Smoke bombs yet again

[alblue]

How didn't you read the posts earlier how it burnt a younger persons throut it ,luckily I put her scarf round her face and the steward took it out

Better not take her out on bonfire night.

 

[blue b4 the moon]

I wonder how many people died...
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=HLf6AyJqw74" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... Lf6AyJqw74</a>

They're brilliant imo and add so much to the atmosphere.

Yeah cos when our fans let them off they look just like that only blue........

A bit less time queuing for beer whilst the game is on and a bit more actual singing may be the answer to improve atmos.

Not a dig particularly at you deafguy but the British fan is nothing like that. i was going to say anymore but in truth we've never been like that and never will. For example Aris fans smoking in the stands, much too scary for the Stewards to sort out...anything in our end they're in there remember the guy with the Feyonord shirt? Do you think an Ajax fan with a rag shirt would have been shifted? We've just got a few wanna be's who think its great to act the big nob and fuck everybody else.

 

[lancs blue]

I know you didn't mean it that way Skashion but that sentence could have been applied to events at Hillsborough. The whole post-Hillsborough re-evaluation of football grounds was intended to make them safer for EVERYONE who attends them, should we really go back (or maybe we already have gone back) to making them less safe?

I'm not well-read on this subject but wasn't it a giant police fuck up?

Yes but it also revolved around the lack of basic safety features at the Leppings Lane End, the lack of space around the turnstiles outside, the lateral fences which prevented fans leaving the central pens where the worst of the crushing took place, the locked exit gates at the front of the terraces preventing fans escaping onto the pitch until it was too late - even with the police fuck-up the disaster need not have happened. Also a few years previously we'd had the Bradford fire which again exposed the lack of any real fire precautions in old wooden stands, another safety issue ignored. Many fans over 40 are not that keen on all the seemingly overbearing safety measures nowadays but equally we wouldn't want to go back to the situation in the 80s either.

 

[Skashion]

Yes but it also revolved around the lack of basic safety features at the Leppings Lane End, the lack of space around the turnstiles outside, the lateral fences which prevented fans leaving the central pens where the worst of the crushing took place, the locked exit gates at the front of the terraces preventing fans escaping onto the pitch until it was too late - even with the police fuck-up the disaster need not have happened. Also a few years previously we'd had the Bradford fire which again exposed the lack of any real fire precautions in old wooden stands, another safety issue ignored. Many fans over 40 are not that keen on all the seemingly overbearing safety measures nowadays but equally we wouldn't want to go back to the situation in the 80s either.

I don't see any need to return to old stadia to be in favour of smoke bombs so I don't know what your point is. I would like safe standing but the Germans have proved you can do that in modern stadia anyway.

 

[Puppet Master Silva]

Smoke bombs and flares are incomparable IMO, shouldn't be let off in the concourse though that's far too enclosed. Leave it for the stands lads.

 

[lancs blue]

Yes but it also revolved around the lack of basic safety features at the Leppings Lane End, the lack of space around the turnstiles outside, the lateral fences which prevented fans leaving the central pens where the worst of the crushing took place, the locked exit gates at the front of the terraces preventing fans escaping onto the pitch until it was too late - even with the police fuck-up the disaster need not have happened. Also a few years previously we'd had the Bradford fire which again exposed the lack of any real fire precautions in old wooden stands, another safety issue ignored. Many fans over 40 are not that keen on all the seemingly overbearing safety measures nowadays but equally we wouldn't want to go back to the situation in the 80s either.

I don't see any need to return to old stadia to be in favour of smoke bombs so I don't know what your point is. I would like safe standing but the Germans have proved you can do that in modern stadia anyway.

My point was that you implied that there's a risk in taking a young child to an away game and I'm trying to point out the historical reasons why safety measures that may well seem OTT are taken to minimise such a risk. Post-Hillsborough changes were about removing as many safety risks to spectators as possible. Smoke bombs may well be a minor risk but the authorities most likely take the view that if smoke bombs are permitted some clowns will undoubtedly start with flares and powerful firecrackers which do represent a significant danger.

 

[cheddar404]

Shouldn't be set off in confined spaces as it's unpleasant but more the merrier for me. Looked great when Everton scored at our place and even when United did it in the carling cup. Adds to the sterile experience that English football has become. It's football, not the theatre. When my dad started taking me to away matches in the early 90s there was always a great deal of edge to proceedings. I know it's a bit of a backward way of looking at things if you look at it rationally but it was much more fun back then and much more like it is in some countries on the continent.

 

[Skashion]

My point was that you implied that there's a risk in taking a young child to an away game and I'm trying to point out the historical reasons why safety measures that may well seem OTT are taken to minimise such a risk. Post-Hillsborough changes were about removing as many safety risks to spectators as possible. Smoke bombs may well be a minor risk but the authorities most likely take the view that if smoke bombs are permitted some clowns will undoubtedly start with flares and powerful firecrackers which do represent a significant danger.

Pretty sure smoke bombs had nothing to do with Hillsborough or the Bradford Fire or any other major footballing disaster to my knowledge. In fact, pyrotechnics in general haven't. Although there have been a few deaths in other countries due to them. I think trying to create a link between the two is disingenuous as is connecting it with my argument. There's clear evidence for why crowd control measures are needed, why stadia safety regulations are needed. You are trying to create mutual exclusivity where there isn't any. I also think the slippery slope argument is a false one. In modern stadia with CCTV everywhere, picking out the people with flares or fireworks can be done with sufficient consistency when combined with punitive sentences as to be deincentivise their use. There's every reason to think that approach with smoke bombs too, although it's more difficult as they can be thrown with fairly selfless impunity vis-a-vis flares which are usually held up by the person responsible. However, I would object to punitive sentences for smoke bombs because I don't see them as dangerous.

 

[bernabias home shirt]

Durham & gough are debating this now
They are slating anyone who uses flares or smoke bombs.

 

[kinkysleftfoot]

My point was that you implied that there's a risk in taking a young child to an away game and I'm trying to point out the historical reasons why safety measures that may well seem OTT are taken to minimise such a risk. Post-Hillsborough changes were about removing as many safety risks to spectators as possible. Smoke bombs may well be a minor risk but the authorities most likely take the view that if smoke bombs are permitted some clowns will undoubtedly start with flares and powerful firecrackers which do represent a significant danger.

Pretty sure smoke bombs had nothing to do with Hillsborough or the Bradford Fire or any other major footballing disaster to my knowledge. In fact, pyrotechnics in general haven't. Although there have been a few deaths in other countries due to them. I think trying to create a link between the two is disingenuous as is connecting it with my argument. There's clear evidence for why crowd control measures are needed, why stadia safety regulations are needed. You are trying to create mutual exclusivity where there isn't any. I also think the slippery slope argument is a false one. In modern stadia with CCTV everywhere, picking out the people with flares or fireworks can be done with sufficient consistency when combined with punitive sentences as to be deincentivise their use. There's every reason to think that approach with smoke bombs too, although it's more difficult as they can be thrown with fairly selfless impunity vis-a-vis flares which are usually held up by the person responsible. However, I would object to punitive sentences for smoke bombs because I don't see them as dangerous.

Can't understand why people think this helps the atmosphere......act like idiots and we will be treated like idiots