The Conservative Party

meltonblue said:
Me personally? Absolutely I do. Firstly because I’ve always believed public contracts should be in the public domain. Secondly, I think at a time of economic damage like this, the spending of taxpayer money should be more transparent not less. Thirdly, I want competency first and foremost in a pandemic. This should all have been done by the existing procurement teams. And finally, I want any government regardless of their colour to follow the rule of law.
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I’m absolutely shocked at this but fair enough. The process is more important than the outcome to you, regardless of how many people would have died as a result.

On your second point I’ve found someone on the left arguing that money is more important than lives. Will wonders never cease.

On your third point did Matt Hancock do all this directly himself? I’ve not checked so don’t know but would guess he didn’t. So if it weren’t Hancock who was it?
 
metalblue said:
You’re conveniently ignored the question. How would following this law have actually helped in getting supplies to the front line?
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oh I dunno - maybe use tried and trust suppliers who already supply stuff - it was clearly out there because any Tom Dick or Harry was getting stuff - and using reputable dealers it would mean they wouldn't be in the situation now with airfields full of containers full of PPE that isn't fit for purpose bought at a cost of £millions
 
bluethrunthru said:
oh I dunno - maybe use tried and trust suppliers who already supply stuff - it was clearly out there because any Tom Dick or Harry was getting stuff - and using reputable dealers it would mean they wouldn't be in the situation now with airfields full of containers full of PPE that isn't fit for purpose bought at a cost of £millions
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I suspect they tried the ones they normally used first mate to see if they could cope with the amount they wanted. When they got told no they went to the market.

Totally agree with you on your last point. Did they make a bit of a pigs ear of it? Absolutely they did in some parts. They most likely panicked. Would have following the law they broke have prevented this waste? Hard to say. Benefit of doubt and say yes it would have saved some cash. Would following the law resulted in longer lead times for stuff to get delivered? Yes, absolutely.

I’d even go as far to say as companies that provided substandard stuff should be brought to book.
 
Courtesy of "The News Quiz"...

Johnson saying now is not the time for complacency. Bang on, because that was a year ago when he was complacent.

And the right time for quarantining arrivals? Definitely February, but February last year.
 
metalblue said:
I’m absolutely shocked at this but fair enough. The process is more important than the outcome to you, regardless of how many people would have died as a result.

On your second point I’ve found someone on the left arguing that money is more important than lives. Will wonders never cease.

On your third point did Matt Hancock do all this directly himself? I’ve not checked so don’t know but would guess he didn’t. So if it weren’t Hancock who was it?
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Bear in mind I was only answering your first point on whether I cared.

On this, given the outcome of this particular process is purely lack of transparency and potential cronyism and nothing else, then yes. The idea that not publishing contracts post signing them may have had an impact on their ability to sign those contracts at speed in the first place is clearly fucking ridiculous, as is the idea that a pandemic should give carte blanche as to who they sign contracts with and why.

On the second point, I’m not entirely sure how you even get to that, but to clarify my own opinion, I think their approach to both PPE and track and trace cost considerably more than it could have done and also did cost lives. I couldn’t really care how much it cost monetarily in general terms as long as it was to companies that could fulfil the orders and that didn’t get the contract to begin with purely on account of being mates with the right people, as well as having no past experience in the field whatsoever. And I’m not on the left.

Third point, he’s ultimately accountable for the DHSC who proposed it. Clearly wasn’t solely him given it was a cross government initiative though.
 
meltonblue said:
That’s the other cases going through. You thinking this one is just a publicity stunt is a worrying start though for how you might react to those regardless of the judgment.
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I’m a stickler for the law being upheld, as I am sure we all are.

If it comes out this was cronyism then they need to resign but if it’s just them cutting corners in desperation, even if the law was broken, I will have sympathy.

I know full well that one accusation of corruption that made National news, is total bollocks. The timeline was wrong and those involved on the recipient end, laughed when they read it.

That doesn’t mean other accusations aren’t true but there’s a huge difference cutting corners to save lives to cutting corners to get your mates a pay day.

I am sure we agree if it’s the latter they deserve the book thrown at them and if it’s the former they should apologise but we should have sympathy.
 
Ban-jani said:
I’m a stickler for the law being upheld, as I am sure we all are.

If it comes out this was cronyism then they need to resign but if it’s just them cutting corners in desperation, even if the law was broken, I will have sympathy.

I know full well that one accusation of corruption that made National news, is total bollocks. The timeline was wrong and those involved on the recipient end, laughed when they read it.

That doesn’t mean other accusations aren’t true but there’s a huge difference cutting corners to save lives to cutting corners to get your mates a pay day.

I am sure we agree if it’s the latter they deserve the book thrown at them and if it’s the former they should apologise but we should have sympathy.
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Yes I agree with that.
 
metalblue said:
I suspect they tried the ones they normally used first mate to see if they could cope with the amount they wanted. When they got told no they went to the market.

Totally agree with you on your last point. Did they make a bit of a pigs ear of it? Absolutely they did in some parts. They most likely panicked. Would have following the law they broke have prevented this waste? Hard to say. Benefit of doubt and say yes it would have saved some cash. Would following the law resulted in longer lead times for stuff to get delivered? Yes, absolutely.

