so i'll ask again........

Can't believe the bile that was spouted yesterday, anyone would have thought that Mario had committed murder. He didn't even touch Parker's head anyway.
On another note, can we not recall Adebayor from Spurs? Even if we don't play him, take him back off Spurs, why should we do them any favours. We might need him on the bench and if we get any injuries during Mario's ban.
 
Henry Chinaski said:
cyprustavern said:
Henry Chinaski said:
I will keep this as simple as i can.


THERE IS NO AGENDA AGAINST US.

This kind of paranoia is embarrassing frankly. We are turning into scousers. Shall we have a minutes silence, or a candlelight vigil?

Mario was a grade A tool. He did try and stamp on Parker. As much as i love the guy, he was an idiot. And we really can have no complaints if/when he gets banned.

The end.



How the fuck do you know whether he did try or not ? Parker was right fuckin behind him if he wanted to stand on the twat im sure he could of done it for real and not in a half arsed way !

There can be no doubt that Mario tries to stamp on him. He does have a history of doing this type of thing.

He should have been sent off.

He wasnt.

He was brought down.

He scored the penalty.

Agenda my arse.

so why no charge for peter crouches eye gouge at the weekend? come on clever dick.
 
samharris said:
Chris in London said:
bluenose45 said:
If we put aside the 'incident', the issue is: have the FA and Howard Webb caved in to media pressure? Clearly seen, within the VT evidence used to charge the player, is Webb looking at the incident and waving play on. Therefore, he's either running blind or he's changed his report. That being the case we may as well let the media run the FA. Oh, perhaps they do!

Good question.

The video footage looks reasonably damning, in slo-mo, from the right angle, but as Lee Dixon said only Mario knows whether he intended a stamp or not. So let's imagine this scenario: the FA receive Howard Webb's report. In a nutshell, he says ' I saw it out of the corner of my eye, at the time I didn't think it was anything more than an accidental collision, but having seen the replays I'm not so sure.'

The FA committee who decide on charging look at it and think 'it may have been accidental but it looks malicious in slo-mo. There's a case to answer, let Mario answer it. If he persuades us there was no malice and it was accidental, he walks. But if it was deliberate, he has to be banned.' I can understand that: or at least, I can see the logic of that.

What I don't get is this.

During the VK appeal, an interesting little statistic popped up on the FA website which was that about 99% of misconduct charges that they bring (including violent conduct) result in the charge being upheld. There are however plenty of cases where you have to make a judgment on whether an action is intended maliciously or not. That overwhelming statistic suggests to me that where there is doubt, they give the player the benefit of the doubt by the FA simply not bringing the charge: they don't in general, say 'well there's a case to answer, let the commission decide one way or the other'. They only charge where there is overwhelming evidence.

Then there is Lescott. I simply don't see how it can possibly be said that the Balotelli stamp (if it was) discloses more of a case to answer than the Lescott elbow. The evidence is no more conclusive about alotelli, and no less conclusive about Lescott. As with Balotelli, only Lescott knows whether he intended to 'do' Kaboul. Yet the FA has decided to charge Balotelli but not Lescott.

Why is this?

Two realistic possibilities occur to me (I do not consider the 'because Lescott is English' argument).

The first is that the FA have decided that they can't charge Lescott as well because (a) it looks like an anti-City witchhunt to charge for two separate incidents from the same game when you stack it up alongside Kompany's ban, the soft red cards for Barry & Balotelli previously, when compared with the lack of charges over say Rooney's elbow, Huth's elbow in the Final, Huddlestone's stamp etc, and (b) because it makes Webb look like a real twat for missing two red card incidents in the same 10 minute period.

The second is that the Balotelli thing has been all over every sports news outlet far more than than Lescott's, presumably because it is Mario, perhaps also that he scored the winning goal.

Personally, I lean towards the latter. The outcry which followed Rooney's tirade at the camera led to the charge against him (which I'm sure was nothing at all to do with Sky being angry receiving thousands of complaints from angry parents whose young kids have just witnessed Roopney's outburst) because the FA would have looked weak if they hadn't charged him: likewise Adebayor's stamp on van Persie. I don't remember the same sort of outcry over Huddlestone's stamp, I don't remember the same sort of outcry over Huth's elbow, I don't remember the same outcry over Rooney's elbow against Wigan. The ones where the media goes beserk, however, are the ones where the charge is brought.

Funny, that.

"The ones where the media goes beserk, however, are the ones where the charge is brought".

Sorry Chris but the De jong tackle on Ben Arfa didnt lead to owt..

Completely different scenario.

