Rangers coming to Stretford

[BluePurgatory]

Some good points there but I still think there was enough time for the council to organise bogs, screens etc in a park rather than errect screens with beer tents next to them in the city centre with no bogs.

 

[harrogateblue]

In the official report into the events of May 2008, the report commisioned by the council stated that Manchester made in the region of £20 million pounds. That is from MCC and for that amount you think that they would have supplied a tv that works!!
£20 million pounds Manchester took from Rangers fans yet they "provided" facilities that would only cater for what the ground would hold.
In the official report it was stated that the damage was not "long term" and was concluded that insufficient litter bins and toilet facilities were provided hence the mess.
So the statement "Rangers wrecked our city" is pure bollocks.
Did Rangers fans cause £20 million worth of damage, did they fuck. Manchester made a fortune and provided fuck all.
No extra transport laid on nothing, no extra trains, Piccadily train station was a disgrace and a separate enquiry should have been opened for that.
The report is 48 pages long and is exemplary on how to cover your arse including the lie that there was a stabbing but hey ho. £20 million estimate profit for a half arsed organised, couldn't be bothered with you event.
To those who are interested the link is
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.manchester.gov.uk/egov_downloads/5._UEFA_Cup_Final_1_.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.manchester.gov.uk/egov_downl ... nal_1_.pdf</a>

It also states that the cost of holding the event was £150,000, now you outlay 150 large and rake in £20 million and you tell me that that Manchester City Council could not have provided better and bigger facilities.

 

[Breadsnapper]

In the official report into the events of May 2008, the report commisioned by the council stated that Manchester made in the region of £20 million pounds. That is from MCC and for that amount you think that they would have supplied a tv that works!!
£20 million pounds Manchester took from Rangers fans yet they "provided" facilities that would only cater for what the ground would hold.
In the official report it was stated that the damage was not "long term" and was concluded that insufficient litter bins and toilet facilities were provided hence the mess.
So the statement "Rangers wrecked our city" is pure bollocks.
Did Rangers fans cause £20 million worth of damage, did they fuck. Manchester made a fortune and provided fuck all.
No extra transport laid on nothing, no extra trains, Piccadily train station was a disgrace and a separate enquiry should have been opened for that.
The report is 48 pages long and is exemplary on how to cover your arse including the lie that there was a stabbing but hey ho. £20 million estimate profit for a half arsed organised, couldn't be bothered with you event.
To those who are interested the link is
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.manchester.gov.uk/egov_downloads/5._UEFA_Cup_Final_1_.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.manchester.gov.uk/egov_downl ... nal_1_.pdf</a>

It also states that the cost of holding the event was £150,000, now you outlay 150 large and rake in £20 million and you tell me that that Manchester City Council could not have provided better and bigger facilities.

Not so sure MCC actually made £20 million. Perhaps Manchester as a whole.
Which ever way you look at it, there were mistakes made by all sides. However it does not justify the level of violence that was apparant on the day.
Just read the report and it would seem that MCC did everything in their power for the day to be a success. Guess you can't cater for a few idiots.

 

[BluePurgatory]

In the official report into the events of May 2008, the report commisioned by the council stated that Manchester made in the region of £20 million pounds. That is from MCC and for that amount you think that they would have supplied a tv that works!!
£20 million pounds Manchester took from Rangers fans yet they "provided" facilities that would only cater for what the ground would hold.
In the official report it was stated that the damage was not "long term" and was concluded that insufficient litter bins and toilet facilities were provided hence the mess.
So the statement "Rangers wrecked our city" is pure bollocks.
Did Rangers fans cause £20 million worth of damage, did they fuck. Manchester made a fortune and provided fuck all.
No extra transport laid on nothing, no extra trains, Piccadily train station was a disgrace and a separate enquiry should have been opened for that.
The report is 48 pages long and is exemplary on how to cover your arse including the lie that there was a stabbing but hey ho. £20 million estimate profit for a half arsed organised, couldn't be bothered with you event.
To those who are interested the link is
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.manchester.gov.uk/egov_downloads/5._UEFA_Cup_Final_1_.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.manchester.gov.uk/egov_downl ... nal_1_.pdf</a>

It also states that the cost of holding the event was £150,000, now you outlay 150 large and rake in £20 million and you tell me that that Manchester City Council could not have provided better and bigger facilities.

