Russian invasion of Ukraine

Today is the first day I've listened to wall to wall coverage and I am starting to get really frightened, not for me, but for my girls and perhaps I'm scared because it is rolling news
But I'm starting to think the only way out of this without a nuke is we reach out to the Russian hierarchy to assassinate Putin
 
bluesteel said:
I think there’s been a logical, methodical plan that goes back a very long way, at least to 2007 when he put the world, and certainly Europe, on notice that Moscow would not accept the further expansion of NATO. And then within a year in 2008 NATO gave an open door to Georgia and Ukraine. It absolutely goes back to that juncture.

Back then I was a national intelligence officer, and the National Intelligence Council was analyzing what Russia was likely to do in response to the NATO Open Door declaration. One of our assessments was that there was a real, genuine risk of some kind of preemptive Russian military action, not just confined to the annexation of Crimea, but some much larger action taken against Ukraine along with Georgia. And of course, four months after NATO’s Bucharest Summit, there was the invasion of Georgia. There wasn’t an invasion of Ukraine then because the Ukrainian government pulled back from seeking NATO membership.”

And you clearly say:

SWP's back said:
The illegal invasion of Ukraine has NOTHING to do with NATO.

Not me embarrassing myself. That’s just you reading the bits you want to read and acting like a prick, there is a lot more to this that just NATO/Georgia/Ukraine, but you've constantly spouted shit like above (and below) on this thread ignoring key aspects of what is going on.

See this, same article

"Putin tried to warn Trump about this, but I don’t think Trump figured out what he was saying. In one of the last meetings between Putin and Trump when I was there, Putin was making the point that: “Well you know, Donald, we have these hypersonic missiles.” And Trump was saying, “Well, we will get them too.” Putin was saying, “Well, yes, you will get them eventually, but we’ve got them first.” There was a menace in this exchange. Putin was putting us on notice that if push came to shove in some confrontational environment that the nuclear option would be on the table."


Your response:

"That’s also bollocks.

Fuck me the absolute state of this thread."
Click to expand...

Same article

“Putin doesn’t even seem like he’s trying to make a convincing case. We saw the same thing in the Russian response at the United Nations. The justification has essentially been “what-about-ism”: ‘You guys have been invading Iraq, Afghanistan. Don’t tell me that I can’t do the same thing in Ukraine.’”

It seems you’re attempting to make a more convincing case than Putin, and it’s his war. I get it you want to see why we are to blame but there is an area between empathy and foolish denial and, respectfully, I think you’ve slipped into the latter chasing this particular rabbit down its hole.
 
world externally and internally is closing in on Putin

www.forbes.com

More Russian Billionaires Speak Out Against Putin’s War On Ukraine

In an unprecedented stand against Putin, at least half a dozen Russian billionaires—including those who have been loyal to the Russian leader in the past—have recently called for peace as the U.S. and Europe impose sanctions on their assets.
www.forbes.com www.forbes.com
 
By all accounts Putin made 3 demands in the peace talks, for Ukraine to disarm, to remain neutral in disagreements with the west and recognise Crimea as part of Russia. To those with better knowledge of all this than me, is there much chance of Ukraine agreeing to these demands and if not, why not?
 
metalblue said:
Same article

“Putin doesn’t even seem like he’s trying to make a convincing case. We saw the same thing in the Russian response at the United Nations. The justification has essentially been “what-about-ism”: ‘You guys have been invading Iraq, Afghanistan. Don’t tell me that I can’t do the same thing in Ukraine.’”

It seems you’re attempting to make a more convincing case than Putin, and it’s his war. I get it you want to see why we are to blame but there is an area between empathy and foolish denial and, respectfully, I think you’ve slipped into the latter chasing this particular rabbit down its hole.
Click to expand...
You’ll have to tell me about this “respectfully” stuff some day. Looks weird.
 
AlgarveBlu said:
I think this exchange between Johnston and a distraught Ukrainian reporter pretty much sums up where we are on the military side of matters unfortunately


Click to expand...


I fucking feel for her, I really do. But you know what, I feel for him too. For having to take, and answer, that completely valid question.

And you know what, I give him credit for a very difficult and blunt answer too, delivered reasonably sensitively given the reality of the situation.

It is, what it is, a total fuck of a circumstance. It is not new, however difficult it is, and there really is nobody that doesnt suffer.
 
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