De Jong's tackle was just that, a tackle. The issue was whether he had tackled Ben Arfa with excessive force. On that, opinion was split down the middle. As many said 'he's done him' as 'unfortunate, but one of those things'. Tackling is part of the game.

The examples I've given have all been unjustifiable: there is no excuse for intentionally elbowing a player, a la Rooney v Wigan, and a la Huth vs Balotelli. There is no excuse for intentionally stamping, a la Adebayor v Arsenal, or Huddlestone v (cant remember). Or Crouch's eye-gouge. Stamping, eye-gouging and deliberately elbowing are, unlike tackling, not part of the game.

The only sensible distinction I can see in cases of elbowing/stamping etc between the cases where charges are brought and where they aren't, is that charges are brought where there is a media furore.

I didn't say that wherever there is a media frenzy charges are brought whatever the incident.

EDIT: the Huddlestone stamp was on De Jong.
 
Chris in London said:
samharris said:
Chris in London said:
Good question.

The video footage looks reasonably damning, in slo-mo, from the right angle, but as Lee Dixon said only Mario knows whether he intended a stamp or not. So let's imagine this scenario: the FA receive Howard Webb's report. In a nutshell, he says ' I saw it out of the corner of my eye, at the time I didn't think it was anything more than an accidental collision, but having seen the replays I'm not so sure.'

The FA committee who decide on charging look at it and think 'it may have been accidental but it looks malicious in slo-mo. There's a case to answer, let Mario answer it. If he persuades us there was no malice and it was accidental, he walks. But if it was deliberate, he has to be banned.' I can understand that: or at least, I can see the logic of that.

What I don't get is this.

During the VK appeal, an interesting little statistic popped up on the FA website which was that about 99% of misconduct charges that they bring (including violent conduct) result in the charge being upheld. There are however plenty of cases where you have to make a judgment on whether an action is intended maliciously or not. That overwhelming statistic suggests to me that where there is doubt, they give the player the benefit of the doubt by the FA simply not bringing the charge: they don't in general, say 'well there's a case to answer, let the commission decide one way or the other'. They only charge where there is overwhelming evidence.

Then there is Lescott. I simply don't see how it can possibly be said that the Balotelli stamp (if it was) discloses more of a case to answer than the Lescott elbow. The evidence is no more conclusive about alotelli, and no less conclusive about Lescott. As with Balotelli, only Lescott knows whether he intended to 'do' Kaboul. Yet the FA has decided to charge Balotelli but not Lescott.

Why is this?

Two realistic possibilities occur to me (I do not consider the 'because Lescott is English' argument).

The first is that the FA have decided that they can't charge Lescott as well because (a) it looks like an anti-City witchhunt to charge for two separate incidents from the same game when you stack it up alongside Kompany's ban, the soft red cards for Barry & Balotelli previously, when compared with the lack of charges over say Rooney's elbow, Huth's elbow in the Final, Huddlestone's stamp etc, and (b) because it makes Webb look like a real twat for missing two red card incidents in the same 10 minute period.

The second is that the Balotelli thing has been all over every sports news outlet far more than than Lescott's, presumably because it is Mario, perhaps also that he scored the winning goal.

Personally, I lean towards the latter. The outcry which followed Rooney's tirade at the camera led to the charge against him (which I'm sure was nothing at all to do with Sky being angry receiving thousands of complaints from angry parents whose young kids have just witnessed Roopney's outburst) because the FA would have looked weak if they hadn't charged him: likewise Adebayor's stamp on van Persie. I don't remember the same sort of outcry over Huddlestone's stamp, I don't remember the same sort of outcry over Huth's elbow, I don't remember the same outcry over Rooney's elbow against Wigan. The ones where the media goes beserk, however, are the ones where the charge is brought.

Funny, that.

"The ones where the media goes beserk, however, are the ones where the charge is brought".

Sorry Chris but the De jong tackle on Ben Arfa didnt lead to owt..

Completely different scenario.

De Jong's tackle was just that, a tackle. The issue was whether he had tackled Ben Arfa with excessive force. On that, opinion was split down the middle. As many said 'he's done him' as 'unfortunate, but one of those things'. Tackling is part of the game.

The examples I've given have all been unjustifiable: there is no excuse for intentionally elbowing a player, a la Rooney v Wigan, and a la Huth vs Balotelli. There is no excuse for intentionally stamping, a la Adebayor v Arsenal, or Huddlestone v (cant remember). Or Crouch's eye-gouge. Stamping, eye-gouging and deliberately elbowing are, unlike tackling, not part of the game.

The only sensible distinction I can see in cases of elbowing/stamping etc between the cases where charges are brought and where they aren't, is that charges are brought where there is a media furore.

I didn't say that wherever there is a media frenzy charges are brought whatever the incident.

