Sajid Javid

[urban genie]

So you can not answer such a simple question ?.

Yours, despite being no more than a wriggle to avoid answering mine, is easy.

This country, like all member countries, got some benefit from what was a trade zone before it morphed into a political ideology, it also suffered the losses in heavy engineering/ steel production/fishing/agriculture to pander to the protective policies of France/Germany, to try and attribute our position in the world to EU membership is so simplistic as to be borderline retarded.

We sold off all our industries and destroyed our manufacturing base, knowing that under EEC then EU rules we couldn't re-invest in or protect, you cnnot blame that on the french or germans.

We are leaving so why would the people we are fucking off give us what we want? Becuse we buy of them and sell them stuff, we will still buy off them and sell them stuff after, becuse we will need the trade and the goods.

We got ourselves into this mess because the of a set of people (fararge, johnson mogg etc) who live in this fantasy version of the british empire they think still exists.

We are the 6th richest natiob in tge world, yet we treat it's people as second class citizens, we are the 6th richest nation in the world, yet we cannot even negotiate a deal, our government has have majorlyfucked up this proccess and to think the EU would fall into line well then If anyone is being simplistic about this it is probably you.

 

[blueonblue]

So, it's not true then? We are not one of the best countries in the world and you call me a idiot?

How about you answer the simple question I posed ?, it seems you need things spelling out, so yes, we are one of the best countries in the world, and my exact words were "To try and attribute our position in the world to EU membership is so simplistic as to be borderline retarded", hardly calling you a idiot unless you are admitting your views are so simplistic.

 

[Chippy_boy]

You are right about their philosophy. Spending cuts were necessary,(wrongly dubbed austerity) but, typically, they fell on the poorest, weakest section of society. Did Tories realise how just many families would be pushed into poverty, or did they just not care? Baffles me...why would anybody, whatever their philosophy, produce a society as seemingly uncaring as we now are?
The bedroom tax sums it up.....move to a smaller house or pay a premium.....ok, where are the smaller social houses?
PS Edit. I'm mad as hell, and I just can't take it any more. Never been so angry at politics. Hungry children, what a disgrace.

How would you suggest you cut the benefits of people NOT on benefits?

Better off people don't get money spent on them (other than the NHS), so spending cuts necessarily fall on the poorest, don't they? How do you cut spending, without impacting poor people?

 

[johnnytapia]

This country is one of the top 6 nations in the world. Is that because we are in the EU or outside? Don't take to long to work that out.

Top 6 at what?
We're 20th for life expectancy. Behind the economic behemoths of Malta and Iceland.
9th for living standards, again, behind the political powerhouses that are Norway, Sweden, Switzerland and Denmark.

 

[Fred_Quimby]

How about you answer the simple question I posed ?, it seems you need things spelling out, so yes, we are one of the best countries in the world, and my exact words were "To try and attribute our position in the world to EU membership is so simplistic as to be borderline retarded", hardly calling you a idiot unless you are admitting your views are so simplistic.

To answer question then. Why is it simplistic to attribute our position in the world to our EU membership? It is true after all. Or do you attribute it to something else entirely? Perhaps the weather or the way we play football?

 

[Fred_Quimby]

Top 6 at what?
We're 20th for life expectancy. Behind the economic behemoths of Malta and Iceland.
9th for living standards, again, behind the political powerhouses that are Norway, Sweden, Switzerland and Denmark.

Economically we are. The factors that you speak of are entirely in our own hands or should I say the Tory Government hands which just about says it all really.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Top 6 at what?
We're 20th for life expectancy. Behind the economic behemoths of Malta and Iceland.
9th for living standards, again, behind the political powerhouses that are Norway, Sweden, Switzerland and Denmark.

tbf, you’d expect life expectancy to be higher in Iceland.

 

[blueonblue]

We sold off all our industries and destroyed our manufacturing base, knowing that under EEC then EU rules we couldn't re-invest in or protect, you cnnot blame that on the french or germans.

I most certainly do neither, I blame the corrupt shower of wankstains that have passed themselves off as politicians (Of both parties) with no other motive than to ensure their future on the public tit long after being voted out of office here.

Trying to portray this as a one sided problem is utter shite, the EU member countries know this, its past time to get f*cking real, we are leaving, either sit down in good faith and sort the detail's out, or f*ck off and see how long before the EU fractures and individual countries see the light.

 

[blueonblue]

To answer question then. Why is it simplistic to attribute our position in the world to our EU membership? It is true after all. Or do you attribute it to something else entirely? Perhaps the weather or the way we play football?

Thats four times you have dodged answering my simple question, how about you try instead of waffling.

 

[urban genie]

I most certainly do neither, I blame the corrupt shower of wankstains that have passed themselves off as politicians (Of both parties) with no other motive than to ensure their future on the public tit long after being voted out of office here.

Trying to portray this as a one sided problem is utter shite, the EU member countries know this, its past time to get f*cking real, we are leaving, either sit down in good faith and sort the detail's out, or f*ck off and see how long before the EU fractures and individual countries see the light.

Who said it was one sided? Not me.
Who said I don't want to leave? Not me

But what you quoted of mine is true, we flogged our national industries and let our manurfactoring base dwindle, that is our fault not europes

 

[blueonblue]

But what you quoted of mine is true, we flogged our national industries and let our manurfactoring base dwindle, that is our fault not europes

The EU had the plan of dividing up europe along the lines of Germany getting heavy engineering/chemicals/car manufacturing, France agriculture, Spain and co fishing, with the rest providing cheap labour/customers, we got financial services and a few other crumbs.

