Public sector pay since 2010

[johnnytapia]

You can have one. I have always been savvy with my money from a very early age. Kids in school should be taught one principle thing in my opinion that is hugely overlooked - that you don’t get rich selling your time. 99 percent of money I have made has been from house price increases, building things that I sell for more than they cost to build and more recently just simple investments. That was built on the back of having a succesful window cleaning round age 17 that I did for 5 years very Saturday and Sunday while going to university one day a week and training as a quantity surveyor and bought two cheap tearrace houses on the back of. My kids have had a far easier start to life than I had but are clueless when it comes to the real world. Kids should have a lesson every week on financial management and the power of compound interest and the dangers of debt. They are not coming out of school prepared for the real world.

My point is being age 21/22 and a qualified nurse but with 40k debt at an interest rate of 6 percent and a salary of 23k is not an attractive proposition. She could leave school in 2 years set up a small business with my support and earn far more than that in a few years and have no debt.

I completely agree with squirty that people offering a public service like a teacher or a nurse should not be left with any debt. Kids just think that they can get these a stars and a levels and a degree and life will be happy ever after. I see in real life 22 year olds with a load of debt looking for a first job and as sexist as it may sound in this mad new world (in a women’s case wanting to have a kid maybe before 30?).

I also take on board wallys point that that 23k is basic and can rise and she can earn reasonable money as she gets older but it is a big turn off for many I would imagine having that level of debt.

Rather have saved 40k by 23 through graft and have it earning me 5 percent a year for the rest of my life than having it the other way round.

Great post and details why this country will never be on a sound financial footing. I'd take slight note about children not being taught about £. At my Primary School we teach money literacy from a very early age (how to save etc) and things like interest and debt are very much part of our Yr5 and 6 maths curriculum. But we're up against a societal thing: everyone wants, and can have, a new car, new settee, new washing machine etc, on the never never. Banks and credit card providers are still throwing money at people. Car leasing, in my opinion, will be the next big financial crash. I have work colleagues who are happy to pay North of £200 a month to lease the latest car. Madness. And these are well paid people.

Regarding public pay, I'm a teacher and I entered the profession relatively late: aged 35. I had little debt and could afford to take the "hit" of a year out to train. I'm not sure I'd do the same saddled with 20-30k of debt. That aside, the problem we have in teaching isn't recruitment, it's retention. 40% of teachers leave before the end of their 5th year. A staggering figure. All those training costs wasted. I don't believe pay is the issue though, it's the sheer workload. The holidays are fantastic but they're needed (so I can post on Bluemoon!).

 

[TheRemainsOfTheDave]

... you don’t get rich selling your time ...

Absolute tosh, the exact opposite is the truth. I often see jobs in my industry offering rates upto £800 a day, just for someone's time/experience. Reckon I could get rich quick on that.

 

[worsleyweb]

Absolute tosh, the exact opposite is the truth. I often see jobs in my industry offering rates upto £800 a day, just for someone's time/experience. Reckon I could get rich quick on that.

What does Warren Buffett mean when he says, "The poor invest their time, while the rich invest their money"?

 

[TheRemainsOfTheDave]

What does Warren Buffett mean when he says, "The poor invest their time, while the rich invest their money"?

Yeah, and how much did he get paid for that speech/quote? Is it from one of his books? For every successful investor, there's an unsuccessful one, probably more. Rich people invest on the back of expensive advice but still with the ability to absorb any losses. That's not in scope for most people. I agree there's money to be made in property, but can you regularly make £x a day for no outlay*? It's just a case of finding the right niche.

*Excepting initial training costs of course.

 

[117 M34]

What does Warren Buffett mean when he says, "The poor invest their time, while the rich invest their money"?

What if you don't have any money to invest?

 

[Henkeman]

The trouble with this whole debate is that public sector doesn't exist in a vacuum. Over the last decade the private sector suffered worse cuts and losses in the first half, and has done better in the second half. So ok, increase public sector pay more. But it has to come from somewhere, and the particular freeze in the first half of the decade was because the private sector was crashing post financial crisis. Public sector pay always lags a couple of years behind because it's entirely dependant on tax receipts one way or another.

Want to put up public sector pay more? Sure. It means taxing everyone else more. That's ok if it's what you want to do, but ultimately all spending has to come from somewhere. There aren't easy solutions to anything.

 

[FantasyIreland]

The trouble with this whole debate is that public sector doesn't exist in a vacuum. Over the last decade the private sector suffered worse cuts and losses in the first half, and has done better in the second half. So ok, increase public sector pay more. But it has to come from somewhere, and the particular freeze in the first half of the decade was because the private sector was crashing post financial crisis. Public sector pay always lags a couple of years behind because it's entirely dependant on tax receipts one way or another.

Want to put up public sector pay more? Sure. It means taxing everyone else more. That's ok if it's what you want to do, but ultimately all spending has to come from somewhere. There aren't easy solutions to anything.

Agreed,but in the mean time the country suffers as the industries concerned are losing very talented,experienced,and valuable people and filling the vacancies with people who shouldn't be passing the initial sift.

 

[Henkeman]

Agreed,but in the mean time the country suffers as the industries concerned are losing very talented,experienced,and valuable people and filling the vacancies with people who shouldn't be passing the initial sift.

Sorry, can you clarify? Which ones?

Also - isn't turnover of staff, experienced or otherwise, something that every country would say is a problem?

 

[FantasyIreland]

Sorry, can you clarify? Which ones?

Also - isn't turnover of staff, experienced or otherwise, something that every country would say is a problem?

All - Police/Fire/Ambulance/teachers

With respect,i'm not interested in other countries until we sort out our own.

 

[Henkeman]

All - Police/Fire/Ambulance/teachers

With respect,i'm not interested in other countries until we sort out our own.

Ah, OK I see what you mean now.

Sure, but it's still a matter of having to fund things. We do have the highest public spending as a proportion of GDP we've had in half a century. Wanting that to go even higher is a political choice, but extra still has to come from somewhere. The last decade has really not been easy, as the horrendous deficit showed. Shove taxes up and you have the same issue with losing talent in the private sector. Everything is a trade off.