The Labour Government

[metalblue]

Why did they pay Nurses and stop the strikes in the health sector ? why did they pay Train unions and stop the strikes? why have they changed workers rights bill in favor of equality, fair pay for workers? why are they bringing in renters bill to help the lowest who face eviction ? why are they putting the biggest tax burdens on corporations and businesses? why have they raised the minimum wage for the poorest ? why have they retained the triple lock for 13m pensioners ? why are they funding 8 billion for the development of green technologies and a number of clean energy projects? why have they allocated 12 billion for infected blood compensation ? why have they created cross departmental child poverty taskforce? why they bringing in free breakfast clubs for schools ?

They haven’t paid the nurses. The nurses rejected the pay award from last year (although they still get it) and this years offering is derisory.

They did give the JDs a big uplift - presume you mean them??

 

[mackenzie]

They haven’t paid the nurses. The nurses rejected the pay award from last year (although they still get it) and this years offering is derisory.

They did give the JDs a big uplift - presume you mean them??

Plus...giving money is the easy part.
There were a few posters applauding Sunak, when Chancellor, for going gung ho on the giving away money bit.

I said it then and I'll say it again now....that's the easy bit

 

[metalblue]

I fully understand who they are and yes I am an evil shareholder because there is no other option as the system has been created this way.

Pension funds are only a small percentage in the UK stock market, its actually less than 5% that is owned by pensions and insurance companies. Do you want to know which country has the highest UK share value per capita ... The Caymen Islands, 1000 times higher than anywhere else, followed by Lichtenstein and Luxembourg and we know the only individuals with the means to have accounts in these jurisdictions are the very wealthy.

Ultimately my point was a more philosophical question of how ethical it is to put money above everything else all for the top few percent to have a good life whilst the majority struggle. Is there a more equitable way of doing things that stops the massive wealth inequality that is growing yearly.

The problem is no one who has fought tooth and nail and spent their entire lives to get in to the hallowed upper echelons of money is going to want to give that up. That includes politicians. The system protects itself.

 

[Kompany Car]

Yes there is: the income tax system. Compare Scandinavia with elsewhere. They have higher taxes and less gap between the rich and the rest. Anybody would think we have never had a labour gov., given that our inequality grows all the time. Our biggest failing is overtaxing the least well off.

Income tax only works if you have an income. Most high net worth people have assets whether that be equities, property, fine art etc, which they use as securities for loans. By doing so they pay the agreed interest rate only often only a couple of percent and no tax as its classified as a debt. Meanwhile the asset grows in value completely exempt from tax as the profit from its sale hasn't been realised.

 

[SamTheGuru]

Right, the only way to settle this one is to get the name of the company off @SamTheGuru )

It gets quite incestuous in contract law. If you are providing a term service contract for local government then 99/100 then change in law will be negotiated as an employer risk. Under any form of NEC contract then X2 will allow this as a compensation event. The NI employer contribution increase has been ruled as a change in law so what happens is (in layman's terms):

- Contractors have term service agreements with local government (ranging from 4 years to 7+4 years)
- Local governments completely rely upon the funding they receive from central government, which tends to be the basis of labour/conservative and brexit/non-brexit
- Inflationary mechanisms are built into the contract (often variable in effect and also with variable lag of when it takes effect)
- All of the above gets passed back on to the consumer through the tax we pay. So in this case through an NI employer contribution increase, we are increasing a circular debt that we will not start to feel the effect of until 3-4 years time.)

 

[KS55]

Income tax only works if you have an income. Most high net worth people have assets whether that be equities, property, fine art etc, which they use as securities for loans. By doing so they pay the agreed interest rate only often only a couple of percent and no tax as its classified as a debt. Meanwhile the asset grows in value completely exempt from tax as the profit from its sale hasn't been realised.

