The Conservative Party

[Chippy_boy]

What is a year going to do? The mega rich will keep more of their money. Everyone else is worse off today than they were a week ago because of the collapse of the pound.

Rubbish. You didn't buy your stuff from Morrisons this morning in US dollars. Until that filters through - and maybe the pound will recover - no-one is worse off.

As infkation continues to outpace wages and pensions etc this will just get worse. So after a year of 95%+ of us being worse off how are things going to get any better?

There is zero evidence that the Truss plan is going to work, in fact there is significant evidence already that its going to be a disaster.

There's plenty of evidence of cutting taxes being a positive boost the economy. Stop being so closed minded and wait to see if it works. It well might.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

2010 £1=$1.60
2022 £1=$1.05 and falling.

The party of fiscal prudence was in charge throughout.

Has any peacetime government ever destroyed our economy as much as the Tories have in the past 12 years?

 

[robbieh]

Sunak attended Winchester College, no?

My mistake. Can I swap him for Rees-Mogg?

 

[Chippy_boy]

2010 £1=$1.60
2022 £1=$1.05 and falling.

The party of fiscal prudence was in charge throughout.

Has any peacetime government ever destroyed our economy as much as the Tories have in the past 12 years?

I seriously wonder sometimes that if things pick up, some of the posters on here will be disappointed.

£1 was 1.08 on Thursday and now it's 1.07 have recovered nearly all the losses after the initial market reaction. We're less than 1 day in.

Also, the decline in the pound over the long term has been as much as anything to do with the strength of the dollar, rather than the weakness of the pound. The pound is at more or less the same level against Euro as it was 25 years ago, and against the Yen it is slightly higher over the same period.

But yes, the pound has underperformed. We've had poor growth rates for decades in large part due to relative lack of long term (private) investment and institutionalised poor productivity rates compared to all major economies barring Japan. Truss is clearly trying to fix this, but sure, after 1 day we can say she's failed?????!

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

So when Labour are in power and world events cause economic disaster and hardship, it's not Labours fault. But when the Tories are in power, and with COVID we have the worst economic shock since WW2, immediately followed by a war in Europe causing a 10X increase in gas prices, the lefties on here say the Tories are to blame for our predicament. Right.

Its about choices - Labour did everything that you would expect and tories would have done the exact same. Tories then blame labour, that politics I get that, after time in office you collect baggage but tores would have done the exact same.

This crisis, Tories have chosen to pick this particular time in world events to cut taxes and to slant those tax cuts to the mega rich. The result of that decision is the massive fall in the value of the pound as the markets think this will have a detrimental impact on the ability of the government to pay its debts. These tax cuts are not alligned to any reduction in spending - the markets dont share the view they will stimulate growth.

The collapse in market confidence and reduction of the value in the pound has compounded the original problem. Growth could be even slower.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

I seriously wonder sometimes that if things pick up, some of the posters on here will be disappointed.

£1 was 1.08 on Thursday and now it's 1.07 have recovered nearly all the losses after the initial market reaction. We're less than 1 day in.

If is a small word doing a lot of heavy lifting there, my chippy friend.

Did you read Ken Clarke’s damning summation of Kami-Kwarsi budget?

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

2010 £1=$1.60
2022 £1=$1.05 and falling.

The party of fiscal prudence was in charge throughout.

Has any peacetime government ever destroyed our economy as much as the Tories have in the past 12 years?

The question is, is it by design?

Many years ago I read a piece where neolib’s (Koch was mentioned) in the US look to segregate markets so that they can go in and pick them off, creating new states with their own regulations for tax, etc. Never thought it could happen here but after Kwarteng’s announcement it looks, to me, that this could be the dawn of the selling off of a nation.

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

So when Labour are in power and world events cause economic disaster and hardship, it's not Labours fault. But when the Tories are in power, and with COVID we have the worst economic shock since WW2, immediately followed by a war in Europe causing a 10X increase in gas prices, the lefties on here say the Tories are to blame for our predicament. Right.

The only problem with your assertion is that the country was heading for the dustbin well before anyone had heard of Covid.
10 years of pointless austerity, when borrowing costs were lower than they’ve ever been and are likely to ever be in the future. Infrastructure building would then have made a massive difference to the here and now.
Proper insulation for all would have been a fraction of the cost of supporting the energy companies prices. Replacing Victorian sewers would have saved billions of gallons of water and meant we weren’t pouring actual shit into the rivers and seas. Hospitals literally falling down, no workforce to speak of because of ideology. Improving existing railway networks and increasing capacity giving later service availability. Putting in a network of car charging points BEFORE announcing petrol and diesel cars being phased out.
Lack of willingness to train our own healthcare workers (we’re actually going to red list countries to get them now, which is shameful), when many thousands are applying but the numbers are capped. Food banks being lauded as some sort of social philanthropy scheme and school children being sacrificed, as usual, unless you can pay.
Can’t believe you’re still coming on here, defending this series of policies that NOBODY voted for, not even you. It seems you’re truly locked into the cult and so wedded to ideology, you can’t see beyond it.

