PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

[waspish]

Funnily this point about the rules at the time came up on Twitter today

The rule before 21/22 was very different

Bet since the PSR came in it's been tweaked around 10 times just to try slow us down

 

[Mancity1980]

BOP.

Basically it’s more likely the allegation happened than it didn’t.

I would also suggest that even if BOP is satisfied, there may well be significant mitigation as to why a breach happened.

Such as?

 

[Gone for a Burton]

I doubt if the panel consider the public reaction for more than 20 seconds.

19 seconds longer than I thought.

Justice will be done & be seen to be done.....

"Once & for all" !!

 

[Mancity1980]

Given the severity of the charges, and the potential penalties,I would say beyond reasonable doubt.
The charges are effectively saying we have committed fraud along with the auditors and several CEOs of global companies.

@Prestwich_Blue says it is civil. If follow-up criminal charges were issued after a judgement in the PL favour then I think it would be beyond reasonable doubt. Is that right Prestwich?

 

[Ysabel 123]

I remember watching this when I was 14 (I think) and it has always stuck with me as a repudiation of anyone who believes anything absolutely. The whole episode is very emotional, but this bit I have never forgotten:

"This is the concentration camp and crematorium at Auschwitz. This is where people were turned into numbers. Into this pond were flushed the ashes of some four million people. And that was not done by gas. It was done by arrogance. It was done by dogma. It was done by ignorance. When people believe that they have absolute knowledge, with no test in reality, this is how they behave."

And he followed up with the Cromwell quote: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ. Think it possible you may be mistaken."

Not equating the holocaust with what the club and its fans are going through, obviously (he was comparing what happened in the concentration camps to the notion that science and the scientific process dehumanises people and turns them into numbers). In our case, though, the press shoulders most of the blame for perpetuating the arrogance, dogma and ignorance that is prevalent around the "115" "charges" and it is a damning indictment of their lack of morality and humanity.

Scousers are weird ****'s!

 

[Ysabel 123]

What a thick ****. Next…

Ok - link is below...................

Please ensure that you have strong nerve and some bleach available - as a sampler:

MH41​

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Re: 115 charges for the scorched earth cheating bastards on & off the pitch​

« Reply #8026 on: Today at 11:04:02 am »

- Stripped of all trophies won during the period.
- expelled from the PL
- relegated to league 2
- unable to be promoted to the PL for 10 years regardless of their results.
- a 10 year ban on any incoming signings
- clubs to be financially reimbursed for financial losses.
- supporters of all clubs to receive a backdated award of money, to go out and celebrate the trophies they were cheated out of. £500 per trophy.
- no games shown live on TV. And all games to be 12.30 kick offs.
- no entry into the FA cup or League cup.
- to return the stadium they were 'gifted'.

That should do for starters.

115 charges for the scorched earth cheating bastards on & off the pitch

115 charges for the scorched earth cheating bastards on & off the pitch

www.redandwhitekop.com

It's a good job we didn't kill 39 Italian Inter fans in Istanbul! Imagine what he would want our punishment to be then!

 

[hertsblue]

Hope the club has looked into the PL deals with the Rags which have been been hush hush. 1st they relaxed the rules they brought in on UEFA FFP rules the other year and allowed the Rags to increase their wage ratio at a time they had lots of senior players contracts up for renewals and also spent big in the transfer window, which went very quietly below the radar and not picked up by any media of course, and more recently the outrageous covid claims to allow them to pass PSR, again no media reporting it so fans of other clubs totally unaware of it i bet

 

[BamberBridgeBlue]

@Prestwich_Blue says it is civil. If follow-up criminal charges were issued after a judgement in the PL favour then I think it would be beyond reasonable doubt. Is that right Prestwich?

I understood it that way too. I can’t imagine the Police or HMRC sitting back whilst The Premier League get their shit together for the rule breach hearing before getting involved themselves. If they had any evidence of SERIOUS wrongdoing then surely there’d be pictures of uniformed officers or officials seizing documents or computers.

My guess is we’ll either be found not to have breached any rules or maybe breach of minor rules that have in the past resulted in fines for the likes of the rags of £100k or so.

 

[Ysabel 123]

Not a chance. Our media department bends over backwards for these bastards.

I know a solicitor that worked for City and when I asked why journalists and organisations weren't being sued or banned he said it's because our media department are friends with them all.

Not to keep the enemy close either.

Think they have a genuine belief that one day we might be praised the way the red shirts are.

If we bend over backward for them, why have we only made one brief statement since the charges were made, surely if we bent over backward for them, they would be allowed to ask Pep about it in press conferences.

How would a Solicitor know what relationship the Club have with the press, more so why would he risk his job by telling his mate?

 

[hammocity]

My feelings on this are exactly the same as they were before the latest round of media hit job pieces in the Athletic by the buck toothed rag and other outlets.

