The Boxing thread

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

Any champion who cant lay a glove on a smiling opponent will be in bad shape in thier career, biting iron mike and no mas roberto will lay testament to that. Though once their range is found with a more suitable opponent then their shape returns, least that's what history tells us.

From the BBC on the fight with AJ.

"He looked a different fighter to the one beaten by Fury, and markedly better than in his latest points win over Bryant Jennings, but the size of his task was huge.

He was the underdog with bookmakers, with only George Foreman having won a recognised world title past the age of 40."

You can talk up Fury all you like but he beat an old and out of shape Klitschko and Wilder was poor in both fights. Beyond that he has beaten a load of Bums.

 

[Fat Chance]

Paddypower had klitch betting fave with hrs to fight.....
Lennox Lewis: "I don't see where Tyson Fury has boxed anybody of Wladimir's calibre to be able to get in the ring with Wladimir and do well.
Klitsh fight pre fury he didnt break sweat

 

[bluemc1]

I think we are all agreeing that the quality of heavyweight fighters has tailed off over the last 20 years. The last era of greats was Tyson / Holyfield / Lewis who all had numerous massive title fights. Lewis beat an old M Tyson toward the end of his career 2002 ish having had 3 massive fights with Holyfield who had in turn beaten prime Tyson - they all had their moments of brilliance and you can trace back through great fighters fighting each other from that era backwards. From when the Klischkos domination started there has been nothing comparable. The Klitschkos beat practically everyone in front of them but it was nothing like the kind of stand out brawls with greats v's greats of the previous eras.

TF beating WK and AJ beating Wk does not compare - he was old then. TF beating Wilder does not compare - Wilder is not a great fighter. I dont see any sign of things changing - unless AJ and TF fight each other fairly soon.

the 3 you mention Lewis, Tyson and Holyfield were in their primes great champions but at the times they met both Holyfield and Tyson were past their best
People may rate Holyfield and Lewis over Tyson because they beat him but Tyson was a ghost of his former self
My feeling is all at the best it’s 60/40 in his favour ( I can still see how a case is made for a Holyfield win )
But I think I 86-89 Rooney Trained Tyson knocks Lewis out



if nothing this Fury fight has got people talking about heavyweight boxing :)

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

the 3 you mention Lewis, Tyson and Holyfield were in their primes great champions but at the times they met both Holyfield and Tyson were past their best
People may rate Holyfield and Lewis over Tyson because they beat him but Tyson was a ghost of his former self
My feeling is all at the best it’s 60/40 in his favour ( I can still see how a case is made for a Holyfield win )
But I think I 86-89 Rooney Trained Tyson knocks Lewis out



if nothing this Fury fight has got people talking about heavyweight boxing :)

Agree - i guess my point was those 3 greats were at there best around 85 to 2000. A 15 year span with loads of great fights / fighters. From Lewis retiring to now I can't think of many great heavyweight title fights - and i include all of Tyson Fury's fights in that assessment.

 

[mexico1970]

Tyson was unbeatable in his prime, the best ever IMO. Then he fell to bits with his wife Robin whatever eating him from the inside his mentor dying and people twisting him all ways but up. He went all Islamic and talking about eating babies in the same breath, a complete fruitcake but as I said, what a boxer.

 

[bluemc1]

Tyson was unbeatable in his prime, the best ever IMO. Then he fell to bits with his wife Robin whatever eating him from the inside his mentor dying and people twisting him all ways but up. He went all Islamic and talking about eating babies in the same breath, a complete fruitcake but as I said, what a boxer.

i think Ali beats Tyson, wouldn’t be scared and much more mentally strong, Tyson get frustrated and stopped on his feet in 11 with both eyes shut
My verdict:)

what I do argue is when people debating this say that foreman punched as hard as Tyson and was just as intimidating at the time, I don’t believe in a million years Ali’s rope a dope would’ve worked v a PRIME Tyson. Tyson’s speed, variety and power in either hand would’ve made sitting on the ropes impossible

 

[Nellies left peg]

Tyson was unbeatable in his prime, the best ever IMO. Then he fell to bits with his wife Robin whatever eating him from the inside his mentor dying and people twisting him all ways but up. He went all Islamic and talking about eating babies in the same breath, a complete fruitcake but as I said, what a boxer.

He was real box office too. Always watched his fights. Cus D'amato passing away and that woman visiting his room at 3 in the morning for tiffin really fucked him up. He really went off the rails after that rape conviction which many people including me was trumped up to get compo

 

[Fat Chance]

i think Ali beats Tyson, wouldn’t be scared and much more mentally strong, Tyson get frustrated and stopped on his feet in 11 with both eyes shut
My verdict:)

what I do argue is when people debating this say that foreman punched as hard as Tyson and was just as intimidating at the time, I don’t believe in a million years Ali’s rope a dope would’ve worked v a PRIME Tyson. Tyson’s speed, variety and power in either hand would’ve made sitting on the ropes impossible

Foremans power was in his uppercut (only), leaning back off the ropes negates said uppercut.
Ali predicted 10th rd stoppage v tyson when askedhow he'd fight him, 6 month prior to douglas stopping him in the tenth. Any opponent not scared of iron mike beat him, douglas employed the olde lead foot slap/dummy that kirkland laing used to defeat duran...a simple trick to undo a matchppwer fighter....like fury says heavys are shit

 

[Fat Chance]

" if holyfield ever moves up to heavy we're in trouble"

Kevin Rooney

 

[Metalartin]

I don't think anyone is daft enough to compare today's heavyweight scene vs the 60s and 70s. Regarding Ali, people forget that he was exiled for 4 years in what would have been his prime years. So you can't make that excuse for Tyson and not Ali, for not seeing their absolute peak. I've never considered Tyson the best heavyweight personally, maybe the most entertaining at his best but that was more because he was an animal in the ring. He made boxing mainstream again and his legacy will live on, long after he's gone though, which is a testament of his greatness.

As for today, the top 10 has some good fighters in it currently. Outside of that it might not be so great for the most part. It's not comparable to the golden era but it's better than it has been for a long time.

https://www.ringtv.com/ratings/?weightclass=272

I really don't understand how Ortiz has such a high ranking though. The only times he faced a top ranked fighter he got beat, twice. I'd place him down near the bottom of that list personally. It's about time Kownacki faced one of the top guys, but he's a PBC fighter, so I wouldn't hold my breath. There are some other fighters not in that top 10 worth mentioning too, Usyk and Dubois obviously. I'm also hearing good things about Hrgovic and Tony Yoka. Some are hoping for Joe Joyce to break into the top 10 mix too.

It's not nearly as bad as some make out. What is true, is not enough of them are facing each other and the networks and the promotional/management companies play a part in that(PBC especially).