they have not featured......the rest are average middle of the table players at best.

i think some people on here seriously over estimate the current squad of players and their ability. We are seriously lacking any goal threat from any striker option we have at present......our play is reasonable good up until the last third when the midfield have it but NO options ahead of them so the move breaks down.....

add a quality centre forward or two plus the addition of Boj petrov and jonno and we will be a lot better for it.

 

[mancity1]

I partly agree with you but ask yourself how many players at Hull are any better than the ones you list?Any manager can blame the players he inherits for his problems-but he just has to get on with it.Rednapp has transformed Spuds since he took over...why?He's working with the same players Ramos was!!
And I'm pretty sure that fat sam will get better results than Ince at Blackburn!

I'm just not convinced by Hughes,his man-management or his tactics but I'd love to be totally wrong...

i think that some on here believe that some of our players are better than they are.....the likes of the ones ive mentioned are nto as good as some of those teams like Hull have......infact the only players whow we have who id descirbe as top draw or certain prem quality are , Hart (even he has a lot to learn), Richards (though not at the moment), ireland, swp, robinho, elano and kompany (Not including the likes of Jonno petrov and maybe boj as they have not featured......the rest are average middle of the table players at best.

i think some people on here seriously over estimate the current squad of players and their ability. We are seriously lacking any goal threat from any striker option we have at present......our play is reasonable good up until the last third when the midfield have it but NO options ahead of them so the move breaks down.....

add a quality centre forward or two plus the addition of Boj petrov and jonno and we will be a lot better for it.

Yes but do you think we are better than 17/18th Simon?

If so why are we not performing as a side that should be higher in the table?

 

[simon23]

i think that some on here believe that some of our players are better than they are.....the likes of the ones ive mentioned are nto as good as some of those teams like Hull have......infact the only players whow we have who id descirbe as top draw or certain prem quality are , Hart (even he has a lot to learn), Richards (though not at the moment), ireland, swp, robinho, elano and kompany (Not including the likes of Jonno petrov and maybe boj as they have not featured......the rest are average middle of the table players at best.

i think some people on here seriously over estimate the current squad of players and their ability. We are seriously lacking any goal threat from any striker option we have at present......our play is reasonable good up until the last third when the midfield have it but NO options ahead of them so the move breaks down.....

add a quality centre forward or two plus the addition of Boj petrov and jonno and we will be a lot better for it.

Yes but do you think we are better than 17/18th Simon?

If so why are we not performing as a side that should be higher in the table?

yes i do think we are but the distinct lack of quality in key areas is holding us back....

the distribution and general performance of the back four at present is poor....i think this will sort itself eventually......in the league dunne in the last few games has started to look more solid but he is accident prone....richards...he has the quality but he is clearly not fit for what every reason (i dont know).....garrido is average, zabaleta....jury is out on him.....still not sure....does some great things but also makes some horrendous decisions/errors/tackles

midfield.......got good attacking options but due to the demise of hamman/absense of Jonno and the fact that gelson isnt good enough the balance is not there....hopefully that will be sorted in January

attack....as i keep going on about (sorry!!) this is the area that is hugely making the difference.....if swp, irelans or rob arent scoring from midfiedl the not one of our attackers offers anything in the way of a goal threat....the ball is usually nicely worked in to the last third only for our front players to be static....not making runs...dominated on the ball, slow to move and react....etc etc etc.....this all leads to the ball being lost or going backwards to the back 4...whose distribution is poor.

Injuries have played a part there is no doubt and while im not trying to make excuses (and i dont think MH would use this)...they have been key injuries....esp petrov.

In all the league games we have played and lost in which i have seen virtually all either full games or highlights....i personally dont think we have been outclassed by anyone except utd and chelski.....yes we have not played at anywhere near the standard we can (ie pompey) but at boro, everon and others we have been equal to them and ended up losing in unlucky circumstances/bad ref decisions (penalty at bor was it????)....again all these things have made a difference.

This is why i believe we should give MH a chance.....give him time to get teh balance right and get hsome quality into key areas

 

[barney8]

infact the only players whow we have who id descirbe as top draw or certain prem quality are , Hart (even he has a lot to learn), Richards (though not at the moment), ireland, swp, robinho, elano and kompany (Not including the likes of Jonno petrov and maybe boj as they have not featured......the rest are average middle of the table players at best.

If I may remind you: we were fourth in the prem table by last christmas. And the squad then only contained six or seven of the players you have mentioned. No SWP, no Robinho, no Kompany.

The squad is good enough for at least top six.