Sturgeon wants another referendum

Magicpole said:
Domocles has gone Tonto.

I'm so pleased.
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Keep it up Magic pole, whilst I disagree with just about everything you say, you argue well and this is the most entertaining thread I've read since the last transfer window.

I'm just saddened by the divisions in the UK because they are so easy for no-mark politicians to achieve. Looking back at our recent armed struggles, when the chips were down, Scots were always right in there next to us and, even if it's an imperfect test of character, it's an important one in my view.
 
If, and when, they get a second, third, fourth or fifth shot at what has already been described as a 'neverendum' and the Scots DO vote for independence will Sturgeon and her SNP cronies then happily allow further referendums every 2 or 3 years? This seems to be what they're insisting on now until they get, what appear to be a minority's decision to secede.

As opinion turns against the original decision to leave (as it inevitably will) and dissatisfaction appears north of the border, will further referendums be repeated with similar timescales allowing the nation to rejoin the Union or is this, as expected, very much a one-way street and the only referendum they'll consider definitive is the one that suits the SNP?

We could end up doing a McHokey Cokey!! "You put your whole country in, your whole country out ...... In, out, in, out and you shake it all about!!!
 
Sam Armstrong said:
If, and when, they get a second, third, fourth or fifth shot at what has already been described as a 'neverendum' and the Scots DO vote for independence will Sturgeon and her SNP cronies then happily allow further referendums every 2 or 3 years? This seems to be what they're insisting on now until they get, what appear to be a minority's decision to secede.

As opinion turns against the original decision to leave (as it inevitably will) and dissatisfaction appears north of the border, will further referendums be repeated with similar timescales allowing the nation to rejoin the Union or is this, as expected, very much a one-way street and the only referendum they'll consider definitive is the one that suits the SNP?

We could end up doing a McHokey Cokey!! "You put your whole country in, your whole country out ...... In, out, in, out and you shake it all about!!!
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If a party puts it in a manifesto and wins , then yes as it is that look very unlikely, as the opposition is worse than useless and I'm not sure Labour in Scotland are 100% against it even if they won back power.
 
Sam Armstrong said:
If, and when, they get a second, third, fourth or fifth shot at what has already been described as a 'neverendum' and the Scots DO vote for independence will Sturgeon and her SNP cronies then happily allow further referendums every 2 or 3 years? This seems to be what they're insisting on now until they get, what appear to be a minority's decision to secede.

As opinion turns against the original decision to leave (as it inevitably will) and dissatisfaction appears north of the border, will further referendums be repeated with similar timescales allowing the nation to rejoin the Union or is this, as expected, very much a one-way street and the only referendum they'll consider definitive is the one that suits the SNP?

We could end up doing a McHokey Cokey!! "You put your whole country in, your whole country out ...... In, out, in, out and you shake it all about!!!
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Just as it's not solely Scotland's decision on whether they become independent (they need the go ahead from the UK), the same would apply to rejoining the UK. If Scotland leave the UK and really struggle, do you think the UK would be rushing to welcome them back?
 
blueinsa said:
That wouldn't be fair on the MAJORITY of Scots who dont want independence.
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That wouldn't be fair on the MAJORITY of Scots who didn't want independence. ;-)

Unconvinced any poll is currently capable of accurately predicting how the majority will/would vote, and that applies to both sides.
 
Wreckless Alec said:
Keep it up Magic pole, whilst I disagree with just about everything you say, you argue well and this is the most entertaining thread I've read since the last transfer window.

I'm just saddened by the divisions in the UK because they are so easy for no-mark politicians to achieve. Looking back at our recent armed struggles, when the chips were down, Scots were always right in there next to us and, even if it's an imperfect test of character, it's an important one in my view.
Click to expand...

As far as I'm concerned, if any time in the future the chips were down, we would stand beside the peoples of these islands, make no mistake about that.

I will be arguing we retain our armed forces and pay our appropriate share of a mutual defence, including all of our regiments and soldiers. The only problem will be we don't want Trident here.

This does not need to be acrimonious. We are stuck together geographically and culturally. We want to manage our own country and remain in the EU.

We still need to trade and get over all the threats to fuck us up. We Scots are adept at fucking ourselves up, but also of great innovation and tenacity.

It is not about anti English. I love the English, I was born there. My sister lives the married to a great bloke, for an English ****, :) and I have many friends who are English. We love to slag each other and as you are the big guys we love to face up to you and take the piss, as you do us. That's not hatred, that's the wee brother being a mouthy wee **** who knows he will take a pasting but is still willing to fight. :)

It's really about the direction politically the country is going. The majority of SNP voters now are ex labour. It's not kilt wearing beaveheart pricks. I'm not saying there are no people like that, but every country has its nutters.

We might not win. We know that. The reasons we do this is two fold.

1. A genuine desire to go it alone.

2. By taking them on we force more power to be relocated here regarding our own affairs even if we lose.

We know Tories would give us fuck all if we just asked nicely.

We got fed up asking nicely.

Out of the last 32 years Scots paid more per head in tax than anywhere in the uk. Yet, we focus on us being scroungers and that ducks us of when the Barnet formula doesn't show the whole picture.

As this campaign goes in you will see a clearer presentation Of the actual figures over the years. This wasn't the situation last time.

The £ is again being threatened as being removed. With brexit causing a fall of 20% already, once the deal is known it will fall again. If Scotland and its assets that back up the £ is forced out this will cause a further needless fall, and for what? Spite?