Not so sure MCC actually made £20 million. Perhaps Manchester as a whole.
Which ever way you look at it, there were mistakes made by all sides. However it does not justify the level of violence that was apparant on the day.

I think the point HB is trying to make that if the CC would have organise things a bit better there would not have been the level of violence.

 

[harrogateblue]

Well, guess we are getting closer then Breadsnapper. A few idiots. Manchester as a whole made £20 million. That is a lot of dosh.
If you read the whole 48 pages then you will appreciate that Rangers and it's supporters representatives state that they deplore the disgusting behaviour of those who rioted.
It was a great day for me, bar the result. I'm 50 years old and went with my wife so really I wasn't going for a rammy with GMP.

The thing that got my goat at the start of this thread was the suggestion that City/Utd and GMP should get together and give Rangers fans a kicking for wrecking our city. The figures would suggest that there was a huge boost to the local economy.
Rangers like any club has it's share of undesirables but to label the entire Rangers community is alarmist and most importanty wrong.
Like Harold McMillian is famously quoted as saying "events, dear boy, events".

 

[Breadsnapper]

You see, that makes me chuckle.

The event was a European Final where there were a finite number of tickets available to fans who wanted to go. Once they were sold out, tough luck if you didn't get one.

Why should the council cater for ticketless supporters out of our Council Tax money?

Why travel to Manchester on the premise of it being a good day out, get pissed up and if there's any bother, then it's no bother because it's not our city?

That kind of comment, though I'm sure not intended to, borders on sheer bloody arrogance.

How much money do you think the City Centre Business made out of the rangers game that day? So are you saying that if we make it to the final in Dublin no city fans should travel without a ticket and if the thousands who will travel without a ticket just to sample the atmosphere then nothing should be laid on for them, although they will be spending lots and lots of money. So by your logic the citys fans who travelled to Blackburn and were parked on that hill some blue moons ago had no right to be there because they had not been lucky enough to buy a ticket. FFS you need to get out more.

-- Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:14 pm --

You see, that makes me chuckle.

The event was a European Final where there were a finite number of tickets available to fans who wanted to go. Once they were sold out, tough luck if you didn't get one.

Why should the council cater for ticketless supporters out of our Council Tax money?

Why travel to Manchester on the premise of it being a good day out, get pissed up and if there's any bother, then it's no bother because it's not our city?

That kind of comment, though I'm sure not intended to, borders on sheer bloody arrogance.

-- Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:09 pm --


So GMP made it clear their stance and that was overruled by the council? Can the council do that (genuine question, not a dig)?

If I'd have read the police didn't want me there, I'd have been inclined to stay away - only my personal point of view and understand that if you're given mixed messages you might make a different decision - but deffo given the reputation of her majesty's finest, major wide berth for me!

Believe it or no we dont live in a Police state and perhaps these comments set the tone between the police and fans for what was going to happen.
PS there is a by law in machester which bans alcohol being drank in public. Why did her majestys finest ignore it?

Quite simply because the thought was that if it was enforced it would have created more problems. isn't hindsight a wondeful thing?<br /><br />-- Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:37 pm --<br /><br />

Well, guess we are getting closer then Breadsnapper. A few idiots. Manchester as a whole made £20 million. That is a lot of dosh.
If you read the whole 48 pages then you will appreciate that Rangers and it's supporters representatives state that they deplore the disgusting behaviour of those who rioted.
It was a great day for me, bar the result. I'm 50 years old and went with my wife so really I wasn't going for a rammy with GMP.

The thing that got my goat at the start of this thread was the suggestion that City/Utd and GMP should get together and give Rangers fans a kicking for wrecking our city. The figures would suggest that there was a huge boost to the local economy.
Rangers like any club has it's share of undesirables but to label the entire Rangers community is alarmist and most importanty wrong.
Like Harold McMillian is famously quoted as saying "events, dear boy, events".

