The Manager

[Anonymous]

They won a lot during the Galactico period. Including 2 league titles and 2 CL titles. Their downfall was when they stopped buying world class players and bought BIG NAME players. There is a big difference. Turning down Ronaldinho, because he was not handsome enough to sell shirts (ironic since Ronaldinho probably 3rd biggest player after Beckham and Ronaldo), selling Etoo to get Owen for shirts etc.

If you look at the CL winner squads over the last 13 or so years, 70% of nearly an entire team of world class players.

No they didn't, they won two La Liga's and one CL. In the immediate years after Perez's appointment. After that they won nish for how long?

Yes if you want to be pedantic about when they officially started the 'Galatico' project, but Real Madrid have ALWAYS run the Galatico project all the way back to the days of Di Steffano and them winning 5 CL titles.

The Galatico policy failed due to buying the big names and world class players. Rumours at the time were Del Bosque got sacked, because he wanted Canavaro and Nesta instead of Beckham.

I'm not being pedantic, I'm pointing out a factual error in your post. Now tell again, how many titles did the Galacticos win over an 8 year period?

Also, how do you explain all the clubs other than Madrid and Barcelona who have won the CL since it's inception?

Comes back to the same thing ... our squad is top drawer and is capable of winning everything out there. Can it be improved? Yes, because any squad can, but it doesn't change the fact that even by your own admission there are only 3 teams on planet earth who have better squads than us. And none of them won the CL last season.

 

[NipHolmes]

They won a lot during the Galactico period. Including 2 league titles and 2 CL titles. Their downfall was when they stopped buying world class players and bought BIG NAME players. There is a big difference. Turning down Ronaldinho, because he was not handsome enough to sell shirts (ironic since Ronaldinho probably 3rd biggest player after Beckham and Ronaldo), selling Etoo to get Owen for shirts etc.

If you look at the CL winner squads over the last 13 or so years, 70% of nearly an entire team of world class players.

No they didn't, they won two La Liga's and one CL. In the immediate years after Perez's appointment. After that they won nish for how long?

2 leagues and 1 champs league is more than nothing.

The world class player debate is one you'll lose fella. Teams need quality players and always have done. Your team depends on the quality of its spine. We have a world class spine but have a few players who are off the standard. The 2 Spanish sides are made up of genuine quality throughout. The argument that Real are Real is a bad point too, we must strive to compete with them if we want to be top dogs. A strong academy and a final investment on our starting eleven is needed and 5 years time we will be toe to toe imo. Spending on 2 players a year from here on in should be the maximum.<br /><br />-- Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:20 pm --<br /><br />

No they didn't, they won two La Liga's and one CL. In the immediate years after Perez's appointment. After that they won nish for how long?

Yes if you want to be pedantic about when they officially started the 'Galatico' project, but Real Madrid have ALWAYS run the Galatico project all the way back to the days of Di Steffano and them winning 5 CL titles.

The Galatico policy failed due to buying the big names and world class players. Rumours at the time were Del Bosque got sacked, because he wanted Canavaro and Nesta instead of Beckham.

I'm not being pedantic, I'm pointing out a factual error in your post. Now tell again, how many titles did the Galacticos win over an 8 year period?

Also, how do you explain all the clubs other than Madrid and Barcelona who have won the CL since it's inception?

Comes back to the same thing ... our squad is top drawer and is capable of winning everything out there. Can it be improved? Yes, because any squad can, but it doesn't change the fact that even by your own admission there are only 3 teams on planet earth who have better squads than us. And none of them won the CL last season.

To have a top drawer squad then you must complete all roles within the squad position wise. We have a single wide man in Sinclair. Real have Ronaldo and Di Maria. Barcalona have Messi, Alacantra, Affelay and Sanchez who all play wide as well ad proper wide man in Pedro and Tello.

Barca need to strengthen in CB and Real need to buy a CB too and both teams are imo complete.

 

[Anonymous]

They won a lot during the Galactico period. Including 2 league titles and 2 CL titles. Their downfall was when they stopped buying world class players and bought BIG NAME players. There is a big difference. Turning down Ronaldinho, because he was not handsome enough to sell shirts (ironic since Ronaldinho probably 3rd biggest player after Beckham and Ronaldo), selling Etoo to get Owen for shirts etc.

