Russian invasion of Ukraine

[BlueAnorak]

I'm not up for a debate about this (I'm not knowledgeable enough) but I think if this resolves peacefully Britain should re-join the EU and take a leading role in massively building up EU military conventional defenses.

I didnt have a vote but I tended towards Brexit. I've completely changed my mind after this.

Nah. NATO is the bedrock our defence - not the EU.

 

[Octavian]

Trump to an extent had a go at taking over his own country.

You are right though, can't lose sight of the fact he invaded a sovereign country, is threatening others, and hinting at the world that he would use nukes against anyone.

I think it’s a lot worse than what Trump has done and Johnson hasn’t done comparable to either.

 

[OB1]

Don't know if you've read this article?

Ukraine invasion: Would Putin press the nuclear button? - BBC News

And in particular this bit:

If Vladimir Putin did choose a nuclear option, would anyone in his close circle try to dissuade him? Or stop him?
"Russia's political elites are never with the people," says Nobel laureate Dmitry Muratov. "They always take the side of the ruler."

And in Vladimir Putin's Russia the ruler is all-powerful. This is a country with few checks and balances; it's the Kremlin that calls the shots.

"No one is ready to stand up to Putin," says Pavel Felgenhauer. "We're in a dangerous spot."

It's a chilling article.

You missed out this bit: "Another option is to explode a nuclear weapon somewhere over the North Sea between Britain and Denmark and see what happens."

Have to hope that maybe some of his senior militarty are not so enamoured of the leader.

 

[Chippy_boy]

The thing is that he doesn’t want to level Kiev

But he could explode a nuke over the North Sea, for example, to send a very loud message to the west to back off. In fact, very worryingly, I am half expecting it now.

EDIT: @OB1 - no, I didn't miss it ;-)

 

[jaseirai]

I'm not up for a debate about this (I'm not knowledgeable enough) but I think if this resolves peacefully Britain should re-join the EU and take a leading role in massively building up EU military conventional defenses.

I didnt have a vote but I tended towards Brexit. I've completely changed my mind after this.

German utility companies dutifully paid Gazprom $220 million yesterday.
I think we’ll stay away from the mercantilist twats thanks.

 

[metalblue]

His inner circle just do what he tells them.

If he wants their opinion he’ll give it to them type of thing ;)

 

[Octavian]

The thing is that he doesn’t want to level Kiev

The fact that he hasn’t gone for this approach makes me think there’s some level of sanity still there and that’s a good sign.

The nuclear alert stuff is posturing, the coward won’t even let his advisers sit near him because he’s scared of Covid still, he’s not going to be then willing to die in a nuclear attack if he’s scared of getting Covid.

 

[metalblue]

But he could explode a nuke over the North Sea, for example, to send a very loud message to the west to back off. In fact, very worryingly, I am half expecting it now.

EDIT: @OB1 - no, I didn't miss it ;-)

Not a chance. An incoming missile will be seen as a threat and the UK would retaliate before he had a chance to explode it over the North Sea and shout “gotcha”

 

[ChicagoBlue]

The scary part is how badly does it have to be going before he decides if he can’t have it, nobody is going to want it…and starts obliterating it?

Fingers and toes crossed it never gets that bad and common sense prevails.

He has a way out, but it’s a propaganda nightmare…

Declare the emergency action to protect Russians in Ukraine a success and turn around and leave the country, while holding onto the Donbas & Crimea. Declare victory and heap praise on the brave forces that helped protect Russians.

Does he have it in him to de-escalate, ir does he only understand escalation to secure his goals, even if it cuts his nose off to spite his face?

 

[Octavian]

I'm not up for a debate about this (I'm not knowledgeable enough) but I think if this resolves peacefully Britain should re-join the EU and take a leading role in massively building up EU military conventional defenses.

I didnt have a vote but I tended towards Brexit. I've completely changed my mind after this.

It’s NATO that’s been united throughout this and where defence really matters. Putin’s actions has hopefully given NATO a bit of a boost in cooperation and we’ll move out of this with less bickering with the EU.

It’s clear liberal democracy, that we all cherish, is only secure if we have a strong defence and work together.