1. Etihad
I believe they have nothing but the emails and all of those (including the full run, so some not used by UEFA referred to by "Magic Twat" on X as some kind of silver bullet) are insufficient on their own to prove the actual conduct they partly infer took place. City and Etihad Bank statements, accounts and documents with additional testimony from senior management involved in the transactions of both parties, acting as rebuttal evidence, sufficiently prove the monies came from Etihad central funds and ADEC - NOT ADUG.
54 of the charges fail if the PL cannot prove this.

2. Etisalat
The subject of Piers Morgans' wet dream youtube programme and supposed mystery man and the loaned 30 million is a red herring. The monies are properly accounted for in everyone's expense and receivables (incoming and outgoing accounts) as a loan from an intermediary as a method of up front sponsorship payment when only pre contract agreements were in place. In any event without proof of fraud these will AGAIN be outside any limitation period. This time by the 6 year limitation applied by UK law, not 5 year UEFA rule.

3. Aabar / AD Tourist Board
Prior to the 2014 UEFA NDA sanction agreement (the pinch) these 2nd tier two sponsorships were alleged by UEFA to be above FMV. i believe also alleged by UEFA to be related parties. Whilst City are on record dissenting those UEFA opinions the sponsorship values were adjusted down and accepted going forward. Nothing to see here and no indication the PL are interested in either sponsorship value.

4. Fordham Ltd (image rights)
A temporary company vehicle created to generate approx 25 million income by the centralisation and purchase of player image rights from City when we desperately needed supplementary revenue. Like selling a hotel to yourself, it was creative accounting to generate income. There was no skullduggary it was a loophole we used to boost the coffers so as not to fail the 3 year deficit allowance. It was shut down subsequently and image rights given / sold back to club or players. HMRC seemed happy it wasn't used to evade tax as was the case at other clubs, so again, seemingly nothing to see here.

5. Mancini / Toure - remuneration
The PL have to prove that City did not declare the money paid to Mancini, 1.75 mill per annum, by the Abu Dhabi football club Al Jazeera Sports Cultural Club through Sparkleglow Ltd (a Mancini owned company) arranged by ADUG was part of his City remuneration package. If there are separate employment contracts whose obligations are agreed and met by both parties it is difficult to see how it can be proved by the PL. There also seems some confusion as to if the PL are trying to a) include this remuneration money as part of the charge of "failing to submit accurate fincial information" for those years it was paid up to 2013. Clearly it would appear these annual amounts, if proven to be such as alleged, would likely be insufficient to create a "false financial picture" of the accounts on their own.
Or b) simply imply it was omitted from Mancinis full salary declarations by City which is a breach of a current rule in the PL handbook but unsure if it breaches such a rule, if proven, from 2011- 2013.
The inclusion of Toure seems somewhat of an anomaly here and I'm unsure where the link to him comes from the list of PL charges. It seems to come from the media in the wake of the allegations however not all media outlets include Toure in any overview of the charges. Where he does appear it seems a generic inclusion in accusations of image rights payments although his agent, Seluk, like Mancini, deny both any wrongdoing or that they have been approached by the PL for either a statement or comments.
The whole thing seems a stretch by the PL and considering the sums involved in comparison to the main charges a spaghetti against the wall overreach.

6. None co-operation
Due to the seriousness of these charges City have quite rightly argued every point of law where doubt has arisen. For one, City appealed that the Independant Panel was not the appropriate venue for such serious matters to be decided. Although the courts have ruled against City in most, if not all our appeals, City have clearly laid a marker that they will not take any adverse decision lightly. However no appeal for court decisions can be deemed to be none co-operation. There are other Internet myths propagated by the likes of Simon Jordan that City appealed the inclusion of Murray Rosen on the panel as he is an Arsenal supporter and Season Ticket holder. Made all the more ridiculous by the fact that Citys primary advocate KC, Lord Pannick is also an Arsenal fan and supporter.
City say they have co-operated by the sheer volume of material supplied to the PL that rebutts their allegations but the details of alleged none co-operation by the PL are not listed and each (35 at least) will be argued out in front of the panel and it will be for them to decide such matters.
In any event if in some matters City have been none co-operative it will have been on legal advice for good reason and we would have to face the financial penalty for so doing. There is no sporting advantage from such breaches therefore no sporting sanction (points reduction etc) can be attributed to those charges.

So in summing up I am unmoved from my original position which I took some time ago that I am confident that the serious charges are unlikely to be proven and the other matters seem wishy washy at best. We'll all have to wait and see.
I believe our Chairman and Chief Exec when they say we've done nothing wrong.

If we come out of this relatively unscathed as I suspect, I want some fucking heads on sticks, starting with that **** Masters.
We should be relentless in going after media wankers who want to continue the no smoke without fire narrative. I'd like to see us make an example of a gobshite like Collymore or Aldridge even Goldbridge (yes you Brent) who can't keep their traps shut and think they are beyond reach.
This whole fiasco has been a media witchunt, an enormous smear campaign against the club and its fans over 10 years. Let's not get mad, let's get even!

Brilliant read and have sent to our Blues non official supporters club but I can assure you most will love this, post of the year (so far)

:-).