If you look at the CL winner squads over the last 13 or so years, 70% of nearly an entire team of world class players.

No they didn't, they won two La Liga's and one CL. In the immediate years after Perez's appointment. After that they won nish for how long?

2 leagues and 1 champs league is more than nothing.

The world class player debate is one you'll lose fella. Teams need quality players and always have done. Your team depends on the quality of its spine. We have a world class spine but have a few players who are off the standard. The 2 Spanish sides are made up of genuine quality throughout. The argument that Real are Real is a bad point too, we must strive to compete with them if we want to be top dogs. A strong academy and a final investment on our starting eleven is needed and 5 years time we will be toe to toe imo. Spending on 2 players a year from here on in should be the maximum.

-- Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:20 pm --

Yes if you want to be pedantic about when they officially started the 'Galatico' project, but Real Madrid have ALWAYS run the Galatico project all the way back to the days of Di Steffano and them winning 5 CL titles.

The Galatico policy failed due to buying the big names and world class players. Rumours at the time were Del Bosque got sacked, because he wanted Canavaro and Nesta instead of Beckham.

I'm not being pedantic, I'm pointing out a factual error in your post. Now tell again, how many titles did the Galacticos win over an 8 year period?

Also, how do you explain all the clubs other than Madrid and Barcelona who have won the CL since it's inception?

Comes back to the same thing ... our squad is top drawer and is capable of winning everything out there. Can it be improved? Yes, because any squad can, but it doesn't change the fact that even by your own admission there are only 3 teams on planet earth who have better squads than us. And none of them won the CL last season.

To have a top drawer squad then you must complete all roles within the squad position wise. We have a single wide man in Sinclair. Real have Ronaldo and Di Maria. Barcalona have Messi, Alacantra, Affelay and Sanchez who all play wide as well ad proper wide man in Pedro and Tello.

Barca need to strengthen in CB and Real need to buy a CB too and both teams are imo complete.

I get fully the points you two are making about improving our squad. What I'm saying is that you don't need a complete squad to win titles and trophies. In fact, even with a complete squad there's no guarantee of success.

Anyway, the point is moot. Look at our showings in the EUROPA league as well as last season's CL exit. Our squad is better than that.

 

[supercrystal7]

No they didn't, they won two La Liga's and one CL. In the immediate years after Perez's appointment. After that they won nish for how long?

Yes if you want to be pedantic about when they officially started the 'Galatico' project, but Real Madrid have ALWAYS run the Galatico project all the way back to the days of Di Steffano and them winning 5 CL titles.

The Galatico policy failed due to buying the big names and world class players. Rumours at the time were Del Bosque got sacked, because he wanted Canavaro and Nesta instead of Beckham.

I'm not being pedantic, I'm pointing out a factual error in your post. Now tell again, how many titles did the Galacticos win over an 8 year period?

Also, how do you explain all the clubs other than Madrid and Barcelona who have won the CL since it's inception?

Comes back to the same thing ... our squad is top drawer and is capable of winning everything out there. Can it be improved? Yes, because any squad can, but it doesn't change the fact that even by your own admission there are only 3 teams on planet earth who have better squads than us. And none of them won the CL last season.

Yes it was a mistake, fair enough.

I already pointed out to you, the Galatico's did not have a team of world class players. They had world class players in certain positions and then a bunch of Pavon's. Teams were picked on names alone.

With the explosion of money in the CL in the last 12 or so years, 70% of the CL winners have had a team of world class players. Inter, Barcelona, United, Madrid, Bayern and the early Milan team were full of world class players. You can point to Porto, Chelsea and Liverpool, but they are the exceptions rather than the normal. Liverpool and Chelsea also had to completely give up on the league to do this. Whilst they both had a fantastic history in the competition, which other teams still feared. Going to Anfield is a tough place for European teams based on reputation alone. Both got exceptionally lucky as well.

