Toni Kroos

domalino said:
Why did I have a feeling I'd wake up to more comments about this from you?

Just to finally settle this because of your apparent inability to read the heatmap. Here is the average positions map from the game

GPQU2lr.png


Which quite clearly shows number 18, Kroos, playing much further ahead of both Schweinsteiger (7) and Emre Can (14).

In fact he's almost as far forward as Ozil.


So to sum this up, we have:

1) The teamsheet submitted by Germany, showing Kroos as a 10.

2) The heatmap showing (to everyone except you) that Kroos was further forward.

3) The Average position map, showing that Kroos was further forward than the 2 central midfielders.


I'm not going to argue this any further because it's so bloody clear to see. Anyone who watched the game could see he was playing further forward than the other two.
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There is video evidence of this. Just watch it. The heat map disagrees with you, so does actual video evidence. But feel free to use static data influenced by pre kick off heuristics.

There is a video of every Kroos touch. You can ascertain from that video when he touches the ball where he is versus where Can is. It's a simple and factual analysis.

The disparity between the number of times Can was ahead of him is overwhelming. I see you ignored that. Typical.
 
blueparrot said:
All that may or may not be true, but Pep knows Kroos and knows exactly what he is getting defensively. If he isn't worried by it neither am I.
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I'm not either. Just amused at how the very same quality that is criticized in Yaya is blatantly ignored with Kroos. Unless it's the case that it's only all the Yaya lovers commenting.
 
Shaelumstash said:
I've seen plenty of Kroos and there is no escaping that he's not great defensively. He doesn't cover ground quickly, he's not agressive enough at winning it back, and yes, he can appear lazy when his team are out of possession.

However, the role I'd expect him to play for us is very similar to how Pirlo played the majority of his career. A deep lying playmaker who has two players in front of him pressing the ball. You could never accuse Pirlo of being Kante or Makele when defending, but he's one of the best midfielders of his generation because he's so good on the ball.

He plays in a specialist position. The best in the world currently in that role are Busquets, Alonso and Kroos. Busquets is the best defensively, but on the ball Kroos is leagues ahead of the other two.

If we played Kroos as one of two central midfielders in a 442 and expect him to tackle, dictate play and score 20 a season like Yaya did in 2014, he'd be a disaster. He's not got the engine, the pace, the power, the agression to play that role. Unfortunately neither has Yaya anymore.

But as a specialist in that Pivote role if he had Gundogan and Fernandinho in front of him pressing high up the pitch, I think his quality on the ball would be so good that his defensive limitations wouldn't be exposed too often. Sure, he'd get caught out every so often, but I think he'd make far more positive contributions than bad.

Guardiola has worked with him and knows his qualities, so on this occasion it's perfectly legitimate to say "In Pep we trust".
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I agree on that. And that wasn't my gripe. :)
 
Marvin said:
I like your midfield of Kroos, Gundogan and Fernandinho, but where's Silva and KDB? I look at City's squad and I try and put it into a 11, and I have trouble with KDB and Silva.
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Pep will play multiple formations, or no formations at all in fact. He just wants them to orchestrate as a team. I think De Bruyne will play both on the right and centrally this season, and there will be game time for Silva as well. I was just simply noting of the players that he compared, those three with pass accuracy's as high as they have would be an incredible midfield and would boss the league.
 
I keep hearing that Real Madrid are after Andre Gomes (Valencia/Portugal), they mentioned it on BBC last night too. He seems to be more like a Kroos replacement than Pogba would be to me so not sure the Kroos deal is massively dependant on the Pogba move.
Would have thought Pogba was more of a Isco/James type of player.
Would love to see Kroos dictating the play at the Etihad!
 
City_Sean said:
Best CM in world football, if we had a midfield of him, Gundogan and Fernandinho it'd be the best in Europe, by some distance.
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He isn't. He's not even the best CM I'm his team, Modric is.

You don't take off the best CM in the world in the CL final because his impact on the game was becoming less and less minute by minute.

Modric played all 120mins.

The best CM in the world doesn't have such little impact on a game like Kroos did against France the other night. As the game went on he got worse and worse.
 
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Daz_Blue said:
More chance of signing the Pope than Kroos now
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We could always pay his release clause :/

Or he could ask to leave...

But yeah, if Real are out on Pogba then our chances of getting Kroos seem vanishingly small. Perhaps focus shifted to Thiago?
 
Akiva said:
We could always pay his release clause :/

Or he could ask to leave...

But yeah, if Real are out on Pogba then our chances of getting Kroos seem vanishingly small. Perhaps focus shifted to Thiago?
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Bayern are selling another of their midfielders to southampton
 
razman said:
Kroos is one of the best CMs in the world... But agreed he isn't best CM om the Madrid team.. That doesn't mean we shouldn't try and get him
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Oh by no means does it mean that but we should just start saying things like that because we might get him. The giant Pogba thread was full of that guff last Summer and now there are posters saying he's shit.
 
KippaxCitizen said:
Oh by no means does it mean that but we should just start saying things like that because we might get him. The giant Pogba thread was full of that guff last Summer and now there are posters saying he's shit.
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Ya pogba is over rated and shit... Agreed!
 
117 M34 said:
Bayern are selling another of their midfielders to southampton
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Höjbjerg was loaned to Augsburg and Schalke the last two seasons. He did not make the cut even if Pep used him well in his first year at Bayern. Not really the skillset to fit in a ball possession team - and probably not good enough to be able to ever make it at Bayern. Similar story with Emre Can in Guardiola's first preseason.
 
KippaxCitizen said:
He isn't. He's not even the best CM I'm his team, Modric is.

You don't take off the best CM in the world in the CL final because his impact on the game was becoming less and less minute by minute.

Modric played all 120mins.

The best CM in the world doesn't have such little impact on a game like Kroos did against France the other night. As the game went on he got worse and worse.
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While I agree he is not the best CM in the world, your reasoning that he didn't impact a single game doesn't work. Even Messi sometimes fails to influence games.

That said, I agree Modric is the best CM at Madrid. But Kroos is pretty good too.
 
KippaxCitizen said:
He isn't. He's not even the best CM I'm his team, Modric is.

You don't take off the best CM in the world in the CL final because his impact on the game was becoming less and less minute by minute.

Modric played all 120mins.

The best CM in the world doesn't have such little impact on a game like Kroos did against France the other night. As the game went on he got worse and worse.
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Say what now?! He was excellent throughout. France parked bodies galore behind the ball and made it difficult that's all. Germany were the better team and Kroos was one of their best players I thought
 
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