Pep Guardiola - 2023/24

[Kamaro011]

The state of this thread when we lose FFS

 

[Akira]

I will get hammered for saying it, I’m sure, and while last season creates a treasure trove of reasons why I will be called crazy, but I think Pep’s time at City has almost run its course and the lack of bringing in the talent we clearly needed during the off season to replace the level of quality of those who left is only exacerbating Pep’s weaknesses.

Jesus, it's one loss.

 

[M16 citeh]

Jesus, it's one loss.

And we're missing half our first team lol.

 

[Craig]

I don't think its that bad tbh. The main reason why we seem so predictable now is because well...our new style of play is a bit predictable. Over the weekend, I took some time out to watch some of our highlights from the early to mid pep era and something that really stood out was how the goal came from the most unpredictable build up (the 29 pass goal with Bernie being the goal scorer).

The false 9 style of play is when we play at our best and Pep might want to revert to that style of play, obviously haaland can't play across the Frontline and then fall into the AM position like Kun / GJ and to some extent Alvarez but he has to be a bit more fluid with his style of play.

Right now the immobile big target man thing is really predictable and his play while backing the defender isn't good enough (to be fair the only two very notable players to have perfected this are Drogba and Suarez, even a big guy like Ibra wasn't very good with playing with his back leaning on defenders)

The game against wolves showed a build up play where doku worked the play perfectly from the right, passed towards Alvarez with the hope that Haaland would make a run to pull the defenders and then create some space for Alvarez but Haaland broke the play down by controlling the ball instead of letting the pass get to Alvarez, you could clearly see the frustration in Doku and Alvarez when this happened and it's not totally Haaland's fault as by default he believes we are playing the target man formation.

In the centurion and fourmidable seasons, our play was filled with dummy runs, fakes, wide movement and quick transition play, all of this led to an unpredictable style of play. Right now it seems very lethargic and overly elaborate.

I mentioned this yesterday and I'll say it again, Haaland is more powerful, younger and faster than Kane. Staying upfront all the time is a complete waste of his ability, if a slow player like Kane can perfect the CF/AM link up play then I see no reason why Haaland shouldn't adapt his game to that style of play, no need going wide but he should drop in a little bit deeper sometimes to help with the link up play similar to Son / Kane / Benzema.

Notice most of the time these players score from the edge of the box when they drift outside the box giving the wide player the chance to get the ball, run at the defenders and while the defenders are runnint back to protect the post, they free up the target man and all the winger has to do is pull the ball back for the target man to strike

All the players you mention dropping deeper are far more naturally gifted than Haaland with the ball at their feet.

 

[supercity88]

You can't do much when you've got Stones, De Bruyne and Bernardo injured and Rodri is suspended. The loss at Newcastle no one is too bothered about. The loss at Wolves was a case of too many players not stepping up. I was hoping the loss to Newcastle would be a bit of a rocket, but too many weren't at the races.

The starting 11 still had plenty of players who were a key part of our treble and should have done better. Whilst Kovacic and Nunes had bad games, they're still settling in and neither is Rodri so it's understandable. But Foden and Ake should have dealt with Neto. Trip him up, barge him off the ball - just do more to stop him in his own half. And then on the ball it was so pedestrian and predictable. Alvarez scores a stunner to get us level and we just do the same thing again by chasing the ball rather than defending as a unit. Hwang shouldn't have been on the pitch, but we still should have been winning that game from that position.

We go to Arsenal, without Rodri and Pep needs to work out how best to set the side up. We need to have the right balance as we're looking really poor in transition. Belgrade had loads of chances on the break. West Ham scored easily from a counter and Wolves did for us twice, and always looked dangerous too.

Arsenal look to play the triangles out wide to Saka and back into Odegaard. They're very good on the counter so we're going to have to look to play a more compact game and maybe decide to counter them instead. Pep has a job on his hands.

 

[Gaylord du Bois]

I will get hammered for saying it, I’m sure, and while last season creates a treasure trove of reasons why I will be called crazy, but I think Pep’s time at City has almost run its course and the lack of bringing in the talent we clearly needed during the off season to replace the level of quality of those who left is only exacerbating Pep’s weaknesses.

He NEEDS the best players in the world to play his “full pitch Rondo” style and, as we have seen with Phillips, if you don’t have that in such a key position, then the whole system suffers.