I never alluded to anything else, of course it was a minority, a few idiots. My point which will never change is that there is no excuse for what happened irrespective of who the few idiots purport to support.
I just find it a bit rich that everyone is to blame except the people that caused the trouble.
I have no axe to grind with rangers or their fans and many I spoke to on the night were disgusted and mortified with what had happened.
The issue taken by some on here is motivated by the hatred of the political divide between rangers and Celtic, hence some of the posts.

 

[BluePurgatory]

Well, guess we are getting closer then Breadsnapper. A few idiots. Manchester as a whole made £20 million. That is a lot of dosh.
If you read the whole 48 pages then you will appreciate that Rangers and it's supporters representatives state that they deplore the disgusting behaviour of those who rioted.
It was a great day for me, bar the result. I'm 50 years old and went with my wife so really I wasn't going for a rammy with GMP.

The thing that got my goat at the start of this thread was the suggestion that City/Utd and GMP should get together and give Rangers fans a kicking for wrecking our city. The figures would suggest that there was a huge boost to the local economy.
Rangers like any club has it's share of undesirables but to label the entire Rangers community is alarmist and most importanty wrong.
Like Harold McMillian is famously quoted as saying "events, dear boy, events".

HB you will always get some who have hidden agendas or spout off for the sake of it. I went into Manchester that day with some mates and never once did I or any of may mates feel intimidated or witness any violence. The atmosphere was one of a carnival one, with fans in kilts etc. Even when the game was over I was surprised how dignified the fans were unlike my fellow English supporters who at a previous screening of an England match kicked off! As I have already stated, I am English and RC and went into Manchester that day to sample the atmosphere. I was there but the way some have described events is
fiction.

 

[harrogateblue]

BluePurgatory, I agree mate. It was a fantastic day for me and Mrs HB. I witnessed only some good old fashioned plod who were very very helpful in the daylight hours.
No complaints from me at all.
But we now have the situation where Rangers=bad bad boys and everybody else is good.
Manchester has no need to fear Rangers fans, the game against the Rags is another ridiculous episode. Rangers fans enmasse are to travel to Wigan, get their tickets and "enjoy" a convoy straight to the Swamp.
Fucking target practice for every low life along the East Lancs road.
Meanwhile those lovely chaps the MIB enjoy the freedom of getting to Glasgow how they want, no restrictions despite the despicable attacks on oaps, women and kids along Paisley Road West 4 hours before kick off in 2003.
They should be bussed to Motherwell and a convoy taken to the game from there.

 

[Deleted member 14625]

Well what to say about all this?

Rangers fans have a reputation of being total wankers; littering, robbing, vandalising, defaceing, physically assaulting... and they - whether it was just 1000 or so of you or all 175000 of you it makes no difference, you did it, it happened, it was totally out of order - carried that reputation on when they came to Manchester in 2008.

Of course there were a large amount of them who were impaccably behaved, and well done to them people. But that doesn't mean it was okay for the retards who did piss/shit/throw-up in public, smash up cars, rob shops, smash up shop displays and even shop front windows, threaten/intimidate/spit at/head butt/punch/kick Manchester citizens (one of which was a female on her way home from work who was walking with my girlfriend [she was kicked]!) or anyone else for that matter.

The thing is, how do we know whether you were one of the idiots or one of the impaeccable or just in between? For that i'd say that any Rangers fans coming to Old Trafford whenever it is should be made to be bus'd down and escorted straight to the ground and then straight home aferwards. No early drinking in town, not even a pastie in the Stretford Arndale, just straight there and straight home. Any Rangers fans seen in the city should be put on the next train back to Glasgow. It's just tough shit on all the well behaved, the appallingly behaved ruined that for you!

As for the GMP, we live with the fuckers, we know how bad they can be.