It is the politicians that went along with this, but it was the EU that empowered it.

 

[bluethrunthru]

The EU had the plan of dividing up europe along the lines of Germany getting heavy engineering/chemicals/car manufacturing, France agriculture, Spain and co fishing, with the rest providing cheap labour/customers, we got financial services and a few other crumbs.

It is the politicians that went along with this, but it was the EU that empowered it.

where was that plan published?

 

[KS55]

How would you suggest you cut the benefits of people NOT on benefits?

Better off people don't get money spent on them (other than the NHS), so spending cuts necessarily fall on the poorest, don't they? How do you cut spending, without impacting poor people?

You are assuming that cuts to benefits is where the burden should lie.
Plenty of candidates other than the poorest, but if you want to cut benefits, how about those couples earning 40, 000 plus who can claim family income supplement. I myself am entitled to disability living allowance merely because I need a handle to get out of the bath and sometimes walk with a stick, but I woulnt say I was disabled.
But the real burden should be born by the strongest, and taxation is the surest way to cut spending.

 

[Chippy_boy]

But the real burden should be born by the strongest, and taxation is the surest way to cut spending.

Run that by me again? How do you cut spending by taxation?

 

[KS55]

Run that by me again? How do you cut spending by taxation?

Dear me. See net spend, deficit, etc.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Dear me. See net spend, deficit, etc.

As I say, how do you cut spending by taxation? When you're ready...

 

[Bert Trautmanns Helemet]

So rumours going round that if May is kicked to the kerb that Sajid is the most likely to get the support of most tories as a a middle of the road candidate between the hard line nuttters and passionate remainers.
Now it's no secret that he wants the job anyway, so let's look at mans record.

• Almost always voted for reducing housing benefit for social tenants deemed to have excess bedrooms (which Labour describe as the "bedroom tax")
• Consistently voted against paying higher benefits over longer periods for those unable to work due to illness or disability
  
• Almost always voted against spending public money to create guaranteed jobs for young people who have spent a long time unemployed
  
• Almost always voted for raising the threshold at which people start to pay income tax
  
• Almost always voted for increasing the rate of VAT
  
• Consistently voted for higher taxes on plane tickets
  
• Almost always voted against increasing the tax rate applied to income over £150,000
  
• Almost always voted against a banker’s bonus tax
  
• Almost always voted for more restrictive regulation of trade union activity
  
• Consistently voted for reforming the NHS so GPs buy services on behalf of their patients
  
• Voted for raising England’s undergraduate tuition fee cap to £9,000 per year
  
• Almost always voted for academy schools
  
• Consistently voted for mass surveillance of people’s communications and activities
  
• Consistently voted for merging police and fire services under Police and Crime Commissioners
  
• Generally voted against measures to prevent climate change
  
• Generally voted against a publicly owned railway system, almost always voted against slowing the rise in rail fares
  
• Generally voted against greater regulation of gambling
  
• Almost always voted for restricting the scope of legal aid
  
• Consistently voted for the privatisation of Royal Mail

All these facts are available online, but looking at it..


Nah he is worse than May in fact he is a terrible person

GE or nothing, no other tory should be appointed to deal with this without the countries approval

I like him.

 

[denislawsbackheel]

The EU had the plan of dividing up europe along the lines of Germany getting heavy engineering/chemicals/car manufacturing, France agriculture, Spain and co fishing, with the rest providing cheap labour/customers, we got financial services and a few other crumbs.

It is the politicians that went along with this, but it was the EU that empowered it.

Fucking bollocks

 

[denislawsbackheel]

You are assuming that cuts to benefits is where the burden should lie.
Plenty of candidates other than the poorest, but if you want to cut benefits, how about those couples earning 40, 000 plus who can claim family income supplement. I myself am entitled to disability living allowance merely because I need a handle to get out of the bath and sometimes walk with a stick, but I woulnt say I was disabled.
But the real burden should be born by the strongest, and taxation is the surest way to cut spending.

As an expert on PIP and it’s application rules (DLA was abolished years ago) would you please tell me what level of PIP you get and in which category and where you went for your mandatory PIP interview?
Because what you describe would not qualify you for either DLA and certainly not it’s replacement PIP.

Or are you a “I could get it but I don’t” bullshitter?

 

[KS55]

As an expert on PIP and it’s application rules (DLA was abolished years ago) would you please tell me what level of PIP you get and in which category and where you went for your mandatory PIP interview?
Because what you describe would not qualify you for either DLA and certainly not it’s replacement PIP.

Or are you a “I could get it but I don’t” bullshitter?

Dont call me a bullshitter. I was advised some years ago, when my condition was diagnosed (I could not actually walk at the time) to apply for DLA, and was told that certain difficulties or needs (such as I quoted) were used as evidence.
Thankfully, my treatment regime has given me great respite and I function normally. I am also fortunate to enjoy a generous occupational pension and I would feel most uncomfortable claiming a benefit I dont need. Apologies if my understanding is out of date, but that's as it was at the time.
My point(in answer to another poster) was that I conceded his argument that there are some genuine savings to be had in the area of benefits, but without them falling on the weakest.
Get off your high horse, and be civil.