Spurs Vs City Post Match Discussion thread

[Castiel]

I don't mean to rub any salt in but this really has been a poor title defence. I think it's worse than Arsenal's against us in 2005. It seemed that you didn't really care to fight for it, which I'd be disappointed in. Contrast to how you fought against us the in the cup and collapsed here - it shows that it wasn't a form or quality issue, just a question of desire.

Rag......

Thought he was Chelsea

I believe you've been clarkied.

 

[inbetween]

Didn't bother to come on here after yesterday, we were comfortable then after making 2 stupid mistakes completely went to pieces. We lacked the speciality players to really win that game and put it away while we were battering them. We needed both Sergio and Silva on the pitch and in the end i'm afraid having to call upon Kolarov to play in midfield and then Lescott to go up front sums up the season as a whole.

Not going to bother either watching anything on TV tonight or for a few days because it's going to be a United bum parade, roll on the cup final.

 

[paulchapo]

Although Clichy is a good defender it is odd how most danger always seems to come from that side,as Spurs equalizer did yesterday.I noticed too in the first half every dangerous cross came from there too.

The defending for the equalizer was pathetic.No one closed Bale down,they all watched the ball come in like it was a fucking grenade they daren't touch and Dempsey was left unmarked as well to tap it in.

For the second goal Kompany HAS to get tighter on Defoe and definately not allow him to come onto his favourite side where he has scored countless goals from just that position,he did neither.The third we had lost our heads and heart.

Our problem nearly all season has been not killing games off when we are in control and believe me we were in control for 75 minutes yesterday.Mancini has stated as much numerous times and he is right.Sometimes we seem to play within ourselves instead of taking that little risk to get the game dead and buried.I would actually say that is the big difference between us and the rags,they always try and win and finish off teams,we seem content to think we have done enough and it comes back to bite us in the arse,like yesterday.

 

[Manc in London]

I think you make some very good points.

Looking at both squads of players, there's really not that much between City and Spurs (perhaps overall City have more quality) so in theory matches between us should be fairly evenly balanced.

Our squad has great quality at the top end. I don’t think any club in England can match the numbers of top class players we have. However, it tails off badly after the first 15 players or so. That is, in part, due to us paying very high wages for players who were, and still are, simply not good enough. If the rumours are true that we are paying Bridge and RSC a combined £210k per week, then when they come off the wage bill in July, we will be able to pay the transfer fee and salary for a world class footballer over a five year period. We could, in effect, have a bigger and better squad next season, with a lower wage bill.

The fact that we have won two major trophies (and qualified for another FA Cup Final) with the bulk of this squad and qualified for the CL twice (and we should qualify for a third consecutive time), would indicate that the quality of our squad is better. Unless, of course, you think that Mancini is much better than Redknapp and AVB.

As for close games, the scorelines of the two games at our place have been close but the games haven’t. We were clearly the better team in both games. And as for the 1-5….. Games are not played on paper so better quality does not always mean a win. As evidenced by our games against Sunderland and Everton. They have been far more impressive, on the whole, against us. You have one 1 out of the last 6 games against us. That too would suggest our squad is better.

A question I would like to ask is: why did AVB, during our game earlier this season, keep Huddlestone on the pitch even though we were running around him all game…? Later on, he was arguably at fault for one of our goals. I believe this also relates to the next point….

The difference is what the respective managers do when things aren't going exactly to plan.

Yesterday, we saw how André Villas-Boas changed the course of the match by reverting to "Plan B" and all three of the substitutes (Huddlestone, Holtby and Defoe) were marked improvements on the players they replaced.

Dawson had a knock. He could be replaced by Caulker (okayish) or Huddlestone (okayish but a better passer). No-brainer when chasing a game. Parker was, along with Dzeko, the poorest player on the pitch. AVB had only two real options: Carroll or a vastly more experienced Holtby. He chose the latter. Adebayor, who was having an ineffective game, was replaced by your only other striker - Defoe. It was also inevitable that we were dying on our feet as we were playing our third game in 8 days while Spurs had a rest. It also appears that AVB instructed Bale to play wider. Seeing as he was the only winger on the pitch, and he was ineffective down the middle, it was hardly ‘outside the box’ thinking.

The subs made an impact but what he did is all he could do in the circumstances. Nothing else had worked.

By contrast, Mancini simply sat there like a man watching a car crash in slow motion.

AVB was crucified on several occasions this season, by Spurs fans, for making what they see as bizarre substitutions that cost Spurs (or at least “cost” you according to Spurs fans on other forums). He has also been slow to react on other occasions (see Huddleston example above).

I cannot explain Mancini’s substitutions yesterday because I think other factors were at play. Faced with the same situation at other points during the last year or two, I would have expected an attacking player (in yesterdays game it would clearly have clearly been Dzeko) to be taken off and a midfielder to replace him. Yaya would then move upfront. Yesterday, he didn’t. Maybe the players on the bench were not 100% fit and with it being a game that did not mean much in the great scheme of things (maybe that was Mancini’s attitude, I have a feeling it was) he didn’t want to take a risk. I honestly don’t know. I do know that in no other game has he made a move such as playing a defender upfront.

 

[Tricky_Trev]

Although Clichy is a good defender it is odd how most danger always seems to come from that side,as Spurs equalizer did yesterday.I noticed too in the first half every dangerous cross came from there too.

It's not odd at all. On the right we usually have Zab and Milner. That is virtually impossible to get through. But on the left, it's usually Clichy and Silva. Clearly there is less discipline here, and less protection. As for yesterday, Kolarov is shite.

