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Respect for Referees
- Thread starter trublue55
- Start date
SWP's back
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- 29 Jun 2009
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Amazing how the shit is rolling one way and has done ever since we won 6-1 at the swamp.eshiers1 said:hgblue said:eshiers1 said:you do all realise that without these referees there would be no game of football??
how do you know for sure that webb/clattenerg saw those incidents?? you dont, you're just guessing from a video that can not possibly be conclusive
the refs are doing the best job they can in one of the most hostile environments, they will always make mistakes so get of their backs and get on with the game
i'm as gutted as anyone that we have been on the wrong end of several howlers lately but thats the game we play, some go for us and some against
There are too many mistakes being made recently, and if this continues, then referees are going to be a laughing stock. They need help and the technology is there to help them. This needs to happen sooner rather than later.
but that is not going to happen in the forseable future
we have to get on with it, like it or not!
we'll keep getting the same refs 2/3 times a season and these refs are reffing our games because they are the best in the country. it's a bloody hard job and, more often than not, no matter what you do you're always going to anger one set of fans/players or the other by the end of the game.
They would get a lot more respect if they came out and said whether they thought they had made an error of judgement but they don't. They are like traffic wardens thinking that they are control freaks who love being the centre of attention.
BufordUSABlue
Well-Known Member
As in work and life, respect has to be earned and not expected or even worse....demanded!! Which is the message really being sent out by this bollocks of a campaign, no doubt introduced to take the spotlight off the total ineptitude of the current batch of Ref's in England?
Like an awful lot of fellow blues, I played the game all my life (I estimated right up around 1,000 games on Saturday afternoon and Sunday mornings!) and to keep up some form of fitness and mainly because I had moved here, I took up refereeing in my attempt to ‘give something back to the game that I love’ so I have somewhat seen the game from both sides…
So in my humble opinion, barring a certain and obvious few who I really cannot make my mind up about (Walton is one such individual, but to have an agenda means ironically that you would have to be really good at the profession which I simply don’t think that he is, on the other hand Clattenberg could just be, as he is a potentially good official and was regarded as the brightest ref to come out of England until a few years ago when he was attached to some sort of scandal!!)
I really don’t believe that there is an ‘agenda’ from refs, its simple incompetence; with the ‘country’s best ref’ Howard Webb (whom I met after the game against Chelski at home a couple of seasons back and found him a very nice and easy to talk to down to earth sort of a chap) making less mistakes than anyone else….. Last night, one of the worse ref’s in the league IMO gave a shocking decision which simply killed us!
For any penalty a ref has to ask him(or her!)self the following questions;
1. Was it a deliberate act; i.e. did the hand move towards the ball at all – so last night…NO! (ball to hand or hand to ball scenario)
2. Did the player seek to gain an obvious advantage = difficult one this as you are usually second guessing, but last night a resounding ……NO!
3. Was it a ”DOGSO” (Deny Obvious Goal Scoring Opportunity!) = last night probably…… but again, back to point 1, not a deliberate act!!
4. And last and by no means least, if there is any doubt whatsoever, you cannot award the pen = So, last night……..well there was plenty of doubt for sure! The fact that Micah’s arm was not raised significantly and the fact that the ball deflected up off his boot, means that this was a complete accident and in no way a deliberate act = NO PENALTY!!
Like I said, no agenda in my opinion, just total ineptness on the part of a very poor referee, symptomatic of the standard in general right now..
Like an awful lot of fellow blues, I played the game all my life (I estimated right up around 1,000 games on Saturday afternoon and Sunday mornings!) and to keep up some form of fitness and mainly because I had moved here, I took up refereeing in my attempt to ‘give something back to the game that I love’ so I have somewhat seen the game from both sides…
So in my humble opinion, barring a certain and obvious few who I really cannot make my mind up about (Walton is one such individual, but to have an agenda means ironically that you would have to be really good at the profession which I simply don’t think that he is, on the other hand Clattenberg could just be, as he is a potentially good official and was regarded as the brightest ref to come out of England until a few years ago when he was attached to some sort of scandal!!)
I really don’t believe that there is an ‘agenda’ from refs, its simple incompetence; with the ‘country’s best ref’ Howard Webb (whom I met after the game against Chelski at home a couple of seasons back and found him a very nice and easy to talk to down to earth sort of a chap) making less mistakes than anyone else….. Last night, one of the worse ref’s in the league IMO gave a shocking decision which simply killed us!
For any penalty a ref has to ask him(or her!)self the following questions;
1. Was it a deliberate act; i.e. did the hand move towards the ball at all – so last night…NO! (ball to hand or hand to ball scenario)
2. Did the player seek to gain an obvious advantage = difficult one this as you are usually second guessing, but last night a resounding ……NO!
3. Was it a ”DOGSO” (Deny Obvious Goal Scoring Opportunity!) = last night probably…… but again, back to point 1, not a deliberate act!!
4. And last and by no means least, if there is any doubt whatsoever, you cannot award the pen = So, last night……..well there was plenty of doubt for sure! The fact that Micah’s arm was not raised significantly and the fact that the ball deflected up off his boot, means that this was a complete accident and in no way a deliberate act = NO PENALTY!!
Like I said, no agenda in my opinion, just total ineptness on the part of a very poor referee, symptomatic of the standard in general right now..
es1
Well-Known Member
Mike D said:They would get a lot more respect if they came out and said whether they thought they had made an error of judgement but they don't. They are like traffic wardens thinking that they are control freaks who love being the centre of attention.
i agree, it's not that they don't or won't (several refs would like to given the chance), its that they're not allowed to by the FA (halsey did it a few years ago when there wasnt a rule in place and messed up infront of the cameras)
brian the blue
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What gets me, is that our players probably show them the most respect in the league, we rarely hound officials, we rarely complain over and over again, we never try to cheat the officials into a decision... But in return we get shown the least respect by them. They constantly look like they are waiting for something to happen where they can get away with giving a penalty/a sending off/a silly booking/stupid free-kicks for none events etc against us.
They way United treat officials is a disgrace and they get all the decisions because they are all shit scared of that drunk scottish bastard in charge of them.
They way United treat officials is a disgrace and they get all the decisions because they are all shit scared of that drunk scottish bastard in charge of them.
cyprustavern
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If as Dowd demonstrated he believed Richards had raised both arms deliberately above his head in an obvious attempt to handball it begs the question WHY was there no card shown as per the RULES of the game?
It really isnt hard to come to the conclusion that it was a slight chance of gifting a penalty that he could have some sort of half arsed justification of doing so and that is what happened no ifs no buts no maybes.
..and as crafty,premeditated and blatant a kick to the back of Edins calf by that dirty bastard Adam obviously missed( lets say by the speed of the game shall we as its a handy excuse ).
It really isnt hard to come to the conclusion that it was a slight chance of gifting a penalty that he could have some sort of half arsed justification of doing so and that is what happened no ifs no buts no maybes.
..and as crafty,premeditated and blatant a kick to the back of Edins calf by that dirty bastard Adam obviously missed( lets say by the speed of the game shall we as its a handy excuse ).
eshiers1 said:you do all realise that without these referees there would be no game of football??
how do you know for sure that webb/clattenerg saw those incidents?? you dont, you're just guessing from a video that can not possibly be conclusive
What is conclusive, is that Webb saw the incident (at normal speed) and was happy with it. Following the subsequent media furore, (and probable pressure from the FA, having viewed it x times in super slo mo, he issued a retrospective red). If it was so clear cut (it wasnt!) why did it take the FA unti gone 7pm to charge Mario. Webb should have been brave and honest enough to say he had seen it at normal speed.......and was happy no card was needed.
Retrospective trial by video (and media) is morally wrong, unless it is used equally for all cases (it isnt) and grotesquely distorts the so called level playing field.
Do you really want me to expand on Twattenberg?
There should be a new FA Campaign called "Respect the Fans" it's true to say that there would be no football without refs, but there wouldn't without Fans either.
Refs can make mistakes, I can live with that, but stupid 'mistakes' last night have cost us fans a day out a Wembley. Vinnies sending off and other woeful refing decisions had my 9 year old almost in tears, not because the scum were beating us but because he was, like us all, so frustrated with what was going on.
It's time to either; accept that the game's moved on and 1 ref on the pitch can't cope, in which case you need one ref in each half - like they did with Linesmen where they get half a pitch each instead of the whole lot; or you have to bring in the video ref, be that a restricted and selective Hawk Eye like Cricket and Tennis or Rugby style with a man in the stands helping the ref out with the big ones.
Failing that get rid of all the cameras with super slow-mo, covering every single angle and then accept that the ref's decision is final and stop raking over every single decision for hours on end on every football show on the box.
One things for sure though, this crap is ruing football for me!
Refs can make mistakes, I can live with that, but stupid 'mistakes' last night have cost us fans a day out a Wembley. Vinnies sending off and other woeful refing decisions had my 9 year old almost in tears, not because the scum were beating us but because he was, like us all, so frustrated with what was going on.
It's time to either; accept that the game's moved on and 1 ref on the pitch can't cope, in which case you need one ref in each half - like they did with Linesmen where they get half a pitch each instead of the whole lot; or you have to bring in the video ref, be that a restricted and selective Hawk Eye like Cricket and Tennis or Rugby style with a man in the stands helping the ref out with the big ones.
Failing that get rid of all the cameras with super slow-mo, covering every single angle and then accept that the ref's decision is final and stop raking over every single decision for hours on end on every football show on the box.
One things for sure though, this crap is ruing football for me!
richardtheref
Well-Known Member
As a referee who refs in the Northern League and an assistant in the Unibond and Premier League reserves if i fall below a certain level i will get demoted. This does not appear to happen in the Premier League, very few get booted off. I have asked an assessor who im quite friendly with what he would have given Dowd last night. He said that he got both of the critical incidents wrong (the penalty calls), also carded Kolarov when he had been fouled although this would have been left to Dowds interpretation. Felt Bellamy should have been cautioned for dissent, Aguero as well for kicking the ball away when we were leading 2-1. Said his main problem was the way he demonstrated why he had given the penalty as replays showed Micah had not raised his hands anyway. This goes against what you are told in training. Says his positives were his fitness and proximity to play. Said the most he could give him was a 65/100 which at my level would mean a call to the league committee to explian myself. Again i'm sure this does not happen at this level as it would mean that you were admitting you had appointed a numpty to ref in the Premier league