Thanks for the scientific insights (no, I'm not being sarcastic).See my response to Blueinsa.
Not sure if it's actually the players who complain so much about it or rather the managers? Kevin De Bruyne is the prime example of a player who's being rested rather frequently but who has always insisted that if it were up to him he'd just play all of the time.
I don't want to argue with the Italian doctors talking about 80% recovery, but automatisms and flow are very important factors in football & I firmly believe that it's much more valuable to leave a good team in it's flow, rather than breaking them up every other match by bringing in 5,6,7,8 new players. A football team should be a well oiled machine. You can't create a well oiled machine if you change the parts every 5 seconds.
This isn't about crybaby footballers though, it's about how a manager ensures his players are as fit as possible for the most important games (and how they avoid injury). If you or anyone else can refute the science that is being applied, I am all ears.
As to the comparison to other sports, it's just not relevant. I'm quite sure for example that the guys in the Tour de France are using all the sports science knowledge they can muster and I am equally sure that they are not 100% recovered each day but they are all in exactly the same boat (or on the same bike): no one gets an extra days rest...
And in tennis, it's quite clear at times that players who have had a less gruelling time in a contest get an advantage over their opponent.
Also, both those sports are essentially individual sports where player rotation is entirely irrelevant.
Each sport is different but at the highest levels, there will be an emphasis is in doing whatever is necessary to have participants in the best possible condition at the right time.
Thanks for the scientific insights (no, I'm not being sarcastic).
However, football is one of those sports where science is subordinate to strategy, creativity, intelligence, etc. It's the whole reason why we love this sport so much. Science should play a supporting role, obviously, but not determine who should play where and when.
Let's take arguably the best current club team in the world, Barcelona, as an example then. How many matches a year are the MSN deliberately rested in official matches? And how often do they not turn up?Also, both those sports are essentially individual sports where player rotation is entirely irrelevant.
Its a funny one in that I agree with you and see your point of view entirely, its just that I think the reliance on thee sports science side of the game has become a little too much and that a sit down with a player, ask him if he is fit, ask him if he wants to play, ask him if he is ready to go out there and get it done is sometimes better than a spread sheet and a medical man saying he is at 93.76% recovery and the chance of an injury in the next game is now at 12.45% so in their opinion, a rest is advised etc etc.
Fine if the games and level of competition allow it but right now, business end of the season, go with the human approach and expect your players to want to get out there and get it done.
Any player worth his salt will say he wants to play; which is why the manager needs to consider all the factors and pick the team. One of the reasons I am so keen to have Pep in charge is that he appears to be a guy who attends to all the details; although he's not much of a stats man, which I find a little disappointing ;-)
As I just posted, science should play a supporting role but not determine everything. I couldn't say it any better than blueinsa just did with his spread sheet comment.Do you know of any top football managers that do not take the medical / sports science into account?
Let's take arguably the best current club team in the world, Barcelona, as an example then. How many matches a year are the MSN deliberately rested in official matches? And how often do they not turn up?
They rotate some of their defensive players, but never the creative geniuses who need to make the difference.
That's why I simply cannot understand the logic behind deliberately resting players like Silva, De Bruyne, Agüero ... and not just one, but all of them at the same time. How on earth can you expect to win a match like that?
I think push will come to shove and this team will finally do it especially if we get through on Wednesday. Yes it is a dire record.What gives you any confidence Pelligrini will select a team and a system to beat Arsenal, bearing in mind we`ve won 1 of the 15 games league games we`ve played against top 8 sides,
Leicester City
Away D 0-0
home L 1-3
Spurs
Away L 1-4
Home L 1-2
Arsenal
Away L 1-2
Home
Scum
Away D 0-0
home L 0-1
West Ham
Home L 1-2
Away D 2-2
Southampton
Home W 3-1
Away L 4-2
Liverpool
Home L 1-4
Away L 1-0
Dire reading isnt it
It's true that his form dipped a couple of weeks after arriving, but it's hard to prove that it was because of being overplayed. It might as well have been a mental issue, or just by no specific cause at all, an inexplicable momentary dip.KDB is a prime example of a player who, largely due to circumstance, was overplayed when he first arrived and his form duly suffered.
As I just posted, science should play a supporting role but not determine everything. I couldn't say it any better than blueinsa just did with his spread sheet comment.
Science is one of the many factors to take into account, but you simply cannot justify resting the likes of KDB, Aguëro, Silva, ... all at the same time just because Delph & Bony are 7.05% more fit and 9.12% less injury prone for the moment.
That's were our logic differs, I think breaking up the team, slashing momentum & spirit is a lot more harmful for the chances at Madrid than playing your best team for two games in a row and risk one or two players not being completely, entirely 100% fit.Why would any City supporter want to consider doing the slightest thing to reduce our chances there?
I can't comment on Barca this season as I have barely watched them - I used to watch almost every game. However, their key players used to play a lot of consecutive games under Pep but I don't think he and his staff were entirely happy about doing that and would eventually insist on a rest. The physical demands on Spanish teams are different though to Premier League ones.
City rarely rest certain players, Aguero and Toure among them but it is probably fair to say Kun was very much due a rest.
It's true that his form dipped a couple of weeks after arriving, but it's hard to prove that it was because of being overplayed. It might as well have been a mental issue, or just by no specific cause at all, an inexplicable momentary dip.
The other way around, you should also acknowledge the fact that KDB had been on a fantastic run in recent weeks, arguably the best run he's had at the club so far, got rested one match v Stoke, and all of sudden turned invisible/ineffective v Madrid.
My point since the beginning: rotation will sooner risk your team to lose momentum rather than do them good because of the extra rests ...
That's were our logic differs, I think breaking up the team, slashing momentum & spirit is a lot more harmful for the chances at Madrid than playing your best team for two games in a row and risk one or two players not being completely, entirely 100% fit.
Fight to the end my arse, we are a club lacking direction.
The rests should come in the league and FA cup.
As a club, we aim for the title and CL every year with our best players in every game and the domestic cups, the youth and fringe players pick up.