There have been attempts to tax unrealised capital gains both here and elsewhere. Patchy success. Asset prices are a difficulty, granted. The taxing of consumption, rather than production, is a partial response. Brexit gave us the opportunity to do this, which we have ignored. The chancellor’s recent big hike in taxes on the supply side doesn’t give me any comfort. Its effect is to increase the tax rate of the less well off, again.

 

[I'm With Stupid]

The problem is no one who has fought tooth and nail and spent their entire lives to get in to the hallowed upper echelons of money is going to want to give that up. That includes politicians. The system protects itself.

Haha, good one.

 

[Vic]

It gets quite incestuous in contract law. If you are providing a term service contract for local government then 99/100 then change in law will be negotiated as an employer risk. Under any form of NEC contract then X2 will allow this as a compensation event. The NI employer contribution increase has been ruled as a change in law so what happens is (in layman's terms):

- Contractors have term service agreements with local government (ranging from 4 years to 7+4 years)
- Local governments completely rely upon the funding they receive from central government, which tends to be the basis of labour/conservative and brexit/non-brexit
- Inflationary mechanisms are built into the contract (often variable in effect and also with variable lag of when it takes effect)
- All of the above gets passed back on to the consumer through the tax we pay. So in this case through an NI employer contribution increase, we are increasing a circular debt that we will not start to feel the effect of until 3-4 years time.)

And that's the layman's explanation...

I think we need the idiot's guide.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

There’s been a huge furore over the last day or so about the economy, everybody saying that inflation was going up while economy was going down. Now we see the exact opposite, inflation down, economy up.

Surely a good thing?

 

[Blue and true]

There’s been a huge furore over the last or so about the economy, everybody saying that inflation was going up while economy was going down. Now we see the exact opposite, inflation down, economy up.

Surely a good thing?

I'd wait until we've heard the unbiased interpretation of GB News and The Heil.

 

[inbetween]

I fully understand who they are and yes I am an evil shareholder because there is no other option as the system has been created this way.

Pension funds are only a small percentage in the UK stock market, its actually less than 5% that is owned by pensions and insurance companies. Do you want to know which country has the highest UK share value per capita ... The Caymen Islands, 1000 times higher than anywhere else, followed by Lichtenstein and Luxembourg and we know the only individuals with the means to have accounts in these jurisdictions are the very wealthy.

Ultimately my point was a more philosophical question of how ethical it is to put money above everything else all for the top few percent to have a good life whilst the majority struggle. Is there a more equitable way of doing things that stops the massive wealth inequality that is growing yearly.

This is the crux of the problem though, we're asking people to not put money above everything else but that is precisely what we do as a society. It's probably why we'll end up with a Tory government next time and not a Labour one regardless of what Labour actually do.

Globalism is a problem because your local bookshop, baker, grocer, butcher... They've all been replaced by massive conglamorates and the major supermarkets. We're well aware of this but where will you shop today? You won't goto a local baker for your bread, instead you'll go to Aldi because they're cheaper. So we talk of hating shareholders and the capitalist system but we readily accept the benefits and turn a blind eye to that system when it benefits us?

I don't really know what the solution to this is but we criticise the country that we live in and yet we are the ones who signed up for it. We cannot have a system where we all pay nothing and get everything. You can't get cheap bread whilst damaging the economies of scale that exist to make your bread cheaper.

I read of mention of the Scandinavian countries but the Scandinavian countries ultimately rely upon everybody paying more and not just the rich. Labour had to promise not to put up taxes on the general population. Why did they have to do that if the truth is we all want something better? The fact is we do want something better but we want it for free and that's the problem. It perfectly explains why we will probably get back a Tory government in 5 years time.

