Serious question relating to us and FFP(update P17)

Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

i cant see why teams would be in favor of this, it would kill the premier league, the only team it benefits is man utd, hope our owners dont stand for this if it comes into effect.
 
Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

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Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

SuperMario's Fireworks. said:
i cant see why teams would be in favor of this, it would kill the premier league, the only team it benefits is man utd, hope our owners dont stand for this if it comes into effect.

Don´t be daft, it will benefit all clubs with a lot of revenue, us amongst them.

As for the others, for them it´s no longer a matter of survival of the fittest. It´s just plain survival.
They are giving up trying to compete we might say.
 
Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

Just to put things into perspective. If wage rises were restricted to 10% in 2000/01 we would currently be allowed to pay a maximum of just under £57m a year on wages. This would be an increase of £38m in 12 years.

Chelsea would now be able to pay a maximum of £157m a year on wages, an increase of £107m in 12 years.

The ability of either club to pay those wages is not a consideration.

And people have the nerve to say that FFP enhances competiteness.
 
Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

moomba said:
Just to put things into perspective. If wage rises were restricted to 10% in 2000/01 we would currently be allowed to pay a maximum of just under £57m a year on wages. This would be an increase of £38m in 12 years.

Chelsea would now be able to pay a maximum of £157m a year on wages, an increase of £107m in 12 years.

The ability of either club to pay those wages is not a consideration.

And people have the nerve to say that FFP enhances competiteness.

Where did you read that the base for wage increases is 2000/1???? My understanding is that a percentage increase would mean that City were allowed an increase on a figure that is already over £200 million pa!! This would, of course, be subject to the "break even" rule!! The whole thing is nonsense.

But I go back to the wording of our Competition Act and the EC Treaty which prohibit agreements which limit or control investment. By this agreement the gang of four clearly limit investment by shareholders/owners to £105 million ponds over three years, then forbid it altogether. The courts have shown that they do not accept that football is a "special case", both over Bosman and squad composition, and that the law applies in full to football. If the gang of four wish to impose these rules they have to prove that the rules contribute "to improving the production or distribution of goods or to promoting technical or economic progress, while allowing consumers a fair share of the resulting benefit, and which does not:
(a) impose on the undertakings concerned restrictions which are not indispensable to the attainment of these objectives;
(b) afford such undertakings the possibility of eliminating competition in respect of a substantial part of the products in question."

There are obvious and enormous problems here. It is hard, if not impossible, to see what improvements "the production or distribution of goods" are intended or would result, and when one gets to "promoting technical or economic progress the difficulties really mount! And then we get to the "consumers" who have to be treated to "a fair share of the resulting benefit". Consumers would appear to have to include those who watch football. No mention is made of ticket prices and no consideration at all given to fans. The only benefit envisaged appears to be even more bumper TV deals (benefitting whom?), but the argument would be that this would result in much higher subscriptions and ticket prices, and possibly much lower attendances at some clubs' matches!

But the real crunch comes with a claim for exclusion under (b). Roughly translated it says, "if you've got together as a cartel and drawn up an agreement aintended to prevent other businesses competing in the market, FORGET IT." It may be that some form of financial regulation is necessary and may be consistent with the law, but these regulations, and Platini's, are clearly not and will not stand up.
 
Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

cookster said:
The premier league will be a watered down version of UEFA's so what's the problem?

Exactly, so if we're already working towards UEFA's stricter regs then a more lenient set of FFP rules in the Premier League will be irrelevant to us.

The wider issue though is that it pretty much shuts the door on any club wanting to invest heavily in future. From a purely selfish point of view I shouldn't really be arsed about that as we've seemingly got in before the ladder was pulled up, but looking at it from a neutral standpoint it's blatantly unfair that no other club will be able to seriously benefit from outside investment in future. Perhaps that's why we're opposed to these rules whereas United, Arsenal, Liverpool, and Chelsea are showing their hypocritical side in supporting them, ie: "It was ok for us to have a rich owner investing in our club, but it's not ok for anyone else to do it in future".

It fucking stinks.
 
Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

BluessinceHydeRoad said:
Where did you read that the base for wage increases is 2000/1???? My understanding is that a percentage increase would mean that City were allowed an increase on a figure that is already over £200 million pa!! This would, of course, be subject to the "break even" rule!! The whole thing is nonsense.

I didn't read that the base for wage increases is 2000/01, nor did I suggest that would be the case. I used those figures because I had the wage figures to hand from 2000/01 and it was to illustrate that 10% limits can mean very different things to different clubs.

I have no concern about 10% wage rises for us, we're in a better position than anyone. But I suspect that rather than looking to increase our wage bill we will be looking to decrease it in the next few years. The teams that will be hurt are the ones with a wage bill of £35-60m. They'll never be able to catch up. Maybe their owners are happy with that cause the money keeps rolling in for them. But I feel sorry for their supporters.
 
Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

If they honestly wanted PL FFP for the good of the game and not to protect thier own interests how about season tickets capped. How is it FFP when London clubs charge 4-5 times what we do.
But as long as our revenue increases, with more sponserships (perhaps a traning kit one next like DHL and Utd) i think we will be okay.

All the blah blah blah "city will fail" "uefa will look inyo city" in the press, how comes no one has mentioned Utd overinflated sponsership with the USA car manufacturer, one that got the person who did the deal the sack
 
Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

If FFP did happen to be adopted by the Premier League, I fail to see how it could ever be religiously adhered to. It is OK for the likes of Arsenal, Spuds, Chelsea and Manure to relish it as they have had either a long run of European campaigns or London pricing to help them build up their commercial success, something that is only a dream for clubs in the more deprived areas of the country. But if we look at it logically and think that ONLY ONE CLUB can win the title, yet THREE CLUBS WILL BE RELEGATED and will face a severe drop in income, then how would clubs like QPR fare with these rules after going on a spree to keep their status? There is going to be a huge fall off in income for relegated teams with the new TV deal soon to kick in, and ALL CLUBS, not just those mentioned above, are desperate to be part of it. And if that means spending wildly to remain part of that elite, then spending is what they will do.
 
Re: Serious question relating to us and FFP

The first rule of negotiation is to let the other party think they are still getting the better end of any deal.

UEFA and the Premier League are soon to fall for the biggest sucker punch in football history.

And when those plans are released, and the reality sets in, all we will hear is piss and wind, piss and wind.

In three years our turnover will be closer to Real Madrid than United.
 

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