The Conservative Party

[The perfect fumble]

apologies if I’m missing the full context here but he was born in London, which makes him pretty English to me.

Think on this, if everyone born in England is English and English is an ethnicity then everyone born in England is ethnically English, so where do all the ethnic minorities come from who were born in England?

 

[joe123]

Think on this, if everyone born in England is English and English is an ethnicity then everyone born in England is ethnically English, so where do all the ethnic minorities come from who were born in England?

Well I'd say you can be a combination of things no? White english, black english etc. I might be lacking in my interpretation of ethnicity or conflating it with nationality, but if someone is born in England not sure how they could be denied describing themselves as English (or British).

 

[The perfect fumble]

I’m not sure census categories are the best way to go with it either with ethnic groups. Scotland for example has both Black Scottish and Black British as options on theirs.

The census is not the best way to go about it, I agree, the categories they want counting are primarily concerned with finding out who lives where for the purpose of allocation of resources, so fuzzy edges are not the issue, though it's notable they specify Black British and not Black English. For example Jewish people are now cast as an ethnic group, until fairly recently they were treated as a religious group, but for the purposes of the census it is of no mind.

Notwithstanding this, it is self evidently true that ethnic groups exist and English is one of them and David Lammy is not ethnically English, that is simply a fact and stating it does not come with hidden meaning, it is simply a fact.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Well I'd say you can be a combination of things no? White english, black english etc. I might be lacking in my interpretation of ethnicity or conflating it with nationality, but if someone is born in England not sure how they could be denied describing themselves as English (or British).

Mate, ethnic groups exist, I'm white English, I am English, English is my ethnicity. David Lammy is not white English, he is not English, English is not his ethnicity and as there is no ethnic group black English then Lammy is not English, sometimes it really is as simple as that.

 

[meltonblue]

The census is not the best way to go about it, I agree, the categories they want counting are primarily concerned with finding out who lives where for the purpose of allocation of resources, so fuzzy edges are not the issue. For example Jewish people are now cast as an ethnic group, until fairly recently they were treated as a religious group, but for the purposes of the census it is of no mind.

Notwithstanding this, it is self evidently true that ethnic groups exist and English is one of them and David Lammy is not ethnically English, that is simply a fact and stating it does not come with hidden meaning, it is simply a fact.

What’s the argument that he can be classed as ethnically British rather than English outside of that’s just what the census has decided to have as options though?

 

[aguero93:20]

n England and Wales, there are 18 ethnic groups recommended for use by the government when asking for someone’s ethnicity. These are grouped into 5 ethnic groups, each with an ‘Any other’ option where people can write in their ethnicity using their own words. These groups were used in the 2011 Census of England and Wales.

A Tory, racist, hate filled corrupt government. But they tuk ur jubs.

 

[aguero93:20]

Mate, ethnic groups exist, I'm white English, I am English, English is my ethnicity. David Lammy is not white English, he is not English, English is not his ethnicity and as there is no ethnic group black English then Lammy is not English, sometimes it really is as simple as that.

Going on the same little row boat you're not Celtic so why don't you fuck off out of our island you saxon?

 

[The perfect fumble]

What’s the argument that he can be classed as ethnically British rather than English outside of that’s just what the census has decided to have as options though?

Okay, bear in mind I live in Halifax with a lovely Asian family just round the corner with two boys, both born here, explain to me what ethnically British is?

 

[The perfect fumble]

Going on the same little row boat you're not Celtic so why don't you fuck off out of our island you saxon?

They call me Norman.

 

[meltonblue]

Okay, bear in mind I live in Halifax with a lovely Asian family just round the corner with two boys, both born here, explain to me what ethnically British is?

To you I don’t know, that’s essentially the question I asked you! Aside from it is or isn’t an option on the census, why is black British fine but black English isn’t?

I’m not saying I have an answer personally, just querying it.