We also saw it with Dias bringing the ball out from the back and pinging it forward to Alvarez and Haaland, who rarely made the ball stick because the pass was errant or they were under too much pressure to accept the pinged pass.

Lastly, I think some people still don’t understand just how technically gifted a player has to be to play in a Pep team, and when there are decrements in that area, either acutely in one game or chronically over a sustained period, then the player sticks out like a sore thumb and the entire system suffers.

Accepting the ball under pressure, controlling it and accurately, and then passing it into a lane where the player receiving it wants to receive it…over an over and over again (600-700 times a game) is the second hardest thing in football after putting it in the net.

We are, often and perhaps (somewhat arrogantly) expectedly of late, a well oiled machine when the big names are playing and on their game. Over the last 4 hrs, though, not only have we not had the big names, but their understudies have illustrated just how good those big name stars are when trying to replicate the skill and precision required. That doesn’t bode well for the next 2 away games in which Draws might be seen as a good result, leaving City with no wins in 4!

January and Summer 24 are going to be massive transfer windows for City. We have aging stars, stars at their peak and potential stars who need to show more than just their potential.

Without a very deliberate reorganization of who, what and where…which I feel went off the rails this summer and has left us with too many stop-gaps…we may very well fall back into the Top Six pack looking to qualify for the Champions League.

There are teams being built right now to try to replicate our success. It only takes one or two to be fairly successful to create a little chaos at the top…and that’s with Chelsea and United still struggling!

With Pe supposedly only 1 more season from being done at City, the next 12-18 months are going to be a very interesting period, especially given this project was literally built on getting Ferran & Txiki to build the club that Pep would want to lead!

I know it is “hair on fire” stuff yo even suggest it after two bad games, but last season may have been “Peak Man City” for my lifetime, which has included watching the club in person for about 55 years and hopefully another 20 or so!

We are a “defend with a 5-4-1 and break out on the counter” opponent for far too many clubs for us not to have an answer to that by now, but I fear that when “lesser” teams use this tactic against us so successfully, it becomes the norm, yet we haven’t found the answer against far too many of them!

Success has bred these opponents, but it is too productive (1 shot on target and we lose 2-1) to NOT use it!

I’m certainly not a “Pep out!” idiot, but I’m starting to become a little bit of a “WTF Pep?!” at some of what I’m seeing.

 

[JOGAMIGMOG]

Jesus, it's one loss.

This is nowt compared to last season when, in mid-season, we had people saying they were quitting City, football and Bluemoon! We went on of course to have the greatest and likely to be unequalled season in the club’s entire history! Lol. :-)

 

[ChicagoBlue]

Jesus, it's one loss.

It’s not about one loss.

 

[ChicagoBlue]

It’s funny to watch a relatively thoughtful post (I thought) be given such short shrift by the happy clapper crowd.

I already gave all the caveats (not about 1 game, I recognize the injuries, but it’s a few and not nearly as many as some). At times, like the first 30 mins against Forest, we have been unplayable and exquisite, but too often, against too many bang average teams, we allow them to sit back and counter against us and, if you are being honest, I think the vast majority of you know we look suspect against the counter.

And, stats like “1 shot, 2 goals, lose 2-1” emphasize that!

We played a team of internationals against Wolves and yet looked devoid of answers to their parking the bus, and scared shitless of their counter. Wolves. FFS.

It was the same against Forest. Rodri gets sent off and, as if no-one ever thought it was possible to play 10 vs 11, we looked lost and we’re all over the place, with 5 subs needed and a healthy dose of good fortune…and we’re already winning 2-0!

It’s not rocket science when you get a player sent off. You lose an attacker and fill the hole with a sub. You’d have thought we were trying to reinvent the wheel while traveling at motorway speed over cobbles!

We have spent a gazillionaire duos on defenders only to be under the cosh every time there’s a break or we lose a man.

In addition, going forward, we have a Ballon D’Or quality centre forward who lit up the world last season and we seem incapable of providing him the ball in the areas where he is world class.

We are SO FAR off the boil, it required some thinking and looking at our set up this season, I see repetition, a lack of invention, and I think almost every City fan watching the games knows where the next pass is going 95% of the time.

I LOVE watching City when we are in full glow, moving the ball quickly into dangerous areas, but it is literally as boring as other fans say it is to watch us just passing the ball 5 and 6 yards, backwards and sideways, for long stretches of the game, while the other team shuffles around their 5-4-1 from side to side.