I do seem to remember that you were crying out for a ‘big state’ when covid swooped in and terrified the life out of you and, how you felt then, is how millions feel now.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

Ps. This current situation, which has been exposed in less than 24 hrs, must be a wake-up for even the most ardent of Tory voters.

It was so immediate it even took the author by surprise.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

The question is, is it by design?

Many years ago I read a piece where neolib’s (Koch was mentioned) in the US look to segregate markets so that they can go in and pick them off, creating new states with their own regulations for tax, etc. Never thought it could happen here but after Kwarteng’s announcement it looks, to me, that this could be the dawn of the selling off of a nation.

It could well be, but how can we prove that? They have flags in the background of every media clip released, so they must love their country, right?

The biggest question for me is what can we do as a people to get us out of this tailspin best?

 

[blueparrot]

Rubbish. You didn't buy your stuff from Morrisons this morning in US dollars. Until that filters through - and maybe the pound will recover - no-one is worse off.



There's plenty of evidence of cutting taxes being a positive boost the economy. Stop being so closed minded and wait to see if it works. It well might.

Unconditional Tory policy support without any rational thinking. They'll be proud of you.

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

I seriously wonder sometimes that if things pick up, some of the posters on here will be disappointed.

£1 was 1.08 on Thursday and now it's 1.07 have recovered nearly all the losses after the initial market reaction. We're less than 1 day in.

So because we have come back from a record low of 1.06 to 1.08 its all going great is it?

 

[Chippy_boy]

The only problem with your assertion is that the country was heading for the dustbin well before anyone had heard of Covid.
10 years of pointless austerity, when borrowing costs were lower than they’ve ever been and are likely to ever be in the future. Infrastructure building would then have made a massive difference to the here and now.
Proper insulation for all would have been a fraction of the cost of supporting the energy companies prices. Replacing Victorian sewers would have saved billions of gallons of water and meant we weren’t pouring actual shit into the rivers and seas. Hospitals literally falling down, no workforce to speak of because of ideology. Improving existing railway networks and increasing capacity giving later service availability. Putting in a network of car charging points BEFORE announcing petrol and diesel cars being phased out.
Lack of willingness to train our own healthcare workers (we’re actually going to red list countries to get them now, which is shameful), when many thousands are applying but the numbers are capped. Food banks being lauded as some sort of social philanthropy scheme and school children being sacrificed, as usual, unless you can pay.
Can’t believe you’re still coming on here, defending this series of policies that NOBODY voted for, not even you. It seems you’re truly locked into the cult and so wedded to ideology, you can’t see beyond it.

I do seem to remember that you were crying out for a ‘big state’ when covid swooped in and terrified the life out of you and, how you felt then, is how millions feel now.

Whilst I can see the attractiveness of splurging on infrastructure spending when rates are low and borrowing is cheap, where would we be now, had we done that and THEN found there was a couple of hundred billion more needed to pay for COVID? Hard to imagine how we would not be in a worse place economically.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

It could well be, but how can we prove that? They have flags in the background of every media clip released, so they must love their country, right?

The biggest question for me is what can we do as a people to get us out of this tailspin best?

There has to come a point where the people take the reins away from them and force us to a GE.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

There has to come a point where the people take the reins away from them and force us to a GE.

Absolutely, but even that isn’t a given. Even then, they have 18 months to fuck us up more, especially if it is deliberate.

Then, the next 5 years will be utterly grim, whoever is in will lose power and it begins again in 2030.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Unconditional Tory policy support without any rational thinking. They'll be proud of you.

I am not even a big fan of the Tories. I am a fan of conversative - small c - policies.

If you want to talk about unconditional, it's the unconditional lefty opposition on here which is more striking. Not a soul even prepared to contemplate (a) that the economic crisis at the moment is not all the Tories fault (when patently it isn't) and (b) that the new approach Truss is taking might actually work.

 

[Chippy_boy]

There has to come a point where the people take the reins away from them and force us to a GE.

Dreaming.

 

[bluethrunthru]

We are just going to see more and more of this with such a weak currency - the nations wealth will be exported as we become weaker and weaker

 

[blueparrot]

I am not even a big fan of the Tories. I am a fan of conversative - small c - policies.

If you want to talk about unconditional, it's the unconditional lefty opposition on here which is more striking. Not a soul even prepared to contemplate (a) that the economic crisis at the moment is not all the Tories fault (when patently it isn't) and (b) that the new approach Truss is taking might actually work.

These aren't small c conservative policies though are they. They are too big C even for many sitting conservatives.

 

[Chippy_boy]

So because we have come back from a record low of 1.06 to 1.08 its all going great is it?

No, and I said as much if you bothered to read my post. I suppose this is the Tories fault as well, and nothing to do with the dollar getting stronger: