Russian invasion of Ukraine

[denislawsbackheel]

It had massive problems in arid environments and really challenged across a number of continents.

The newer version, of which we will have not too many, will be very good because the government want to sell it around the world and will have many updates due to it going away from government owned contracts.

Reality is that the MBT is outdated equipment in modern warfare, and is only used as a deterrent against an old order, rather than todays wars.

We’ll have 150.
A weeks worth in Ukraine.

 

[cleavers]

Looks like Ukraine might have had a significant resupply of something big this evening (anti aircraft ?), a Bermudian leased (to Azerbaijan's Silkway airline) cargo 747 flew from Chicago to Rzeszow in Poland (nearest airport to Ukraine).

 

[domalino]

Absolutely agree. Punishing Germans for WWI was the direct cause of the second. Rebuilding Germany post WWII, the Marshall
Plan and brought them into the fold!

You guys seem completely oblivious that Germany paid absolutely insane amounts of reperations after WW2? Especially to the USA who took all their patents and Intellectual property in lieu of some cash.

The Marshall plan was not about Germany, it was about Russia. The US were trying to prevent communism spreading and they needed German natural resources to stop France in particular from falling in with Russia.

The post WW2 French government really threw its weight around in regards to US support - they even threatened if they didn't get US help in Vietnam to preserve their empire, they would fall in with the USSR, not NATO - and that lead directly to the Vietnam War!

 

[cleavers]

Zelensky and the Ukrainian government have been really clear over and over that they aren't giving up their land to Russia.

Yes they have, but they effectively gave these up years ago, and the majority of the people living in these areas seem to have accepted it without to much fight.

I don't think they should, but I can see why they might, if they get back the areas taken by moscow in the last 3 weeks, and moscow remains a pariah.

 

[domalino]

It had massive problems in arid environments and really challenged across a number of continents.

The newer version, of which we will have not too many, will be very good because the government want to sell it around the world and will have many updates due to it going away from government owned contracts.

Reality is that the MBT is outdated equipment in modern warfare, and is only used as a deterrent against an old order, rather than todays wars.

It seems out of date now, but these things can change pretty quickly.

Imagine a tank with a small drone escorting it, using thermal imagery to identify enemy MANPAD operators before they get in range.

Defensive rocket systems will be developed to combat the attack from above style generation of MANPAD.

These things are always a seesaw.

 

[domalino]

Yes they have, but they effectively gave these up years ago, and the majority of the people living in these areas seem to have accepted it without to much fight.

Again this is a lie and Russian propaganda, I don't know how it's spread this way.

They have never given anything up, they've been fighting a civil war over them for 8 years, and the people there have been subject to totalitarian oppression to keep them rebelling.

There's been loads of accounts that the awful things happening in Luhansk and Donetsk are one of the prime reasons the fighting in South Ukraine has been so fierce - those people desperately do not want to have the same fate.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

QT is very interesting tonight.

 

[Vic]

Did we actually export the goods, the article says licences were granted to export £3.7 millions worth but doesn't know whether they were actually sent, strange if the don't know but print it anyway.

What, print that the government issued licences to sell weapons to Russia, but don't print it because the arms dealers might not have used the licences they applied for?

Let's face it, the arms trade (and the government) have the same motto, "if we didn't sell it, someone else would" and we've never had much moral compunction about arming nasty regimes (including stuff for internal repression).

 

[i kne albert davy]

It had massive problems in arid environments and really challenged across a number of continents.

The newer version, of which we will have not too many, will be very good because the government want to sell it around the world and will have many updates due to it going away from government owned contracts.

Reality is that the MBT is outdated equipment in modern warfare, and is only used as a deterrent against an old order, rather than todays wars.

Give over its reliability issue's in arid environments were cured well before the 1st gulf war, its survivability under attack is as good as any AFV in the world, certainly better than anything Russia can field,it is ageing now but the latest upgrades on going should extend it's operational life. Unfortunately I don't think we have the people or the capabilities to build a completely new AFV.

 

[cleavers]

Again this is a lie and Russian propaganda, I don't know how it's spread this way.

They have never given anything up, they've been fighting a civil war over them for 8 years, and the people there have been subject to totalitarian oppression to keep them rebelling.

There's been loads of accounts that the awful things happening in Luhansk and Donetsk are one of the prime reasons the fighting in South Ukraine has been so fierce - those people desperately do not want to have the same fate.

You can try and start an argument if you like, but I said "effectively" so it's not a "lie", and I indicated in my post "I don't think they should", and I don't.