After the home derby towards the end of last season, when they let the Rags out at the same time as us after another 90minute+ goal by them, after a season of a fair bit of trouble in the city between Blues and Rags. I saw one policeman push over a lad of about 7 years old to get to a crowd of Blues, get his baton out and twat two or three to get his adrenalin going and his confidence up; another was approached by a 17/18 year old couple, the lad asked the copper if he could take his girlfriend behind their line to keep her safe and he twatted the lad twice in the arm with his baton; a third twatted me in the leg for calling the copper who did the previous a "daft c'unt"... and that's just one day at one match with the inept "force" of our city, so we know exactly how bad they can be.

But that still doesn't mean that you Rangers fans can do what you want just because the police were their usual shit-themselves, over-reactionary, inept selves when it comes to crowd control.

As for the Rags, I hate them more than I could ever hate anyone else. So they can just fuck right off n'all!<br /><br />-- Thu Sep 02, 2010 6:02 pm --<br /><br />

BluePurgatory, I agree mate. It was a fantastic day for me and Mrs HB. I witnessed only some good old fashioned plod who were very very helpful in the daylight hours.
No complaints from me at all.
But we now have the situation where Rangers=bad bad boys and everybody else is good.
Manchester has no need to fear Rangers fans, the game against the Rags is another ridiculous episode. Rangers fans enmasse are to travel to Wigan, get their tickets and "enjoy" a convoy straight to the Swamp.
Fucking target practice for every low life along the East Lancs road.
Meanwhile those lovely chaps the MIB enjoy the freedom of getting to Glasgow how they want, no restrictions despite the despicable attacks on oaps, women and kids along Paisley Road West 4 hours before kick off in 2003.
They should be bussed to Motherwell and a convoy taken to the game from there.

Another typical story in the "fearsome" world of the MIB. The biggest jokers in Europe. They did exactly the same in the League Cup semi derby at the CoMS last Feb. Women, OAP's, kids anyone but 17-50 year old blokes 13stone and over!

They should have to be convoyed in and out of every town and city they ever go in or near, just to keep the local primary school kids and old peoples home folk safe.

 

[hirop]

As a bear I have condemed the wider Rangers support on other forums for bleating about Manchester, and am happy to do so here. It was bang out of order, and totally avoidable. The behaviour really displayed some of the severe jock social ills around alcohol. I knew at 8.30am that morning there would be bother when I saw visibily drunk supporters getting interviewed in Piccadilly BBC Breakfast regional news slots. They were singling the Bobby Sands song, thats pretty raw that one, something I ain't heard at Ibrox since the late 80's - I knew then that it was not just the Rangers match-going fans who were down, but everyone who thinks they support Rangers was having or going to have a pished up day out.

I stayed home and watched the game on TV, an English bear I know from Oldham missed the game because his mate got hit by a flying bottle at picadilly before kick off - spent the game in some er he said. My two cousins who were down did go in to the city centre, but left when the Picadilly screen went down, they caught the second half at a relative's house.

It had bother written all over it, and GMP did what they had to do when it started, they started bangin heads and sent in the riot crew - just turned out they were out numbered and got a kicking until the booze wore off.

The numbers were unmanageable, sure the council could have done more, like hiring 400 of these - it's how Amsterdam handles 250K people on the street on Queens Day.

- I accept they probably didn't have time by the point they realised the deluge of ticketless fans could not be stopped. Bad intelligence really, a blindman could have told you that a 3.5 hour journey was going to be no barrier to attending the city for the 'craic'. After Seville a high turnout was guarenteed, some one-upmanship for sure, just down the M6....disaster waiting to happen in terms of numbers. I doubt a large number of people had anywhere to go when the cops started trying to clear the area.

I take all the "you wrecked our city" stuff with a pinch of salt, it's was just a deluge of drunken people without facilities to handle it. The aggression and violence, that's different and totally out of order.

Bears have no complaint, this upcoming game will be rough, but that's the way it goes if you carry on like that. If you think gmp were rough last time round, what do you think will happen this time? Personally, bear or not, I sure when the guys got picked up in dawn raids and delivered to gmp they got a very special welcome.

I suspect the game coming up will pass off without incident, no one will travel without tickets because of 1) what happened last time & 2) It's not a european final 3 hours away.

On a lighter note, I pissed myself laughing when the rags couldn't have their open top bus thing 2 weeks after the game. Every cloud and all that.