President Joe Biden

[Bigga]

However you want to dress it up, Biden is the only alternative to Trump on the ticket, and the way I read it is that you'd rather have another 4 years or more of Trump than ever vote for Biden?

I don't need to go into the reasons why Trump is bad on the Biden thread; we all know why.

With Biden then you will be almost guaranteed a period of stability and calm (dependent on just how much more sh*t Trump can kick up if/when he loses the election). It's obviously going to take time to decompress post Trump, and then Biden can start to pick off the issues created or amplified by the last 4 years of the GOP/Trump dumpster fire.

ONCE ELECTED, and with the right messaging, Biden could potentially pave the way for a more 'progressive' ticket in 2024, but that is never going to be easy in a country that is way too far down the road of big business funding politics (on both sides of the aisle). The only way to fix that is to have a root and branch shake up of political funding, and we'd be talking a generation before that mess can be untangled.

Biden need to get over the line first. If Trump is reelected, then there the Republic as we know it is under serious threat, and even the chance a progressive Gov't in the USA is gone, possibly forever.

I appreciate your reply in the area I'm talking about, but the main question should be 'how did it come to this?' and nobody seems to be arsed about that and it's a really important question not discussed.

Being slightly more 'progressive' than Obama does not make someone 'progressive' in ideology, just a little more 'progressive' than the last turkey.

More incrementalism in actuality.

"More stability" just means less tweet storms, which is fine. As for decompression, it will take longer than the office of 4 years, so I can't really see how he's going implement his policy ideas being even more doddery. After all, Obama had to force the ACA in at the end of his tenure, so how's Biden going to do anything within the intended 4 years he aiming for?

And "... with the right messaging, Biden could potentially pave the way for a more 'progressive' ticket in 2024", well that's a non-starter, isn't it? If he intended that, no sorry, if the Est Dems intended that Harris wouldn't be on the ticket.

Not a chance.

Harris is a neolib in the same mould as Clinton and Obama. She has endorsed prisoners to fight fires like in Cali on previous occasions and wanted innocent prisoners to stay longer than their term beyond being found innocent! She flip flops her position depending on how big business reacts to her.

What progression can you see? This is just more of the same shit that will be revisited in four years.

Rinse and repeat until the bow breaks and people have had enough.

I saw it coming years ago and expressed as much through the same old well off clowns shouting me down and we're pretty close to that bow breaking now.

 

[SWP's back]

but the main question should be 'how did it come to this?'

No it shouldn’t. Absolutely fucking not. The only question right now is “how can we ensure Trump is defeated in November?”

There’s zero point in naval gazing before then.

And no amount of lies about the Trump and Biden policy platform will actually be true. They’re miles apart of virtually all the issues facing America today.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

I appreciate your reply in the area I'm talking about, but the main question should be 'how did it come to this?' and nobody seems to be arsed about that and it's a really important question not discussed.

Being slightly more 'progressive' than Obama does not make someone 'progressive' in ideology, just a little more 'progressive' than the last turkey.

More incrementalism in actuality.

"More stability" just means less tweet storms, which is fine. As for decompression, it will take longer than the office of 4 years, so I can't really see how he's going implement his policy ideas being even more doddery. After all, Obama had to force the ACA in at the end of his tenure, so how's Biden going to do anything within the intended 4 years he aiming for?

And "... with the right messaging, Biden could potentially pave the way for a more 'progressive' ticket in 2024", well that's a non-starter, isn't it? If he intended that, no sorry, if the Est Dems intended that Harris wouldn't be on the ticket.

Not a chance.

Harris is a neolib in the same mould as Clinton and Obama. She has endorsed prisoners to fight fires like in Cali on previous occasions and wanted innocent prisoners to stay longer than their term beyond being found innocent! She flip flops her position depending on how big business reacts to her.

What progression can you see? This is just more of the same shit that will be revisited in four years.

Rinse and repeat until the bow breaks and people have had enough.