2012-Chelsea worst team to win it and incredibly lucky, gave up league finished 5th
2011-Barcelona full of world class players
2010-Inter full of world class players
2009-Barcelona full of world class players
2008 Manchester United full of world class players
2007-Milan aging team around your level
2006-Barcelona full of world class players
2005-Liverpool
2004-Porto did well, underrated and better than given credit for
2003-Milan full of world class players
2002 Madrid full of world class players
2001-Bayern around your level

Notice a trend? In recent years to win the CL you need a team full of world class players. 7 years a team full of world class players has won it, 2 years a team on your level, once a team below your level and twice teams way below your level.

It's a cup competition and anything can happen, but to have sustained success in the CL a team full of world class players is needed.

 

[Anonymous]

It's a cup competition and anything can happen, but to have sustained success in the CL a team full of world class players is needed.

What do all the clubs who didn't have world class players in every position have in common? Were they all simply lucky?

Anyway, we're going round in circles. To put it bluntly, sustained success in the CL isn't important for me personally. Winning our league every year is. With knock out competitions, as you say, anything can happen.

Just out of curiosity, who do you support and what brings you to Bluemoon?

 

[supercrystal7]

It's a cup competition and anything can happen, but to have sustained success in the CL a team full of world class players is needed.

What do all the clubs who didn't have world class players in every position have in common? Were they all simply lucky?

Anyway, we're going round in circles. To put it bluntly, sustained success in the CL isn't important for me personally. Winning our league every year is. With knock out competitions, as you say, anything can happen.

Just out of curiosity, who do you support and what brings you to Bluemoon?

Well Liverpool and Chelsea were EXTREMELY lucky, but they also had great fighting spirit and a sense of belief. Plus they had a fear factor in the competition. The Milan team in 05 was an unbelievable team, literally every position had a world class player, hence them dicking on Liverpool and going 3-0. However, in a cup competition anything can happen.

Anyway it depends on what your targets are. For instance Moratti has spent so much delivering the league title and CL to Inter, he has cut back for a bit. This is fair enough and Inter have to accept the tough times coming up. It all depends on what the aims are for City, which determines what must be done.

Even winning the league every year depends on what your opponents are doing. Ferguson has a stubborn fixation to make Cleverly some world class player and that is why he has not bought. If he had bought Modric as well this summer, I don't think you would be winning the league.

I support Crystal Palace, but I love watch a lot of football. Member of the Holmesdale forum, but that is more Palace centric only. So good to talk about top flight football elsewhere. Watch a lot of City, Dortmund, Chelsea, Bayern, Madrid and Arsenal, because I like the way they play. I am happy to see new blood win the league like Chelsea and City. Growing up in London not too fond of United or Arsenal.

 

[Deleted member 14625]

Yes it was a mistake, fair enough.

I already pointed out to you, the Galatico's did not have a team of world class players. They had world class players in certain positions and then a bunch of Pavon's. Teams were picked on names alone.

With the explosion of money in the CL in the last 12 or so years, 70% of the CL winners have had a team of world class players. Inter, Barcelona, United, Madrid, Bayern and the early Milan team were full of world class players. You can point to Porto, Chelsea and Liverpool, but they are the exceptions rather than the normal. Liverpool and Chelsea also had to completely give up on the league to do this. Whilst they both had a fantastic history in the competition, which other teams still feared. Going to Anfield is a tough place for European teams based on reputation alone. Both got exceptionally lucky as well.

2012-Chelsea worst team to win it and incredibly lucky, gave up league finished 5th
2011-Barcelona full of world class players
2010-Inter full of world class players
2009-Barcelona full of world class players
2008 Manchester United full of world class players
2007-Milan aging team around your level
2006-Barcelona full of world class players
2005-Liverpool
2004-Porto did well, underrated and better than given credit for
2003-Milan full of world class players
2002 Madrid full of world class players
2001-Bayern around your level

Notice a trend? In recent years to win the CL you need a team full of world class players. 7 years a team full of world class players has won it, 2 years a team on your level, once a team below your level and twice teams way below your level.

It's a cup competition and anything can happen, but to have sustained success in the CL a team full of world class players is needed.

It's like that domestically too. Most of the time the top teams contest the trophies. Every now and again you get the abnormal occurrences like Portsmouth winning the FA Cup against Cardiff but more often than not one or two top teams contest the finals.