 

[stonerblue]

This is the crux of the problem though, we're asking people to not put money above everything else but that is precisely what we do as a society. It's probably why we'll end up with a Tory government next time and not a Labour one regardless of what Labour actually do.
Only if you're greedy. My daughter has recentlt become wealthy. She now earns more in interest on her savings than her monthly wage. Should she be happy with that or should she investin shares in the hope of a higher return?
Globalism is a problem because your local bookshop, baker, grocer, butcher... They've all been replaced by massive conglamorates and the major supermarkets. We're well aware of this but where will you shop today? You won't goto a local baker for your bread, instead you'll go to Aldi because they're cheaper. So we talk of hating shareholders and the capitalist system but we readily accept the benefits and turn a blind eye to that system when it benefits us?
The capitalist system is the reason why you won't find many independent bakers on the high street.
I don't really know what the solution to this is but we criticise the country that we live in and yet we are the ones who signed up for it. We cannot have a system where we all pay nothing and get everything. You can't get cheap bread whilst damaging the economies of scale that exist to make your bread cheaper.

I read of mention of the Scandinavian countries but the Scandinavian countries ultimately rely upon everybody paying more and not just the rich. Labour had to promise not to put up taxes on the general population. Why did they have to do that if the truth is we all want something better? The fact is we do want something better but we want it for free and that's the problem. It perfectly explains why we will probably get back a Tory government in 5 years time.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Presumably we are all expecting a jail sentence for disgraced MP Mike Amesbury for agrivated assault ? For repeatedly punching a man whilst on the ground? Or do we think we are going to see more evidence of our two teir justice system in action?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

This is the crux of the problem though, we're asking people to not put money above everything else but that is precisely what we do as a society. It's probably why we'll end up with a Tory government next time and not a Labour one regardless of what Labour actually do.

Globalism is a problem because your local bookshop, baker, grocer, butcher... They've all been replaced by massive conglamorates and the major supermarkets. We're well aware of this but where will you shop today? You won't goto a local baker for your bread, instead you'll go to Aldi because they're cheaper. So we talk of hating shareholders and the capitalist system but we readily accept the benefits and turn a blind eye to that system when it benefits us?

I don't really know what the solution to this is but we criticise the country that we live in and yet we are the ones who signed up for it. We cannot have a system where we all pay nothing and get everything. You can't get cheap bread whilst damaging the economies of scale that exist to make your bread cheaper.

I read of mention of the Scandinavian countries but the Scandinavian countries ultimately rely upon everybody paying more and not just the rich. Labour had to promise not to put up taxes on the general population. Why did they have to do that if the truth is we all want something better? The fact is we do want something better but we want it for free and that's the problem. It perfectly explains why we will probably get back a Tory government in 5 years time.

It will rest on the economy imo, if they grow it and they manage to cover their large spending excesses they will probably get in again. If they don't they will surely be out?

The economy is doing worse so far under the new government, but it is very early days.

 

[TinFoilHat]

Presumably we are all expecting a jail sentence for disgraced MP Mike Amesbury for agrivated assault ? For repeatedly punching a man whilst on the ground? Or do we think we are going to see more evidence of our two teir justice system in action?

If found guilty I expect a suspended sentence.

 

[Uncle Wally One Ball]

Presumably we are all expecting a jail sentence for disgraced MP Mike Amesbury for agrivated assault ? For repeatedly punching a man whilst on the ground? Or do we think we are going to see more evidence of our two teir justice system in action?

Suspended sentence, community service order and fine I would think. Doubt he has any previous convictions and his career will be over.

 

[stonerblue]

Presumably we are all expecting a jail sentence for disgraced MP Mike Amesbury for agrivated assault ? For repeatedly punching a man whilst on the ground? Or do we think we are going to see more evidence of our two teir justice system in action?

I'm not. first offence?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Suspended sentence, community service order and fine I would think. Doubt he has any previous convictions and his career will be over.

Should be jailed, but I suspect you will be right. He will get off as he's an MP.

 

[The blue phantom]

Should be jailed, but I suspect you will be right. He will get off as he's an MP.

So you reckon someone doing exactly the same as him with no criminal past would be sent down?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

I'm not. first offence?

More than one punch means the sentence should be heavier according to the guidelines.