Peter Drury replaces Martin Tyler on Sky Sports

Prestwich_Blue said:
There were probably people who travelled without tickets. People used to slip the turnstile operator a few quid and, on a terrace, a few extra wouldn't matter. But the evidence is clear that stories of a huge number of ticketless fans rushing the gates is a myth. People really need to stop coming out with this.

CCTV evidence can't detect whether people had tickets or not but the consensus was that the number of people in that Leppings Lane terrace was broadly consistent with the number of tickets sold. And even if 100 got i. without tickets, that wouldn't have made a difference had the plan been followed to close the central pens off when they were visibly full.

And even if large numbers had travelled without tickets, the previous operational plan, which Duckenfield completely ignored, called for ticket checks at points along Leppings Lane to ensure only fans with tickets got to the gates. Had he followed his predecessor's well-established plan, no ticketless fans could have got through.
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The ticketless fan thing is actually something I think the enquiries have wrong and have wrong because they didn't want to offend any long suffering families further after all this time. They want to draw a line under it and understood the families would not stop until they were absolved of the horrific acts the Sun mentioned.

But just look at every semi-final back then. Every big match back then. All were way over capacity because of fans jumping the turnstiles. Hillsborough wasn't a one-off, it's just that police mistakes made it even worse.

Nobody, no enquiry report, will ever convince me that Liverpool - the most successful side in the cou try back then - with some of the biggest followings, didn't have any fans trying to get in without tickets. Every team did it. We probably did it in 81 and I'm sure would have done at Hillsborough if we were any good back then.
 
Stephen230 said:
I suspect if I had a child that had been unlawfully killed and nobody had ever been held accountable, I might well have a bee in my bonnet for the rest of my life. If anything I’d think it “bizarre” if you didn’t, in that situation.
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No one is disputing the families and friends and fanbase still have answers to be given to them and people who are still unpunished be questioned.

It is why are some city or any other none scouse fans always obsessing about it, let it go, leave them to it.

It gets quite boring anytime a discussion about a game against them turns into a 20 page conversraion about hilsborough, and the same this tyler thing should have been forgotten as soon as he was on comms last night.

I have plenty of reasons to think they are cunts, don't need to use a tragedy we should all have empathy about.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Try this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-35462767

"The inquest jury blamed police failures before and on the day of the tragedy. It noted that a road closure in the area had exacerbated the situation. No contingency plans were made for the sudden arrival of a large number of fans and attempts to close the stadium's perimeter gates, before fans reached the turnstiles, were made too late."
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From the BBC??? surely not, try the actual report there's nothing on it
 
How dare Martyn Tyler associate fans who killed 39 people in hysel, smash up teams buses and think its ok to turn up to games without tickets in their hoards, with Holliganism. How on earth could he have reached that conclusion. Shameful! glad he's apolgised. We wouldn't want the scousers to feel like victims would we?
 
Stephen230 said:
I suspect if I had a child that had been unlawfully killed and nobody had ever been held accountable, I might well have a bee in my bonnet for the rest of my life. If anything I’d think it “bizarre” if you didn’t, in that situation.
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Did you have a child unlawfully killed?

If not, it seems a weird debating angle.
 
You can all talk about Hillsborough till cows come home, Liverpool fans can now and forever declare it wasn't their fault. You should be talking about Heysel, but thats been well and truly swept under the carpet.
 
mattcity5 said:
The ticketless fan thing is actually something I think the enquiries have wrong and have wrong because they didn't want to offend any long suffering families further after all this time. They want to draw a line under it and understood the families would not stop until they were absolved of the horrific acts the Sun mentioned.

But just look at every semi-final back then. Every big match back then. All were way over capacity because of fans jumping the turnstiles. Hillsborough wasn't a one-off, it's just that police mistakes made it even worse.

Nobody, no enquiry report, will ever convince me that Liverpool - the most successful side in the cou try back then - with some of the biggest followings, didn't have any fans trying to get in without tickets. Every team did it. We probably did it in 81 and I'm sure would have done at Hillsborough if we were any good back then.
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The Everton replay in 81 ...
 
Stephen230 said:
It’s weird to debate anything that you weren’t personally directly involved in?
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It’s weird to debate something that happened 35 years ago, was covered up, then found out that it was covered up and the inquest finished resulting in the unlawful deaths being uncovered.

There isn’t much left to debate.
 
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