 

[Eds]

Champions would have either scored a second and third when on top or ensured that a one nil win would suffice. We did neither and whenever a team is only one down they are in with a shout. Spurs needed to win that game whereas we in reality didn't and that was the difference. Passion, desire and a will to win. We had it in spades last year i.e. Newcastle away but this year it has been lacking at crucial times. In my opinion we require five quality signings to strengthen the squad and ensure that we can compete and win the title. We need two forwards, two midfielders and a defender.

 

[Ray78]

I think you make some very good points.

Looking at both squads of players, there's really not that much between City and Spurs (perhaps overall City have more quality) so in theory matches between us should be fairly evenly balanced.

Our squad has great quality at the top end. I don’t think any club in England can match the numbers of top class players we have. However, it tails off badly after the first 15 players or so. That is, in part, due to us paying very high wages for players who were, and still are, simply not good enough. If the rumours are true that we are paying Bridge and RSC a combined £210k per week, then when they come off the wage bill in July, we will be able to pay the transfer fee and salary for a world class footballer over a five year period. We could, in effect, have a bigger and better squad next season, with a lower wage bill.

The fact that we have won two major trophies (and qualified for another FA Cup Final) with the bulk of this squad and qualified for the CL twice (and we should qualify for a third consecutive time), would indicate that the quality of our squad is better. Unless, of course, you think that Mancini is much better than Redknapp and AVB.

As for close games, the scorelines of the two games at our place have been close but the games haven’t. We were clearly the better team in both games. And as for the 1-5….. Games are not played on paper so better quality does not always mean a win. As evidenced by our games against Sunderland and Everton. They have been far more impressive, on the whole, against us. You have one 1 out of the last 6 games against us. That too would suggest our squad is better.

A question I would like to ask is: why did AVB, during our game earlier this season, keep Huddlestone on the pitch even though we were running around him all game…? Later on, he was arguably at fault for one of our goals. I believe this also relates to the next point….

The difference is what the respective managers do when things aren't going exactly to plan.

Yesterday, we saw how André Villas-Boas changed the course of the match by reverting to "Plan B" and all three of the substitutes (Huddlestone, Holtby and Defoe) were marked improvements on the players they replaced.

Dawson had a knock. He could be replaced by Caulker (okayish) or Huddlestone (okayish but a better passer). No-brainer when chasing a game. Parker was, along with Dzeko, the poorest player on the pitch. AVB had only two real options: Carroll or a vastly more experienced Holtby. He chose the latter. Adebayor, who was having an ineffective game, was replaced by your only other striker - Defoe. It was also inevitable that we were dying on our feet as we were playing our third game in 8 days while Spurs had a rest. It also appears that AVB instructed Bale to play wider. Seeing as he was the only winger on the pitch, and he was ineffective down the middle, it was hardly ‘outside the box’ thinking.

The subs made an impact but what he did is all he could do in the circumstances. Nothing else had worked.

By contrast, Mancini simply sat there like a man watching a car crash in slow motion.

AVB was crucified on several occasions this season, by Spurs fans, for making what they see as bizarre substitutions that cost Spurs (or at least “cost” you according to Spurs fans on other forums). He has also been slow to react on other occasions (see Huddleston example above).

I cannot explain Mancini’s substitutions yesterday because I think other factors were at play. Faced with the same situation at other points during the last year or two, I would have expected an attacking player (in yesterdays game it would clearly have clearly been Dzeko) to be taken off and a midfielder to replace him. Yaya would then move upfront. Yesterday, he didn’t. Maybe the players on the bench were not 100% fit and with it being a game that did not mean much in the great scheme of things (maybe that was Mancini’s attitude, I have a feeling it was) he didn’t want to take a risk. I honestly don’t know. I do know that in no other game has he made a move such as playing a defender upfront.

Sunderland away.

 

[inbetween]

Although Clichy is a good defender it is odd how most danger always seems to come from that side,as Spurs equalizer did yesterday.I noticed too in the first half every dangerous cross came from there too.

The defending for the equalizer was pathetic.No one closed Bale down,they all watched the ball come in like it was a fucking grenade they daren't touch and Dempsey was left unmarked as well to tap it in.

For the second goal Kompany HAS to get tighter on Defoe and definately not allow him to come onto his favourite side where he has scored countless goals from just that position,he did neither.The third we had lost our heads and heart.

Our problem nearly all season has been not killing games off when we are in control and believe me we were in control for 75 minutes yesterday.Mancini has stated as much numerous times and he is right.Sometimes we seem to play within ourselves instead of taking that little risk to get the game dead and buried.I would actually say that is the big difference between us and the rags,they always try and win and finish off teams,we seem content to think we have done enough and it comes back to bite us in the arse,like yesterday.

What worries me is even when we are winning and they bring it level that's it we start to crack. Last year we would of cracked on and gone to score several more but this year.. So many games we have either lost a lead and drawn or just lost altogether, we have really lacked that mentality to want to bury these teams. We have definitely lacked a ruthlessness and cutting edge which saw us put 5 past Spurs in the same fixture, yes the title may be practically wrapped up but the same mentality has gone in to far to many games.

Draws against Chelsea away, United at home, West Ham away, Everton home, QPR away and yesterday are all games we have just not done enough but would of won last year and they have been with hindsight the difference.

 

[Manc in London]

Ray78

Fair play Lescott came on against Sunderland. I think the difference between that game and the one against Spurs is that another striker was available yesterday. Against Sunderland, Dzeko was already brought on and all we had were Razak and Sinclair. Options that Mancini clearly doesn't fancy.

 

[Blue Tooth]

Hugely disappointing result given the recent run of form and more so because it is a game we should have had wrapped up long before Spurs had their manic 7 minutes.
Much of the result yesterday is down to us not putting the game away first and then giving it away second.
Poor decisions were made on the pitch at both ends and we need to look at our overall attitude this year. Maybe the loss of a title will bring more positives than winning one did.