Progress and why Hughes should stay!

[bizzbo]

nah....results dear boy, results and results alone. and that means league finishes and cup rounds. beyond that, a very very long way behind, you have derby games, developing youth for the sake of it, and playing nice football. there are different approaches, but it's results in the now, and results tommorow that matter. hughes is getting the bare bloody minimum now, just as he got by on the bare bloody minimum last year. it's driving me nuts. why can't he just hurry up and fail outright or actually be quite good? inconsiderate sod.

So you would be happy with Hughes getting more than 55 points?

nah, I'd expect 60-70 given the monstrous amount we're spending on wages and transfers. the points total is misleading tho, it's the league finish that counts. the pro's measure themselves on the wage bill vs the league finish. you are doing a very good job if say, you finish 9th on the 14th biggest wage bill. I think last year someone said hughes finished 9th on a wage bill that could have been anywhere between the 6th and 3rd largest, depending on how you calculate it. it was the bare minimum of what was acceptable to the owner, it wouldn't have been enough for me, I think 7th or 8th would have been a proper target. this season, we will have the third biggest wage bill, at least. I'd settle for 5th if it was within a point or two of fourth. 6th or 7th would be taking the piss, as villa and tottenham's wage bills are probably massively smaller than ours.

 

[Grand Master Ram Rod]

Think carefully about what you are saying with regards to improvement.

Blackburn (A) - 2-2 / 0-2 = improved. Good result agreed
Portsmouth (A) - 0-2 / 1-0 = improved. A quarter of the team they were last year plus our signings we should win
Arsenal (H) - 3-0 / 4-2 = same. Not the same -1 goal difference plus all our signings
Scum (A) - 0-2 / 3-4 = same. Not the same an improvement,did enough to earn a point
West Ham (H) 3-0 / 3-1 = same. Not the same.Weaker than last year and our squad has £200 million added since the same fixture
Villa (A) - 2-4 / 1-1 = improved.Agreed improved but with a little balls we could have won that
Wigan (A) - 1-2 / 1-1 = improved. Improved agreed but are you happy with only a point after the influx of players we have ?
Fulham (H) - 1-3 / 2-2 = improved.Again on the face of it yes an improvement but 2-0 up at home not happy with that
Liverpool (A) - 1-1 / 2-2 = same.Disagree - They are a lot weaker than last year and very fragile we have improved
Hull (H) - 5-1 / 1-1 = worse. Agreed
Chelsea (H) - 1-3 / 2-1 = improved.Agreed
Bolton (A) - 0-2 / 3-3 = improved.Getting a point is a better result but we have "improved" plus £200 million

Add to that, that we're in the semi final of the Carling Cup, which we got knocked out of last year by Brighton in the second round and once again we have improved.- This season we have played a full strength team in every round

All the players he has brought in have improved us and the position they took over bar one, if you compare them to the players they replaced, we have improved yet again:

Pablo Zabaleta - better than Corluka = good signing.= Not better than Corluka
Roque Santa Cruz - target man we'll need in certain games = ok signing.Too early to tell but looks poor, why sign an injured player
Kolo Toure - better than Dunne = good signing.Nowhere near as good as Dunne especially at net +£11 million
Joleon Lescott - better than Onuoha = good signing.Doubt he is better than Nedum but is left sided and is a good signing.

While I disagree with the way Hughes is doing things at times (Academy for example- why make so many changes to it when it is the envy of most clubs) I have backed him but lately my thoughts are changing and unfortunately I do not think he will get us to where we need to be in the time frame we need it. I genuinely believe that we need a Manager that has the respect of every opposing Manager, opposing players,opposing fans, officials and most importantly our players. I am not saying our players don't respect him but who would you respect more, someone who has done it all or someone who is trying to do it all. From the outside looking in would you as a player want to work with a Van Gaal, Hiddink, Mourinho, Ancellotti or Mark Hughes? I know who I wouldn't choose.

Maybe some of the results and performances haven't been as big or as good but you still get 3/1/0 points at the end of the day.

Zabaleta or Corluka has always been a 50/50 for who's better, imo Zab just beat him, if not the same.

