Official Tactic Thread

[yarny101]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

Loving this hopefully it'll be like this all season

 

[Paladin]

Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

Good assessment and great graphics. Have you applied to go on Match of the Day?

 

[bluetoo]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

great op...didnt take into account spuds went 1 man down though

 

[ste.sully]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

Double playmakers is hardly anything new.

Barca have been doing it for years now with Xavi and Iniesta. Many would agree that Nasri and Silva are world class attacking midfielders too.

Mancini does appear to want to use Nasri and Silva in tandem and it definitely worked on Sunday.

 

[Franny Lee's Barrel Chest]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

I hope Roberto Martinez doesn't read this!

 

[DalbeyINUK]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

Mancini does appear to want to use Nasri and Silva in tandem and it definitely worked on Sunday.

We can only hope he continues on with that mindset. What's blatantly obvious is that ball possession is everything in the highest levels of football. Having two men on the field at the same time in midfield who almost never lose the ball gives us a tremendous edge over everyone else we play(excluding Barcelona).

Dang we're lucky.

 

[Moxley]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

I loved reading that. Cheers for posting it mate.

 

[persvenality cult]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

Great post. Please let this be an end to any talk about 4-2-3-1.

The current system has far more in common with the system used by the Arsenal 'Invincibles'. They played 4-4-2 with two wingers looking to cut in and make a front four. Henry was as often out wide as in the centre. Then you can imagine Barry as Petit, Yaya as Vieira. I'm sure we did something similar at points towards the end of last year.

At first I wasn't sure if it was correct to put Aguero as the leftmost of the two strikers, but then I remembered his goal, and some other movements. Pundits marvelled at his natural understanding of when to move out wide to compensate for Nasri moving in field. Generally, he still looks to be just a little off the pace but there is no question that he is doing a fantastic job of creating gaps for Dzeko to exploit.

But the reason I mention this is because against Bolton, Aguero was quite definitely playing on the right. Nasri's inclusion is one factor, but I think the other is down to the situation faced by the fullbacks. Clichy was the more restrained of the fullbacks in my eyes. Last week it had been Micah...

I don't really know how to quantify it, but my feeling is that the fullbacks are a bit more restrained in this system. There seem to be fewer moments when they run 30 yards with the ball. Instead they are spending more time making up the numbers in 'deep-midfield', and on occasion being fed in very advanced wide positions. Last year it was common for us to work the entire flank free and let our fullback attack from his own half all the way to the by-line. But (notably against Everton) the system was less succesful. With three narrow midfield players, and the wide player often central as well, it was sometimes easy for opponents to double up on our fullback. It's a problem we never quite resolved. So far, so good.

The real test will be when we face a strong, well balanced midfield. I imagine Everton will play a trio, Feillani, Cahill and another. Would you back Yaya and Barry against them? I certainly doubt they would run the show so effectively as in our last two games. I can't quite get Liverpool (A) out of my mind. Tiredness was a factor but...

Anyway. Perhaps because we had a full pre-season with no world cup, we look much quicker and lighter on our feet than last year. The play is slicker, the midfield more agile, the movement better, and of course the chances are flowing. Crucially, we are taking fewer touches.

I found Silva's interview to be enlightening. He talked about how much pressing there was in this league, and how this necessarily meant there was space in other areas. I think that's something important to understand. Last year we would move the opponents about effectively, but by spending too much time in a narrow, deep part of the pitch, they had the chance to recover. And when our big boys in midfield looked a bit of the pace, it was they who were being caught out of position. That's probably why we've moved to taking fewer touches. If you have the accuracy of passing and the movement sorted, it gives the opponent who is pressing no chance to recover to his true zone. So far, we do have it sorted. Barry and Yaya combine with the fullbacks to draw in the midfield, then accurately play Silva into space behind the pressing midfielders.

By way of contrast I think we will return to taking a few more touches when we play in the Champions League. Every English team (apart from Tottenham) has recognised the value of possession in these games. And the stricter refereeing means that aggressive pressing often results in nothing more than a foul.

