Priced out?

[ArdwickBlue_M12]

The next five to ten years are going to be really important for City in the stands. I don’t think the club are envisioning what’s about to come.

A huge proportion of our season ticket holders are older blokes. Soon they will be getting to the age where they will have to pack it in due to it being too much of a struggle to attend, too unwell to attend or, unfortunately, they die.

Add to that the constant loss of season ticket holders due to price rises.

Add to that the constant loss of season ticket holders due to getting fed up of the sanitised bollocks and influx of tourists at City games.

I know approaching 30 lads who’ve given up their season tickets. I know three more who are thinking about doing so.

Add to that the very expensive individual matchday tickets, especially child tickets, and local fans and local families especially not being able to afford to go.

Add to this the lack of initiatives for local fans, like Liverpool have.

I think the club are, with no long term vision, actively loving all these ‘legacy fans’ dropping away from being season ticket holders so they can sell them as match tickets to tourists and earn more money to go towards their annual targets which allows them to earn their annual bonuses.

But that strategy is slowly ruining our support. Since the treble (or including the Bayern and Madrid home games in the treble season) the amount of tourists in the ground has noticeably increased, same at away games. They add nothing toward the atmosphere. Many aren’t even there to support City: some are just there to take in a game, some are fans of the opposition, some are fans of an opposition player and some are fans of a City player but have no interest in City winning.

This dilution of our support in the stands cannot keep happening.

Add to this that there are no new season tickets for the next generation of local fans, once all these older fans end their attending of City games, and City aren’t as successful on the pitch so attract fewer tourists, who are the club going to fill 62,000 seats with?

I live in Manchester’s Garden City, the city’s largest district (by some distance), in Wythenshawe. Wythenshawe is swarming with City fans yet City are not a presence in the Wythenshawe area… at all! If you are a citizen of Wythenshwee and didn’t have the internet or SkySports/TNT, you wouldn’t know City existed.

City are constantly boasting about where Shauny Wright and Lescott are around the world with the trophies, yet in all the years we’ve been winning trophies now in this era, the trophies have never been to Wythenshawe. You don’t see City in the local schools round here and there seem to be very few CITC initiatives around here (they did some Summer holidays sessions at the Woodhouse Park Lifestyle Centre a few years ago but little else).

These are the kind of areas that City are going to need to rely on in the coming years due to the concentration of City fans in this area, yet they aren’t acting like they understand this. They’re not envisioning the future coming years.

We’ve already seen this season that empty seats are starting to become noticeable. The prices for Boxing Day were so out of touch they were ridiculous. £66-78 for adult tickets, £38-42 for child tickets, that have to be paid for before Christmas, with the game on Boxing Day when there are no trains and you’re relying on local fans? Fucking stupid by the club. At £30 for adults and £15 for kids, a family of four could have attended the other day for £90 as a Christmas family treat… but not in City’s eyes, they’d rather have empty seats.

We are not a Manchester club anymore. We have become everything we mocked the rags for years and years ago

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

I’m not a critic of the exchange, our family (4 SCs in 102) use it a few times each season if one of us can’t go, it’s convenient, no risk of sanctions and we’re happy to get our 1/19th back. But it’s completely wrong to say the club don’t resell them at premium prices. I’m 100% sure of this cos I ask the people sitting there! For example at the Chelsea game a couple of years ago when we’d already won the league a nice Welsh girl at her first City game had paid £300 via an agency for my son’s seat. I am not passing judgement on any of this but facts are facts.

It's equally possible that the agency bought it directly, or someone bought it then sold it to the agency. Did the package include a hotel and other things?

The club has authorised partners and limits the prices they can charge. If an agency was charging £300 just for the seat then it wasn't an authorised agency. And that means it's highly unlikely the club sold it to them knowingly.