On paper and at pevous clubs we can probably agree Toure and Lecott have been better than Dunney and Ned. They might have been a bit shaky atm but I think they will come very good and everyone agreed at the time that they were two good signings.

 

[KenTheLandlord]

So you would be happy with Hughes getting more than 55 points?

nah, I'd expect 60-70 given the monstrous amount we're spending on wages and transfers. the points total is misleading tho, it's the league finish that counts. the pro's measure themselves on the wage bill vs the league finish. you are doing a very good job if say, you finish 9th on the 14th biggest wage bill. I think last year someone said hughes finished 9th on a wage bill that could have been anywhere between the 6th and 3rd largest, depending on how you calculate it. it was the bare minimum of what was acceptable to the owner, it wouldn't have been enough for me, I think 7th or 8th would have been a proper target. this season, we will have the third biggest wage bill, at least. I'd settle for 5th if it was within a point or two of fourth. 6th or 7th would be taking the piss, as villa and tottenham's wage bills are probably massively smaller than ours.

I agree with you about the points being misleading, you can stay up one year or be relegated the next with the same points.
I think this year, things a lot tighter, more "surprise" results. Teams seem to be getting better or we have weakened the top4 with some of our purchases, not sure which.
5th is about right, and should be top 4.

 

[Grand Master Ram Rod]

The OP maybe needs to go and watch the goals against from the last 18 months, when you will see a remarkable amount of unmarked players putting the ball in our net,
You may even notice that the gaps that open up have been the same, or that the unmarked player with the free pop on goal is running in central or far post, while our defence has moved over as a unit to one side to where the ball comes from.

As this has been a recurring theme, and the players in the back four have changed several times, it can be one of two things,

The players are sh*t..........except every single one has been an international player, true one or two only at u 21s but you get the idea.

The difference is last year we wasn’t scoring enough to get points either, this year he has got the attacking/scoring spot on, so if he sorted that out, I have faith in him to now sort the defensive side out and find a way of stop leaking goals.

The clown in the managers job persistes with the missing fullback formation and zonal defence, it didn`t work last season, and it aint going to work this one, any improvment in quality of players has been offset by this one and only tactic.

We do not play zonal defence.

Getting on to players signed, yes he has picked up a few good ones at silly prices, but I disagree that Lesccott is better than Dunne, Elano was one of the best creative players in the world, and it looks like Hart will be off in January, and in my opinion better than Given now with a lot more to come.

Dunne and Lescott might be very similar atm but Lescott is younger and tbh has really impressed me, he’s been one of our better players the last few months, scored a couple and is only going to get better. Elano was a trouble maker, as Stevie Ireland even admitted, he had to go. I’m a big Joe Hart fan but no way is he better than Given, he’s still ours anyway.

We have the longest injury list since club records began thanks to the level of coaches numpty brought in,

Considering there is only Johnno out, I disagree. We might get the odd knocks here and there but so does every team. I’ll bet there’s far worse off teams than us when it comes to injuries.

The extreamly sucessful youth accademy staff have all gone thanks to numpty,

Well I’ll agree that the results haven’t been as good as previous years but I think that’s just because this years lot aren’t as good as previous years. Also Jim Cassell abroad could be seen as a positive thing if he finds us some gems.

We have managed to scrape draws at home to the poorer end of the league several times with the aid of some good fortune, not forgeting Scunthorpe.

Last year we were getting beat by these teams so it is progress and what are you going on about with Scunthorpe? We won 5-1 ffs, what more do you want?

Progress, I dont think so, not as a club or on the pitch, with the supporters divided like never before thanks to numpty.

I think I’ve proved how we’ve progressed and whether it be good enough for some fans or not, it’s definitely progress.

 

[BoyBlue_1985]

Pablo Zabaleta - better than Corluka = good signing - see thats just not true though is it!!!

 

[Grand Master Ram Rod]

Pablo Zabaleta - better than Corluka = good signing - see thats just not true though is it!!!

A lot agreed all last season and this season up 'til he got sent off v Wigan and now he's suddenly shit.