There has been almost nothing new or incentive injected into the team this season., with the possible exception of Doku taking on his full back and actually getting a cross in of having a crack…and even that has been underwhelming. I won’t mention the term “young Raheem Sterling” YET, but…

And, lest there be any doubt, I think the players we brought in are quality, but we buy players based on being impressed by how they played for their team, then (in some cases) we try to stifle their natural talent and force them to fit into our “take the ball, pass the ball (back)” game of keep away.

We look stale, tired, predictable and devoid of new ideas. That comes from the top.

Now, carry on moaning about how it’s just one loss, even though it’s two with two massive games coming tonight and on the weekend.

Rodri should certainly help tonight and a draw at Leipzig isn’t a bad result, with Young Boys H & A coming up, but no win tonight is 0 in 3, with Arsenal (A) and the media pressure will get cranked up to 11.

I am reading City fans cheering the Saka might have a hamstring and not play. Seriously? That’s what it takes to feel like we have a chance at The Arse?

Anyway, COME ON CITY!

 

[super_city_si]

It’s funny to watch a relatively thoughtful post (I thought) be given such short shrift by the happy clapper crowd.

I already gave all the caveats (not about 1 game, I recognize the injuries, but it’s a few and not nearly as many as some). At times, like the first 30 mins against Forest, we have been unplayable and exquisite, but too often, against too many bang average teams, we allow them to sit back and counter against us and, if you are being honest, I think the vast majority of you know we look suspect against the counter.

And, stats like “1 shot, 2 goals, lose 2-1” emphasize that!

We played a team of internationals against Wolves and yet looked devoid of answers to their parking the bus, and scared shitless of their counter. Wolves. FFS.

It was the same against Forest. Rodri gets sent off and, as if no-one ever thought it was possible to play 10 vs 11, we looked lost and we’re all over the place, with 5 subs needed and a healthy dose of good fortune…and we’re already winning 2-0!

It’s not rocket science when you get a player sent off. You lose an attacker and fill the hole with a sub. You’d have thought we were trying to reinvent the wheel while traveling at motorway speed over cobbles!

We have spent a gazillionaire duos on defenders only to be under the cosh every time there’s a break or we lose a man.

In addition, going forward, we have a Ballon D’Or quality centre forward who lit up the world last season and we seem incapable of providing him the ball in the areas where he is world class.

We are SO FAR off the boil, it required some thinking and looking at our set up this season, I see repetition, a lack of invention, and I think almost every City fan watching the games knows where the next pass is going 95% of the time.

I LOVE watching City when we are in full glow, moving the ball quickly into dangerous areas, but it is literally as boring as other fans say it is to watch us just passing the ball 5 and 6 yards, backwards and sideways, for long stretches of the game, while the other team shuffles around their 5-4-1 from side to side.

There has been almost nothing new or incentive injected into the team this season., with the possible exception of Doku taking on his full back and actually getting a cross in of having a crack…and even that has been underwhelming. I won’t mention the term “young Raheem Sterling” YET, but…

And, lest there be any doubt, I think the players we brought in are quality, but we buy players based on being impressed by how they played for their team, then (in some cases) we try to stifle their natural talent and force them to fit into our “take the ball, pass the ball (back)” game of keep away.

We look stale, tired, predictable and devoid of new ideas. That comes from the top.

Now, carry on moaning about how it’s just one loss, even though it’s two with two massive games coming tonight and on the weekend.

Rodri should certainly help tonight and a draw at Leipzig isn’t a bad result, with Young Boys H & A coming up, but no win tonight is 0 in 3, with Arsenal (A) and the media pressure will get cranked up to 11.

I am reading City fans cheering the Saka might have a hamstring and not play. Seriously? That’s what it takes to feel like we have a chance at The Arse?

Anyway, COME ON CITY!

Its no different to last season or the season before or the season before that. Everton at home. Brentford at home. Plenty of other games we have looked susceptible to the counter. We are never on it all season, we peak by design.

This season is playing out like all the rest so far. I think we're doing better than expected considering 4 of our most important players are missing for 3 games and 3 of them have been out for longer. Add to that Gundogan is gone who was another incredibly important player on and off the pitch.

And if we dont win the league, then thats how it goes sometimes. We have injuries to key players and a season of transition. No one I would trust more than Pep to guide us through it.