Political relations between UK-EU

[BobKowalski]

The People's Republic of Kent - who'd have thought it would come to this

Hundreds of British lorry drivers fined £300 for not having permit to drive through Kent

Police said officers handed out a total of 407 penalties over the new permits.

uk.news.yahoo.com

Not just British drivers:

‘Polish trucking magazine http://40ton.net reports:

A Polish truck driver entered Kent on Monday with valid Kent permit. He turned up at Ashford when they told him that his documents need to be double-checked, so he was sent to a different truck park to wait.

On Wednesday (!) he was informed his paperwork got a green light and told to come back to Ashford custom place only to find that custom truck park is full. He was told to park on yet another truck park which serves the queue.

There, the police come and fined him 300 pounds because his Kent access permit has by this time expired. So apparently the document called "kent access permit" needs to be renamed to "Kent accessing and then sitting for days, waiting for the paperwork permit"’

Final, shot.

 

[west didsblue]

No, it isn’t just about trade, it’s also geopolitical, influencing Europe in the direction you want it to go as Thatcher and Cockfield did with the Single Market and expansion into Eastern Europe.

Our exclusion from the heart of Europe came with the establishment of the Euro, a development which was similar to the establishment of the original common market. We declined the opportunity to get involved in the beginning, then joined when it was clear we were being left behind.

The Euro was another major development which again we shunned on similar grounds, ‘we didn’t need it, it won’t work’. Now we are left on the sidelines, while trade and influence reconfigures around us. Dublin has more influence in Europe than we do, doubly so when you consider the next US administration.

You’ve put the Euro in both the second and third paragraphs. I’m guessing you mean something different in one of them?

 

[BobKowalski]

You’ve put the Euro in both the second and third paragraphs. I’m guessing you mean something different in one of them?

Sort of, it’s badly worded.

We missed two major developments. 1) Shunning the formation of the early common market in the fifties, which led to us getting left behind in Europe. 2) Shunning the Euro in 1999 when all the big players jumped in, again this led to us being on the outside of a big change, because decisions on the Eurozone did not include us, and led to the sense we no longer were the main players in the EU.

Now, we are totally on the outside and arguably in a worse position than in the sixties when we felt we were being disadvantaged economically by not being in the EEC. Then we had EFTA, but now we don’t even have that.

The new deal, the TCA, is shockingly bad, worse than I imagined and while we can mitigate some of the issues with time, better management and resources, the non tariff barriers are horrendous, it’s just going to be a huge drag on the economy and trade. Two weeks in and I can’t see the TCA being sustainable, trouble is, its all we’ve got.

 

[west didsblue]

Sort of, it’s badly worded.

We missed two major developments. 1) Shunning the formation of the early common market in the fifties, which led to us getting left behind in Europe. 2) Shunning the Euro in 1999 when all the big players jumped in, again this led to us being on the outside of a big change, because decisions on the Eurozone did not include us, and led to the sense we no longer were the main players in the EU.

Now, we are totally on the outside and arguably in a worse position than in the sixties when we felt we were being disadvantaged economically by not being in the EEC. Then we had EFTA, but now we don’t even have that.

The new deal, the TCA, is shockingly bad, worse than I imagined and while we can mitigate some of the issues with time, better management and resources, the non tariff barriers are horrendous, it’s just going to be a huge drag on the economy and trade. Two weeks in and I can’t see the TCA being sustainable, trouble is, its all we’ve got.

To be fair, I thought it was De Gaulle who didn’t want us in the 1950s and made sure we couldn’t join.

 

[BobKowalski]

To be fair, I thought it was De Gaulle who didn’t want us in the 1950s and made sure we couldn’t join.

No, we dismissed the idea as ‘bound to fail’ and to a degree ‘beneath us‘ in the fifties.

In the sixties, we realised that not being in the EEC economically disadvantaged us and applied for membership which De Gaulle nixed.

In 2021, being outside the EU is a huge economic disadvantage, and we still haven’t grasped what it means to be outside the Single Market. We laugh about people getting their ham sandwiches confiscated, but in reality there are thousands of these little rules, small pinpricks that add up.

We haven’t even began applying our trade border yet, currently everything is getting waved through, but that can’t last. French and British jobsworths on both sides stopping trade through lack of the right paperwork or the right paperwork with a box not ticked.

It‘s going to be a shitshow.

 

[mcfc1632]

No, it isn’t just about trade, it’s also geopolitical, influencing Europe in the direction you want it to go as Thatcher and Cockfield did with the Single Market and expansion into Eastern Europe.

Our exclusion from the heart of Europe came with the establishment of the Euro, a development which was similar to the establishment of the original common market. We declined the opportunity to get involved in the beginning, then joined when it was clear we were being left behind.

The Euro was another major development which again we shunned on similar grounds, ‘we didn’t need it, it won’t work’. Now we are left on the sidelines, while trade and influence reconfigures around us. Dublin has more influence in Europe than we do, doubly so when you consider the next US administration.

Fuck - I read some of the stuff you post and think....

Thank fuck 23/06/16 happened

FFS - regretting not joining the Euro - LOL - that's at least you and Blair

 

[BobKowalski]

Foster of the FT on the haulier situation, partly referencing the Polish complaints.

‘It’s all pretty miserable. Trucking firm boss to me just now: “It’s a bloody mess...1 step forward, 7 back.. staff at breaking point, customers losing their minds, drowning in red tape...”

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

To be fair, I thought it was De Gaulle who didn’t want us in the 1950s and made sure we couldn’t join.

The gall of those French.

 

[bluethrunthru]

No, we dismissed the idea as ‘bound to fail’ and to a degree ‘beneath us‘ in the fifties.

In the sixties, we realised that not being in the EEC economically disadvantaged us and applied for membership which De Gaulle nixed.

In 2021, being outside the EU is a huge economic disadvantage, and we still haven’t grasped what it means to be outside the Single Market. We laugh about people getting their ham sandwiches confiscated, but in reality there are thousands of these little rules, small pinpricks that add up.

We haven’t even began applying our trade border yet, currently everything is getting waved through, but that can’t last. French and British jobsworths on both sides stopping trade through lack of the right paperwork or the right paperwork with a box not ticked.

It‘s going to be a shitshow.

we will just end up isolated - Irish trucks will board ferries that go direct to the EU cutting out the UK land bridge. Truck drivers from here will be reluctant to take work that involves taking goods for export to the EU. EU truck drivers won't want to come to the UK because of all the problems - that, in a nutshell, is reduced economic activity in the UK, a diminishing of our GDP and a huge reduction in manufacturing, agriculture and fishing. Meanwhile the City will begin to leech work, profit and important tax revenue to the EU.

 

[Vic]

Foster of the FT on the haulier situation, partly referencing the Polish complaints.

‘It’s all pretty miserable. Trucking firm boss to me just now: “It’s a bloody mess...1 step forward, 7 back.. staff at breaking point, customers losing their minds, drowning in red tape...”

Polish drivers driving British lorries. They'll go back to live in Poland, then if the problems ever get sorted British hauliers will be short of drivers.