Things will be hard enough if the brexteers and Indy happens the way we think. To further shoot ourselves in the head by being vindictive then we frankly deserve all we get.

My view would be share the £ and remain an integral part of the armed services if this is possible.

I'm a tad outnumbered in here but try to keep cheerful. :)
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
Our friend is a make up artist at BBC Scotland. She is English but has lived in Gladgow for 20 odd yrs. She did Salmonds makeup for a debate in the first ref run up. He verbally objected to her doing his makeup as she was English. Make of that what you will. Hes a nasty racist twat if you ask me.
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It shock me that it's pretty much accepted that many Scott's are openly racist, yet nobody seems to pull them up on it for fear of being called a racist themselves. Salmond is very careful about what he says in public, but anyone who has actually met him away from the public gaze knows exactly what his views are.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
You married a blue?
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No. My uncle Joe was a Manc and a City, eh, how can I put this, maniac.

He would tell me about his team, how much he hated the rags, how you turned out in force throughout the shit years, how he hated the Rags, and finally how he hated the rags.

Did I mention he hated the rags?

I got him and always admired you for the defiance.

Sadly Joe died a couple of years before you won the league. When Ageuro scored that goal I screamed out in delight for him.

If he had lived to see it he would have gone totally ballistic.

He was a much loved, funny, moaning faced **** and I miss him dearly.

That's my connection.
 
Trevor Morley's Tache said:
It shock me that it's pretty much accepted that many Scott's are openly racist, yet nobody seems to pull them up on it for fear of being called a racist themselves. Salmond is very careful about what he says in public, but anyone who has actually met him away from the public gaze knows exactly what his views are.
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A minor point, but although Salmond was considered an effective politician and first minister, I don't think he was as popular as a person. He was generally seen as being smarmy, smug and not especially trustworthy or genuine. I now tend to vote SNP and am just about in favour of independence (although not strongly), but I don't like him and never have.

That is purely going off my experience, rather than polls or whatever. I accept we tend to socialise with certain types of people so it might not be reflective of his nationwide popularity.
 
Y
Magicpole said:
As far as I'm concerned, if any time in the future the chips were down, we would stand beside the peoples of these islands, make no mistake about that.

I will be arguing we retain our armed forces and pay our appropriate share of a mutual defence, including all of our regiments and soldiers. The only problem will be we don't want Trident here.

This does not need to be acrimonious. We are stuck together geographically and culturally. We want to manage our own country and remain in the EU.

We still need to trade and get over all the threats to fuck us up. We Scots are adept at fucking ourselves up, but also of great innovation and tenacity.

It is not about anti English. I love the English, I was born there. My sister lives the married to a great bloke, for an English ****, :) and I have many friends who are English. We love to slag each other and as you are the big guys we love to face up to you and take the piss, as you do us. That's not hatred, that's the wee brother being a mouthy wee **** who knows he will take a pasting but is still willing to fight. :)

It's really about the direction politically the country is going. The majority of SNP voters now are ex labour. It's not kilt wearing beaveheart pricks. I'm not saying there are no people like that, but every country has its nutters.

We might not win. We know that. The reasons we do this is two fold.

1. A genuine desire to go it alone.

2. By taking them on we force more power to be relocated here regarding our own affairs even if we lose.

We know Tories would give us fuck all if we just asked nicely.

We got fed up asking nicely.

Out of the last 32 years Scots paid more per head in tax than anywhere in the uk. Yet, we focus on us being scroungers and that ducks us of when the Barnet formula doesn't show the whole picture.

As this campaign goes in you will see a clearer presentation Of the actual figures over the years. This wasn't the situation last time.

The £ is again being threatened as being removed. With brexit causing a fall of 20% already, once the deal is known it will fall again. If Scotland and its assets that back up the £ is forced out this will cause a further needless fall, and for what? Spite?

Things will be hard enough if the brexteers and Indy happens the way we think. To further shoot ourselves in the head by being vindictive then we frankly deserve all we get.

My view would be share the £ and remain an integral part of the armed services if this is possible.

I'm a tad outnumbered in here but try to keep cheerful. :)
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You will need to keep cheerful for at least 4 years
 
Gabriel said:
Every cloud in Scotland is invariably joined to the next one. ;-)
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You got that right.

Sure, we've heard the tales about the big yellow bulb in the sky, who hasn't? Maybe one day it will put in an appearance.
 
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Magicpole said:
No. My uncle Joe was a Manc and a City, eh, how can I put this, maniac.

He would tell me about his team, how much he hated the rags, how you turned out in force throughout the shit years, how he hated the Rags, and finally how he hated the rags.

Did I mention he hated the rags?

I got him and always admired you for the defiance.

Sadly Joe died a couple of years before you won the league. When Ageuro scored that goal I screamed out in delight for him.

If he had lived to see it he would have gone totally ballistic.

He was a much loved, funny, moaning faced **** and I miss him dearly.

That's my connection.
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Fair plays to you Magic.
 
Trevor Morley's Tache said:
It shock me that it's pretty much accepted that many Scott's are openly racist, yet nobody seems to pull them up on it for fear of being called a racist themselves. Salmond is very careful about what he says in public, but anyone who has actually met him away from the public gaze knows exactly what his views are.
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Ummmm I am not sure its many. I suspect its about the same number as the English have. Why would they have more than us.
 
Magicpole said:
Out of the last 32 years Scots paid more per head in tax than anywhere in the uk. Yet, we focus on us being scroungers and that ducks us of when the Barnet formula doesn't show the whole picture.
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We focus on you 'being scroungers' because it's true.

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