 

[johnnytapia]

I’m not a critic of the exchange, our family (4 SCs in 102) use it a few times each season if one of us can’t go, it’s convenient, no risk of sanctions and we’re happy to get our 1/19th back. But it’s completely wrong to say the club don’t resell them at premium prices. I’m 100% sure of this cos I ask the people sitting there! For example at the Chelsea game a couple of years ago when we’d already won the league a nice Welsh girl at her first City game had paid £300 via an agency for my son’s seat. I am not passing judgement on any of this but facts are facts.

That’s what I’d been told.

 

[Dodge]

I know how ticketing works, I work in the events industry. I do this for a living.

Of course the way the club operates is up to them but it is still unethical in my view. They force season ticket holders to use the exchange by intentionally making it as much of a pain in the arse as they can to use any other method. They do this so they can sell the returned ticket for a higher price. They make far more profit from individual ticket sales than they do from season tickets.

I can see a medium term future where season tickets are phased out entirely. Season ticket holders pay less for tickets and I would imagine spend a lot less in the stadium than occasional tourists too. The club do not value "legacy fans" and haven't for a long time, arguably since Cook was shown the door. They are an inconvenience.

I liken it to a first time private landlord who takes on a property at a knock down price because the property has a sitting tenant. It doesn't matter how amiable and upstanding the tenant is, that landlord will do their level best to remove them from the property at any cost. Despite living happily in the house, trouble free for many years, with no arrears and turning the house into a home, there is only one winner, despite the tenancy agreement and contract.

When the club was bought, it effectively had 35,000 "sitting tenants", each of whom has a contract (seasoncard). They have since systematically made life very uncomfortable for all SC holders. Year on year price hikes. Draconian rules for no-shows. Restricting ticket transfers, and pretty much insisting we must use the ticket exchange to allow the club to fill any vacant seats, at inflated prices. Removing SC holders to faciltate the corporate offering. SC's being rescinded if any Blue is accused of football related misdemeanours.

The suits can see a gigantic hole in the monetisation of every seat in the stadium. YOU, dear reader, dear old legacy fan, will be the subject of many a board meeting and wringing of hands in the mahogany clad boardroom at CFG Towers. Club Directors casting nervous glances, avoiding the Soriano glare when he asks why there are still so many of these bloodsucking bastards stealing money off the CFG bottom line.

So hold on for dear life to that season ticket, because that contract is your tenancy agreement. Our family? Well, thats the Blues we've stood next to for decades. The stadium? That's our fucking home...and it still will be when you inevitably sell OUR club to the 1st Yank hedge fund that stumps up £10b.

The time for passive shrugging of shoulders is over boys and girls...time for action.

Up the fucking Blues.

 

[shnaghaicityfish]

It's equally possible that the agency bought it directly, or someone bought it then sold it to the agency. Did the package include a hotel and other things?

The club has authorised partners and limits the prices they can charge. If an agency was charging £300 just for the seat then it wasn't an authorised agency. And that means it's highly unlikely the club sold it to them knowingly.

No hotel as I recall, but yes the other scenarios are possible, although I didn’t know agencies could buy off the exchange and resell? As it was, she was a City fan and happy, I was happy with my refund. Still raises questions about security and affordability though.

 

[jrb]

I can sort of stomach adult ticket prices in certain parts of the ground to an extent, but not in other parts of the ground.

What really gets to me and shocks me every time I see the ticket prices is the under 18 ticket prices. They are absolutely disgraceful. Khaldoon, Soriano, and the directors should be ashamed of themselves.

£33 is the cheapest under 18 ticket currently on sale for the West Ham game. £35 for ESL3. £48 for ESL2.

You can only imagine how much the under 18 tickets are for the Chelsea and Liverpool home games.

City have priced out our future under 18 support. And their families who would accompany them to the matches.

 

[jrb]

I liken it to a first time private landlord who takes on a property at a knock down price because the property has a sitting tenant. It doesn't matter how amiable and upstanding the tenant is, that landlord will do their level best to remove them from the property at any cost. Despite living happily in the house, trouble free for many years, with no arrears and turning the house into a home, there is only one winner, despite the tenancy agreement and contract.