I saw it coming years ago and expressed as much through the same old well off clowns shouting me down and we're pretty close to that bow breaking now.

Putting out the fires that Trump started IS progression at this point.

Bernie was never going to be electable against Trump, and all the other Democratic candidates, barring Biden did not have anywhere near enough backing. As the primaries progressed, it was clear that the ONLY electable Democratic candidate was Biden.

We are at the point now where the ONLY game in town is beating Trump. After that, let the chips fall where they will and pick up the pieces and rebuild from there. Otherwise, there is nothing left to rebuild.

 

[Bigga]

No it shouldn’t. Absolutely fucking not. The only question right now is “how can we ensure Trump is defeated in November?”

There’s zero point in naval gazing before then.

And no amount of lies about the Trump and Biden policy platform will actually be true. They’re miles apart of virtually all the issues facing America today.

Again, cos you don't see the overarching issues as to why similar politicians are chosen every 4 years that don't see the benefit of the working class civilian over profit.

Rinse. And. Repeat.

It's funny cos every 4 years someone says there's no point looking back on how things got to this position.

Rinse. And. Repeat.

I'm not going to pretend you understand the issue cos no matter how many times your slammed with this point, you refuse to see it.

Rinse. And. Repeat.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

Again, cos you don't see the overarching issues as to why similar politicians are chosen every 4 years that don't see the benefit of the working class civilian over profit.

Rinse. And. Repeat.

It's funny cos every 4 years someone says there's no point looking back on how things got to this position.

Rinse. And. Repeat.

I'm not going to pretend you understand the issue cos no matter how many times your slammed with this point, you refuse to see it.

Rinse. And. Repeat.

A progressive Democratic candidate is NEVER going to get elected against a Republican incumbent with the current electoral system. It will take a generation of incremental changes to the way politics is administered to sort this mess out. That has to feed in from the bottom, not the top.

 

[Bigga]

Putting out the fires that Trump started IS progression at this point.

Bernie was never going to be electable against Trump, and all the other Democratic candidates, barring Biden did not have anywhere near enough backing. As the primaries progressed, it was clear that the ONLY electable Democratic candidate was Biden.

We are at the point now where the ONLY game in town is beating Trump. After that, let the chips fall where they will and pick up the pieces and rebuild from there. Otherwise, there is nothing left to rebuild.

So, let's be objective.

What has #45 started that weren't already small fires anyway under Obama or any Dem presidency?

He didn't create racism, White supremacy, poverty, poor health access, poor housing, jailing of Black citizens disproportionate to the occupancy, police armament nor did he create seven wars from two in the Obama tenancy.

The Sanders policy issue was/ is an MSM issue same as it is in the UK for not being journalists and examining policy not attacking individuals.

The point is understanding why these neolib/ capitalist tilted countries fail its people so badly.

Why do you people continue to give the Dem party such a pass??

 

[Bigga]

A progressive Democratic candidate is NEVER going to get elected against a Republican incumbent with the current electoral system. It will take a generation of incremental changes to the way politics is administered to sort this mess out. That has to feed in from the bottom, not the top.

According to people on here, incremental changes have been happening since the Jim Crow days... or since slavery!

How's that working out...?

Incremental equality! Incremental Human rights! Incremental health care!

What a doozy!

 

[SWP's back]

Ah fuck it. You believe whatever the fuck it is you want to believe. It makes fuck all difference to anyone arguing with you at the end of the day.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

According to people on here, incremental changes have been happening since the Jim Crow days... or since slavery!

How's that working out...?

Incremental equality! Incremental Human rights! Incremental health care!

What a doozy!

Incremental change (from all parties) has always been seen as a top down strategy. That's just a fact; history, and it's not worth moaning about.

2020 is about voting out REGRESSION.

The way to implement change is to redress the political funding issues across the board, and then allow the new blood to trickle in and back-fill the void left by the old guard. Bottom-up politics.

REAL PROGRESSION.

 

[SWP's back]

But you know, they’re basically the same party...