I read something from Villas-Boas last week that made the point; Barcelona could never play the pure possession game succesfully under English referees. The referees would allow more fouls against them to go unpunished, meaning they would be losing the ball in dangerous areas.

To me, this is why England will never, ever win 'A Major Tournament'. We're the best in the world, but we've grown up playing a different sport. Change the refereeing and you'd change the players we produce, the mindset, tactical and technical ability. But there's zero danger of that happening whilst the Premier League provides such exhilaration.

 

[Mancio]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

Great post. Please let this be an end to any talk about 4-2-3-1.

The current system has far more in common with the system used by the Arsenal 'Invincibles'. They played 4-4-2 with two wingers looking to cut in and make a front four. Henry was as often out wide as in the centre. Then you can imagine Barry as Petit, Yaya as Vieira. I'm sure we did something similar at points towards the end of last year.

At first I wasn't sure if it was correct to put Aguero as the leftmost of the two strikers, but then I remembered his goal, and some other movements. Pundits marvelled at his natural understanding of when to move out wide to compensate for Nasri moving in field. Generally, he still looks to be just a little off the pace but there is no question that he is doing a fantastic job of creating gaps for Dzeko to exploit.

But the reason I mention this is because against Bolton, Aguero was quite definitely playing on the right. Nasri's inclusion is one factor, but I think the other is down to the situation faced by the fullbacks. Clichy was the more restrained of the fullbacks in my eyes. Last week it had been Micah...

I don't really know how to quantify it, but my feeling is that the fullbacks are a bit more restrained in this system. There seem to be fewer moments when they run 30 yards with the ball. Instead they are spending more time making up the numbers in 'deep-midfield', and on occasion being fed in very advanced wide positions. Last year it was common for us to work the entire flank free and let our fullback attack from his own half all the way to the by-line. But (notably against Everton) the system was less succesful. With three narrow midfield players, and the wide player often central as well, it was sometimes easy for opponents to double up on our fullback. It's a problem we never quite resolved. So far, so good.

The real test will be when we face a strong, well balanced midfield. I imagine Everton will play a trio, Feillani, Cahill and another. Would you back Yaya and Barry against them? I certainly doubt they would run the show so effectively as in our last two games. I can't quite get Liverpool (A) out of my mind. Tiredness was a factor but...

Anyway. Perhaps because we had a full pre-season with no world cup, we look much quicker and lighter on our feet than last year. The play is slicker, the midfield more agile, the movement better, and of course the chances are flowing. Crucially, we are taking fewer touches.

I found Silva's interview to be enlightening. He talked about how much pressing there was in this league, and how this necessarily meant there was space in other areas. I think that's something important to understand. Last year we would move the opponents about effectively, but by spending too much time in a narrow, deep part of the pitch, they had the chance to recover. And when our big boys in midfield looked a bit of the pace, it was they who were being caught out of position. That's probably why we've moved to taking fewer touches. If you have the accuracy of passing and the movement sorted, it gives the opponent who is pressing no chance to recover to his true zone. So far, we do have it sorted. Barry and Yaya combine with the fullbacks to draw in the midfield, then accurately play Silva into space behind the pressing midfielders.

By way of contrast I think we will return to taking a few more touches when we play in the Champions League. Every English team (apart from Tottenham) has recognised the value of possession in these games. And the stricter refereeing means that aggressive pressing often results in nothing more than a foul.

I read something from Villas-Boas last week that made the point; Barcelona could never play the pure possession game succesfully under English referees. The referees would allow more fouls against them to go unpunished, meaning they would be losing the ball in dangerous areas.

To me, this is why England will never, ever win 'A Major Tournament'. We're the best in the world, but we've grown up playing a different sport. Change the refereeing and you'd change the players we produce, the mindset, tactical and technical ability. But there's zero danger of that happening whilst the Premier League provides such exhilaration.

since when ?

 

[persvenality cult]

Re: Tactics vs Spurs - A tribute to Mancini

since when ?

It's supposed to be ironic.

We're 'the best in the world' in the same way that the Americans are 'the best in the world' at Baseball.