I’d even go as far to say as companies that provided substandard stuff should be brought to book.
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You really know fuck all don't you? Or your love of this govt is blinding you. They DIDN'T go to the market. They opened a special "pipeline" where people and organisations who had links to the Tory Party or who were "known" to Ministers, MP's and officials and that provided the overriding access to billions£ of public money.
 
All kicking off at Number 10. Advisor sacked for leaking Gove being demoted.

Gove allegedly plotting with Sunak to fuck Boris off as he doesn't want to be portrayed as the fall guy for the Brexit fuck up. He wants that all on Johnson's head.

You'd think they'd be more bothered about real world shit than power plays, then again it is the Tories.
 
mat said:
All kicking off at Number 10. Advisor sacked for leaking Gove being demoted.

Gove allegedly plotting with Sunak to fuck Boris off as he doesn't want to be portrayed as the fall guy for the Brexit fuck up. He wants that all on Johnson's head.

You'd think they'd be more bothered about real world shit than power plays, then again it is the Tories.
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Add to that whitty refusing to endorse the lockdown easing plan but now being pressured.

Willing to risk killing more to give us all an Easter boost, funny how all the good news is always on a Bank Holiday
 
urban genie said:
Add to that whitty refusing to endorse the lockdown easing plan but now being pressured.

Willing to risk killing more to give us all an Easter boost, funny how all the good news is always on a Bank Holiday
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after the Xmas fuck up Johnson wants the one we are in to be the last lockdown.............until he is forced to call the next one 2 weeks after Easter..........vote clown get circus
 
bluethrunthru said:
two wickets down in two High Court deliveries?

www.bbc.co.uk

High Court urged to overturn PM's decision to stand by Priti Patel

Boris Johnson's defence of the home secretary over bullying claims caused "dismay and anger", a union says.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
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Wow. That must be a first - civil servants seek judicial review of a Prime Minister's claim that a minister didn't breach the ministerial code by bullying civil servants, and that (as judge and jury) he prejudged the whole case by publicly supporting Patel before he'd seen the independent report which he then tried to bury.

Nothing to see here.
 
He guess what? Having broken free of being run by unelected bureaucrats by installing the unelected Frosty the Showman to the Cabinet turns out that yesterdays events have ended up with Carrie Symonds running number 10........no I don't recall he standing in any election either - its a corrupt chumocracy enacting the will of a select band of people.
 
bluethrunthru said:
You really know fuck all don't you? Or your love of this govt is blinding you. They DIDN'T go to the market. They opened a special "pipeline" where people and organisations who had links to the Tory Party or who were "known" to Ministers, MP's and officials and that provided the overriding access to billions£ of public money.
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What a load of old tripe.

The government were inundated with over 15,000 offers of help for PPE and equipment so to help manage this they setup a high priority lane. 47 contracts were awarded (out of 493 potential supplies put through the high priority lane) worth £1.7bn from this Lane. 7 referrals came from Peers of all parties, 12 from MPs of all parties, 18 from officials and 5 unknown (although 1 was by error). In total 25% of the original referrals in came from opposition MPs and peers so it is reasonable to assume that 5 contracts were awarded by referrals from non-Tory MPs and peers versus 14 that came from Tory MPs and peers.

IN PARALLEL there was the regular supply chain route which was also procuring PPE and equipment

BOTH supply routes went through the same 8 stage audit process. It is correct that, despite going through the same process, more contracts were awarded (by %) from the high priority lane for reasons unclear.

The total of all PPE contracts awarded during this time was £18bn. So we know that £1.7bn from the high priority lane leaving £16.3bn being acquired with the normal supply chain.

Finally we know the government overpaid by about £10bn by on like for like supplies due to MARKET conditions.

So your conspiracy theory is really just a load of old bollocks really, isn’t it? But yeah I know fuck all so you must be right eh?
 
metalblue said:
What a load of old tripe.

The government were inundated with over 15,000 offers of help for PPE and equipment so to help manage this they setup a high priority lane. 47 contracts were awarded (out of 493 potential supplies put through the high priority lane) worth £1.7bn from this Lane. 7 referrals came from Peers of all parties, 12 from MPs of all parties, 18 from officials and 5 unknown (although 1 was by error). In total 25% of the original referrals in came from opposition MPs and peers so it is reasonable to assume that 5 contracts were awarded by referrals from non-Tory MPs and peers versus 14 that came from Tory MPs and peers.

IN PARALLEL there was the regular supply chain route which was also procuring PPE and equipment

BOTH supply routes went through the same 8 stage audit process. It is correct that, despite going through the same process, more contracts were awarded (by %) from the high priority lane for reasons unclear.

The total of all PPE contracts awarded during this time was £18bn. So we know that £1.7bn from the high priority lane leaving £16.3bn being acquired with the normal supply chain.

Finally we know the government overpaid by about £10bn by on like for like supplies due to MARKET conditions.

So your conspiracy theory is really just a load of old bollocks really, isn’t it? But yeah I know fuck all so you must be right eh?
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Hey you don't have to believe me - read what Parliament itself had to say - Whilst you are happy to have your taxes wasted in a chumocracy I am willing to be nobody elected them to do so - I also expect few are surprised


www.bbc.co.uk

Covid spending: Watchdog finds MPs' contacts were given priority

The spending watchdog found £10.5bn was spent on pandemic-related contracts awarded without competitive tender.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
 
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