When the club was bought, it effectively had 35,000 "sitting tenants", each of whom has a contract (seasoncard). They have since systematically made life very uncomfortable for all SC holders. Year on year price hikes. Draconian rules for no-shows. Restricting ticket transfers, and pretty much insisting we must use the ticket exchange to allow the club to fill any vacant seats, at inflated prices. Removing SC holders to faciltate the corporate offering. SC's being rescinded if any Blue is accused of football related misdemeanours.

The suits can see a gigantic hole in the monetisation of every seat in the stadium. YOU, dear reader, dear old legacy fan, will be the subject of many a board meeting and wringing of hands in the mahogany clad boardroom at CFG Towers. Club Directors casting nervous glances, avoiding the Soriano glare when he asks why there are still so many of these bloodsucking bastards stealing money off the CFG bottom line.

So hold on for dear life to that season ticket, because that contract is your tenancy agreement. Our family? Well, thats the Blues we've stood next to for decades. The stadium? That's our fucking home...and it still will be when you inevitably sell OUR club to the 1st Yank hedge fund that stumps up £10b.

The time for passive shrugging of shoulders is over boys and girls...time for action.

Up the fucking Blues.

If possible, can a you forward that to the board of directors at City? If you can, start with Khaldoon first, and remind him about what he said of the fans, and why they are so important to the club. Obviously Khaldoon’s either forgot, or what he said has fallen on deaf ears at boardroom level.

 

[Psychedelic Casual]

I honestly think it’s done, City in the early days of the takeover if they were struggling to sell tickets they would drop the prices drastically, those days are long gone, these people just don’t care.City’s fanbase was unique and famed, now it’s mocked and the identity is not just eroding, it’s disappearing. The last decade should have seen City secure our future support for years to come on our doorstep, how’s that worked out, the club have no interest, everything is anywhere but Manchester. Our fanbase was famed for it’s protests against swales, we now meekly just accept our lot, I am at the point where I wish soriano would just fuck off

I really thought that we would do things differently.

Mansour’s early doors Mission Statement to fans made me feel like we wouldn’t go down the United route of having a fanbase with no identity, just a worldwide bunch of nobodies. I thought that we were going to keep our identity and we’d be looked after.

A few things Mansour said:

‘My request to [Al Mubarak] has been to put together a board and executive team that is worthy of the heritage and potential of Manchester City’.

‘…we will absolutely spend time listening to you the fans about what you think about the future of the club. We are very aware that without you there would not be a club to buy, and your voice will be heard by the organisation at the highest level’.

‘We are aware also that the club has a significant role in the community going back years. As newcomers, we don’t pretend to understand all of this yet, but we will make sincere efforts to back these initiatives and ensure that Manchester City loses none of its role in Manchester beyond football and we want the club to continue to contribute to the community it represents’.

‘I am a football fan, and I hope that you will soon see that I am now also a Manchester City fan. But I am also a long-term investor and that is probably more important to the club and to you because it means we are here for the long haul and that we will act always in the best interests of the club and all of its stakeholders, but especially you the fans’.

We were a much more genuine set of fans than United. Being a City fan meant being a Mancunian or from around the NorthWest, an exiled Mancunian, the child/grandchild/great grandchild of a Mancunian or ex-City player, or someone with a great story about how they ended up a Blue if they didn’t have that immediate connection. And those core fans were famously loyal to this club throughout tumultuous times in the 80s and 90s, our reputation as a set of fans was second to none. We were not just a fanbase of a load of latchers-on while the locals were priced out and forgotten about like had happened over in Trafford, getting called a ‘Manc ****’ by massive Reds when we played them down at Wembley for the first time in 2011.

The latchers-on to City’s success were inevitable, of course. However, the total lack of remembering the heritage of City, spending time listening to fans, being aware that without us there’d be no club, being active in all parts of our conurbation, having ticketing initiatives for local fans to enhance the importance of Manchester and Mancunians… was not inevitable. It was the opposite of what the Mission Statement said.