These top teams are all usually flush with world class players. If ever they find themselves in a position where they're not (the fall of Blackburn, Arsenal recently) they wont win anything.

It's the same in Europe. The teams with the best players will win the trophies on the whole. If you've not got the best players you probably wont win anything, unless you're one of the anomalies that occur once or twice a decade.

Even then Porto were excellent in 2004 and, as you say, we're unknown and underrated over everything else...and Chelsea have been doing well in Europe for twenty years (won the ECWC in 1997 and reached the Quarters of the CL, taking a first leg lead to the Camp Nou, in 1997-98 and reaching semi's and finals ever since) the experiences they had came to a head last year. So you're talking of just Dortmund and Liverpool who weren't experienced top sides flush with world class players who've won the CL since it's inception.

 

[Jontyh68]

The main thing is to get through the league stage. Clearly if you're in our group you need a better team/squad than in any of the others, but we're there on merit as champions.
Once in the knock out stages weaker teams can employ nullifying tactics against stronger ones and hope to sneak it on the break as Inter and Chelsea did; or get lucky in injury time like United.
They can play like this in the league stage, of course, but it may not be much use if the stronger sides only need a draw.
It's certainly not the case that the strongest side on paper always wins it, like in any cup competition.

 

[Anonymous]

Well Liverpool and Chelsea were EXTREMELY lucky, but they also had great fighting spirit and a sense of belief. Plus they had a fear factor in the competition. The Milan team in 05 was an unbelievable team, literally every position had a world class player, hence them dicking on Liverpool and going 3-0. However, in a cup competition anything can happen.

Anyway it depends on what your targets are. For instance Moratti has spent so much delivering the league title and CL to Inter, he has cut back for a bit. This is fair enough and Inter have to accept the tough times coming up. It all depends on what the aims are for City, which determines what must be done.

Even winning the league every year depends on what your opponents are doing. Ferguson has a stubborn fixation to make Cleverly some world class player and that is why he has not bought. If he had bought Modric as well this summer, I don't think you would be winning the league.

I support Crystal Palace, but I love watch a lot of football. Member of the Holmesdale forum, but that is more Palace centric only. So good to talk about top flight football elsewhere. Watch a lot of City, Dortmund, Chelsea, Bayern, Madrid and Arsenal, because I like the way they play. I am happy to see new blood win the league like Chelsea and City. Growing up in London not too fond of United or Arsenal.

You've kind of made my point. Even having XI world class players doesn't guarantee you success in the big cup. In fact there's inevitably some luck involved along the way. So although I'm not disputing the idea that we don't have XI world class players in our best starting XI, I am disputing the idea that you need those XI world class players to win it.

Thanks for the honest answer btw ... and welcome to Bluemoon!

 

[supercrystal7]

Well Liverpool and Chelsea were EXTREMELY lucky, but they also had great fighting spirit and a sense of belief. Plus they had a fear factor in the competition. The Milan team in 05 was an unbelievable team, literally every position had a world class player, hence them dicking on Liverpool and going 3-0. However, in a cup competition anything can happen.

Anyway it depends on what your targets are. For instance Moratti has spent so much delivering the league title and CL to Inter, he has cut back for a bit. This is fair enough and Inter have to accept the tough times coming up. It all depends on what the aims are for City, which determines what must be done.

Even winning the league every year depends on what your opponents are doing. Ferguson has a stubborn fixation to make Cleverly some world class player and that is why he has not bought. If he had bought Modric as well this summer, I don't think you would be winning the league.

I support Crystal Palace, but I love watch a lot of football. Member of the Holmesdale forum, but that is more Palace centric only. So good to talk about top flight football elsewhere. Watch a lot of City, Dortmund, Chelsea, Bayern, Madrid and Arsenal, because I like the way they play. I am happy to see new blood win the league like Chelsea and City. Growing up in London not too fond of United or Arsenal.

You've kind of made my point. Even having XI world class players doesn't guarantee you success in the big cup. In fact there's inevitably some luck involved along the way. So although I'm not disputing the idea that we don't have XI world class players in our best starting XI, I am disputing the idea that you need those XI world class players to win it.

Thanks for the honest answer btw ... and welcome to Bluemoon!

Cheers mate. Let's hope both our teams do well this season.