Political relations between UK-EU

[Vic]

Or - the more likely scenario......

......after 3 years of a Remainer led UK government acquiescing to all EU demands to be placed in the WA and PD - in late 2019, the first opportunity for a pro-Brexit UK government to make a decision came around.

They had to make a judgement based on what was left behind by the utterly ruinous negotiations undertaken previously by the slavishly subservient Remainer government, with the options being....

1. Sign the existing WA and commit to implementing the PD

2. Scrap the currently available deal and start negotiations afresh - resulting in losing many months - probably years of the 5 years available to make an impact before the next GE

3. Act to take out the most ruinous element of the WA - the unfettered backstop - get the UK the fuck out and then jettison the pathetic PD. Use the period of the transition to face down the EU in a number of other areas bu avoid at all costs any further extensions

There is a lot that the UK electorate must hold the Remainer led government of 2016-2019 accountable for - like they did in December 2019

1. Isn't that the oven-ready deal Liar Johnson went to the country with?
2. The future of the UK less important than the Tories' future electoral prospects.
3. The backstop was long gone. So instead of an over-ready deal, Johnson goes to the country on a manifesto of "we will throw out the deal we've got and in the year left until we leave we will start arguing with the EU over stuff already agreed".

I really am finding it hard to believe you ever made a living advising government ministers on anything.

 

[Vic]

Yes apologies, agreed that was in the opening part but not defined in the articles itself which I assume is what forms the legal framework of the agreement? It would have been useful if someone had said “erm, what does that mean exactly”!! They’d only have needed to run it past “off topic” and we’d have sorted it for them.

Your last sentence is key to my original point. As the MT was required to make the EU what is it today we can reasonably assume the RT in itself wasn’t sufficient at least form a strong legal perspective even if some ambiguity like this existed.

And Cameron got a UK exemption from whatever it meant... You wouldn't have known that from the dismissive tone of the high priests of Brexit (in the media and in his own party).

 

[Vic]

At least as much as you I would suggest

But........

I seem to also have a far better understanding of what the causes are and what could have been done to mitigate the issues - and where the responsibility lies

Causes, mitigate, responsibility....

You really do think it's going to be a shitstorm, don't you?

 

[west didsblue]

1. Isn't that the oven-ready deal Liar Johnson went to the country with?
2. The future of the UK less important than the Tories' future electoral prospects.
3. The backstiop was long gone. So instead of an over-ready deal, Johnson goes to the country on a manifesto of "we will throw out the deal we've got and in the year left till we leave we will start arguing with the EU over stuff already agreed".

I really am finding it hard to believe you ever made a living advising government ministers on anything.

I find it very easy to believe he made a living advising government ministers. Look at the shambolic state we're in.

 

[Vic]

You are simply repeating a nonsense question with:

"Question then: will the benefit of a bit more trade with the Pacific outweigh the loss of trade with the EU?"

It is not a issue of comparing 2 blocs and deciding between them - that is just the narrative/discussion that you want to make it

Try and read and digest

Maybe I'm wrong. That sounds like you have advised ministers on how to avoid simple but awkward questions. Say it's the wrong question.

 

[blueparrot]

It's great news that London's trade in European equities is now only down 80% rather than 100%.

And the fish are still happily swimming around in the knowledge there's no market for them so they don't have to worry about being caught.

All good.

Maybe the thousands of stepd backwards were a plan, so they can get credited with every tiny step forward back towards where we were. Then by the time of the election they can claim credit for the steps forward and hope people gave forgotten where they made us start from.
Bit like Rangers when they were sent to the bottom division and celebrating each step then years later getting back to near where they were. Then giving credit to the directors that caused the demotion.

 

[Vic]

Maybe the thousands of stepd backwards were a plan, so they can get credited with every tiny step forward back towards where we were. Then by the time of the election they can claim credit for the steps forward and hope people gave forgotten where they made us start from.
Bit like Rangers when they were sent to the bottom division and celebrating each step then years later getting back to near where they were. Then giving credit to the directors that caused the demotion.

Bit like the Poll Tax.

Save the rich millions on rates on their several homes, then take credit for a replacement tax that still leaves the rich with big houses millions better off, every year. No bedroom tax for them - just vastly reduced tax on any number of rooms.

 

[Metal Biker]

Maybe the thousands of stepd backwards were a plan, so they can get credited with every tiny step forward back towards where we were. Then by the time of the election they can claim credit for the steps forward and hope people gave forgotten where they made us start from.
Bit like Rangers when they were sent to the bottom division and celebrating each step then years later getting back to near where they were. Then giving credit to the directors that caused the demotion.

That would make sense, except the cataclysm that was predicted hasn't actually transpired yet.

Let us know when it does. We've left a political union, turning it into a trade-only relationship. We're reconnecting with the world and so far, aside from a few butthurt EU flag wavers, nothing has happened that has caused any concern (aside from the EU showing it has no chill about the Ireland/N.Ireland situation obvs)

 

[metalblue]

And Cameron got a UK exemption from whatever it meant... You wouldn't have known that from the dismissive tone of the high priests of Brexit (in the media and in his own party).

For me the reasons are simpler - “remain” lost because it got dragged into a debate with leave on how much the EU cost the UK at the outset. The EU costs £500000bn a year they scream, no it only costs £30000bn net they reply (numbers made up to protect the innocent) - they should never have got dragged there in the first place instead from the outset explaining what we got for the money - as it was the damage was done and all people would remember was it cost us money. My car costs money but I get benefit from that expense and that is how I justify continuing to own it (well I would get benefit if I was allowed out of my front door).

So remain lost because of its own incompetence in dictating the debate IMHO.

 

[west didsblue]

Maybe the thousands of stepd backwards were a plan, so they can get credited with every tiny step forward back towards where we were. Then by the time of the election they can claim credit for the steps forward and hope people gave forgotten where they made us start from.
Bit like Rangers when they were sent to the bottom division and celebrating each step then years later getting back to near where they were. Then giving credit to the directors that caused the demotion.

That’s a great analogy.
The UK is the Rangers of the EU. Bottom of the fourth tier with a shit FTA but trying to get back to having the benefits of being in the SPL. It would work a bit better if it was the Premier League but you know what I mean.