Entering the European Super League, releasing statements by Joel Glazer, not saying anything to back up City fans after the Istanbul car park situation and of course, in-line with the title of this thread, pricing out fans whether by constantly putting season ticket prices up or having unrealistic matchticket prices for a predominantly working class Manchester fanbase… is not showing that they will act ‘always in the best interests of…especially you the fans’.

They haven’t done anything differently than United. We’ve just become ‘Man U’ in Blue. United’s match going fanbase of a load of latchers-on while the locals are priced out and forgotten about but with sky blue branding. I’ll probably get called a ‘Manc ****’ at a City game by a ‘City fan’ soon.

The German clubs have completely highlighted that the way Premier League clubs operate is not needed. Bayern have just smashed their record revenue figures, and they have SIXTEEN THOUSAND season tickets priced at under €350. Now they really do look after their core supporters!
Even Liverpool have ticketing initiatives for people with an ‘L’ post code and their child Premier League matchday tickets are £9 in all stands other than the new Anfield Road tier. And they would definitely have backed their fans if they’d faced what we did in Istanbul.

 

[manclad]

I really thought that we would do things differently.

Mansour’s early doors Mission Statement to fans made me feel like we wouldn’t go down the United route of having a fanbase with no identity, just a worldwide bunch of nobodies. I thought that we were going to keep our identity and we’d be looked after.

A few things Mansour said:

‘My request to [Al Mubarak] has been to put together a board and executive team that is worthy of the heritage and potential of Manchester City’.

‘…we will absolutely spend time listening to you the fans about what you think about the future of the club. We are very aware that without you there would not be a club to buy, and your voice will be heard by the organisation at the highest level’.

‘We are aware also that the club has a significant role in the community going back years. As newcomers, we don’t pretend to understand all of this yet, but we will make sincere efforts to back these initiatives and ensure that Manchester City loses none of its role in Manchester beyond football and we want the club to continue to contribute to the community it represents’.

‘I am a football fan, and I hope that you will soon see that I am now also a Manchester City fan. But I am also a long-term investor and that is probably more important to the club and to you because it means we are here for the long haul and that we will act always in the best interests of the club and all of its stakeholders, but especially you the fans’.

We were a much more genuine set of fans than United. Being a City fan meant being a Mancunian or from around the NorthWest, an exiled Mancunian, the child/grandchild/great grandchild of a Mancunian or ex-City player, or someone with a great story about how they ended up a Blue if they didn’t have that immediate connection. Not just a fanbase of a load of latchers-on while the locals were priced out and forgotten about like had happened over in Trafford, getting called a ‘Manc ****’ by massive Reds when we played them down at Wembley for the first time in 2011.

The latchers-on to City’s success were inevitable, of course. However, the total lack of remembering the heritage of City, spending time listening to fans, being aware that without us there’d be no club, being active in all parts of our conurbation, having ticketing initiatives for local fans to enhance the importance of Manchester and Mancunians… was not inevitable. It was the opposite of what the Mission Statement said.

Entering the European Super League, releasing statements by Joel Glazer, not saying anything to back up City fans after the Istanbul car park situation and of course, in-line with the title of this thread, pricing out fans whether by constantly putting season ticket prices up or having unrealistic matchticket prices for a predominantly working class Manchester fanbase… is not showing that they will act ‘always in the best interests of…especially you the fans’.

They haven’t done anything differently than United. We’ve just become ‘Man U’ in Blue. United’s match going fanbase of a load of latchers-on while the locals are priced out and forgotten about but with sky blue branding. I’ll probably get called a ‘Manc ****’ at a City game by a ‘City fan’ soon.

The German clubs have completely highlighted that the way Premier League clubs operate is not needed. Bayern have just smashed their record revenue figures, and they have SIXTTEEN THOUSAND season tickets priced at under €350. Now they really do look after their core supporters!

Great post. Sums up the whole sorry situation perfectly.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

No hotel as I recall, but yes the other scenarios are possible, although I didn’t know agencies could buy off the exchange and resell? As it was, she was a City fan and happy, I was happy with my refund. Still raises questions about security and affordability though.

They would have a supporter number, like other touts have.