Southport | 9 year old girl confirmed as third victim

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Crooked_rain said:
I don't think that says much one way or the other.

Muslim people are a minority in the UK too, around 6%, but something like 95 of the last 98 terrorist incidents in the UK were committed by Muslims. Clearly extremely disproportionate.

The truth is we don't know his religion or beliefs, if he had any at all. He might be just a nutcase, he might be Christian, he might be muslim, he might be a convert that was radicalised.

People are just guessing at this point.
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I was simply repeating what is being said online.
 
Cheadle_hulmeBlue said:
I get what you’re saying, but surely understanding the attackers background and potentially where they are from is important in understanding why they could have done something so terrible? (That’s for white British people as well)

It was very relevant in the Manchester arena attack.

We don’t know the full details, but A lot of attacks could have been prevented as often social services or the police know about the attacker.
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That's not why people on social media are claiming the attacker to be an immigrant, though. It's not for a better understanding...it's out of HATRED. They hate first and will be using this as a reason to justify that hatred.
 
Cheadle_hulmeBlue said:
I get what you’re saying, but surely understanding the attackers background and potentially where they are from is important in understanding why they could have done something so terrible? (That’s for white British people as well)

It was very relevant in the Manchester arena attack.

We don’t know the full details, but A lot of attacks could have been prevented as often social services or the police know about the attacker.
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I do think it's difficult because you can't monitor people 24/7. I do think if people are coming in to this country and not from this country and they have real intelligence on them being linked to terror organisations or a real threat, then they shouldn't be in this country, that's what deportations should be for.


generally speaking though, it's almost impossible to stop the kind of thing that happened yesterday. Just like they can't prevent anyone on here grabbing a knife out of their kitchen now and walking out into the street and stabbing someone.

Even if you've got someone from this country on a list of potential threats but they've not actually committed a crime, do you lock them up anyway? Well that's not really how the system works. Do you watch their every move 24 hours a day? It's not possible.

Sadly a lot of the time there's almost nothing they can do to prevent it. Intelligence services can only do so much, they can't control people's actions.

I'm all for deporting non British people who are deemed to be a genuine terror threat. Other than that, it's difficult to prevent. It's just a harsh reality.
 
Cheadle_hulmeBlue said:
I get what you’re saying, but surely understanding the attackers background and potentially where they are from is important in understanding why they could have done something so terrible? (That’s for white British people as well)

It was very relevant in the Manchester arena attack.

We don’t know the full details, but A lot of attacks could have been prevented as often social services or the police know about the attacker.
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Brady and Hindley
Lucy Letby
Ian Huntley
Thomas Hamilton
Venables and Thompson
Beverly Allitt
Robert Black
John Taylor
The list could go on and on , sadly events like this have always happened worldwide and will continue to do so .
 
police have called for the speculation regarding the identity of the alleged attacker online to end.

"A name has been shared on social media in connection with the suspect in the incident in Southport," a Merseyside Police statement read.

"This name is incorrect and we would urge people not to speculate on details of the incident while the investigation is ongoing."

Speculation has been rife on social media since the attack yesterday.

All we know of the suspect is that he is a 17-year-old boy from nearby Banks, although he was born in Cardiff.
 
Crooked_rain said:
But isn't it confirmed he was born in Cardiff and moved to the Stockport area at 6? - His parents are from Rwanda, but by all accounts he was born in the UK. So he is not a migrant. I'm the first generation of my family born in the UK too, I'm not a migrant.

If these are the facts then I don't think migration is really a big talking point in this case. Makes about as much sense as blaming the Welsh because he was born in Cardiff.

Who knows what his reason was. Obviously he's an evil ****. Is he just a lad with a screw loose? Was he radicalised by people? We don't really know yet but I don't think migration should be the focal point of this when it seems he was born and raised in the UK, just because his parents were from somewhere else.

There's certainly conversations needed about migration but it's not at all linked to this tragedy.
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I can’t see him being “radicalised” as there’s very few Muslims in Rwanda. He’s most probably a Christian (at least nominally). Doubtless an evil **** who doesn’t deserve to draw another breath. Probably despises the country he was born in and likely alienated and never integrated. I’m hoping we get the facts in due course.
 
bert38 said:
I cannot speak for everyone but police in general get frustrated at the 'revolving door' effect when it comes to a lot of 'crimes'.

Personally I believe in stromg sentencing and supported use of police powers (S&S for example) but the real answers long term can only come from addressing a whole range of socio-economic factors/inequalities, erosion of life chances that we are wintnessing.

Couple with that of course you need a well resourced, effective police force but its only part of the puzzle.
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Doesn't change anything pertaining to yesterday's appalling events but when I was a civil servant, I watched a virtual meeting involving the head of Ofsted, a chief constable, someone from the MoJ and someone else. The thing I remember from that was that there was often a linear pattern.
  • Social services would be involved with a problem family.
  • The education system could spot kids who were troublesome, and likely to remain so.
  • The local police would see kids who they knew were trouble.
  • Those kids would often end up in the justice system.
The earlier you intervene, the better chance you have of mitigating problems but if the kids have a family issue, that can be difficult if not impossible. There's a whole element of youth training/education/employment as well.

The other end of the process is when they're in the justice system, and there are opportunities to intervene and remediate. But it all requires joined-up thinking and adequate resources.
 
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