Problem is though Chris is that some of those examples didnt get the media outcry and witch hunt that De Jong got for his 'fair' tackle on Ben Arfa...
Some were calling for a police inquiry...
 
St Helens Blue (Exiled) said:
Henry Chinaski said:
cyprustavern said:
How the fuck do you know whether he did try or not ? Parker was right fuckin behind him if he wanted to stand on the twat im sure he could of done it for real and not in a half arsed way !

There can be no doubt that Mario tries to stamp on him. He does have a history of doing this type of thing.

He should have been sent off.

He wasnt.

He was brought down.

He scored the penalty.

Agenda my arse.

so why no charge for peter crouches eye gouge at the weekend? come on clever dick.

i have no idea mate to be honest. Although Marios looked worse, Crouch looked like a girl having a strop, Mario was a bit snide and very nasty.

When Rooney got banned for swearing to the camera, did that amount to an agenda against the Rags?
 
Henry Chinaski said:
St Helens Blue (Exiled) said:
Henry Chinaski said:
There can be no doubt that Mario tries to stamp on him. He does have a history of doing this type of thing.

He should have been sent off.

He wasnt.

He was brought down.

He scored the penalty.

Agenda my arse.

so why no charge for peter crouches eye gouge at the weekend? come on clever dick.

i have no idea mate to be honest. Although Marios looked worse, Crouch looked like a girl having a strop, Mario was a bit snide and very nasty.

When Rooney got banned for swearing to the camera, did that amount to an agenda against the Rags?

not arsed about rooney. There is clearly an agenda.end of
 
Henry Chinaski said:
St Helens Blue (Exiled) said:
Henry Chinaski said:
There can be no doubt that Mario tries to stamp on him. He does have a history of doing this type of thing.

He should have been sent off.

He wasnt.

He was brought down.

He scored the penalty.

Agenda my arse.

so why no charge for peter crouches eye gouge at the weekend? come on clever dick.

i have no idea mate to be honest. Although Marios looked worse, Crouch looked like a girl having a strop, Mario was a bit snide and very nasty.

When Rooney got banned for swearing to the camera, did that amount to an agenda against the Rags?

No because there was no doubt of what he did,if Mario takes a barrister with him,he,ll get off.
 
samharris said:
Chris in London said:
The examples I've given have all been unjustifiable: there is no excuse for intentionally elbowing a player, a la Rooney v Wigan, and a la Huth vs Balotelli. There is no excuse for intentionally stamping, a la Adebayor v Arsenal, or Huddlestone v (cant remember). Or Crouch's eye-gouge. Stamping, eye-gouging and deliberately elbowing are, unlike tackling, not part of the game.

The only sensible distinction I can see in cases of elbowing/stamping etc between the cases where charges are brought and where they aren't, is that charges are brought where there is a media furore.

I didn't say that wherever there is a media frenzy charges are brought whatever the incident.

Problem is though Chris is that some of those examples didnt get the media outcry and witch hunt that De Jong got for his 'fair' tackle on Ben Arfa...
Some were calling for a police inquiry...

Spot on, but that's a different point. Yes there were some asking for De Jong to stand trial at the Hague for his tackle on Ben Arfa, but there weren't many saying eg Huth should be banned for his elbow in the final of the world's greatest domestic cup competition. Result? No charge, no ban. I haven't heard any outcry about Crounch's eye-gouge. Result? No charge, no ban.

Balotelli? Hasn't been off the screens since Sunday afternoon. Result? Violent conduct charge, liklelihood of 99% that ban will follow.

Go figure...
 
I'm not sure about an agenda as such but there would seem to be a general anti City feeling in the media. Sadly, this is hardly surprising. Not only are we really rich (in case you didn't know) but we're from Manchester, not London, the centre of the universe.

I have noticed that since Mario's been charged the tone has slightly changed from 'it was definitely a deliberate stamp' to 'alleged stamp' and 'well, I can see Dixon's and others' points of view'. Find this a little irritating as it seems that it's ok to say these things once he's been charged but not before.

Although I feeel that the coverage of this incident has been disproportionate, especially compared with similar or worse incidents, it's very hard to be objective about it. For that reason I can't say there's a definite agenda but I'm fairly sure that nobody likes us any more ;)
This, as well as the three points on Sunday are the positives I am taking from the situation. Nobody likes us because we are real contenders, it's a simple as that. I wouldn't swap that for a relegation battle. So I guess we have to deal with it, laugh it off, state our opinions and move on.

Thankfully we haven't lost Lescott, Kompany will be back next league match and hopefully we will get through not having Mario the same way we have got through not having Kompany or either Toure. If we do manage that, this league is ours to lose.
 

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