Tony Blair on Nick Robinson's Show

[blueparrot]

It’s the breaking up of the UK which I cannot look past.

For me they’re similar to UKIP in nature and are a nationalist party. They may have centrist domestic policies that I’d agree with but their end game is fundamentally at odds with mine.

Fair enough but many people have voted SNP because of their domestic policies then voted no in the independence referendum, I know my wife and myself are 2 of them. So it is possible to seperate that one policy and judge them on their domestic manifesto.
That said if the UK were to turn to Boris Johnson , Davis, Mogg government and crash out of europe I would serioulsy consider voting yes.if there was a guarantee for rejoining the EU. IMO brexit and tory hardliners are the biggest current danger to th UK not the SNP.

 

[Ban-jani]

As South Park brilliantly put it, a 2 party system can serve you up a choice between a douche and a shit sandwich, or to rephrase it in Anglo-Irish, a choice between getting kicked in the balls or the teeth.

I certainly agree with that.

 

[blueparrot]

Blair etc worked within the party to change it, the 'Blairites' now are publicly attacking the party, big difference.

OK , but Blair could see a direction of travel and knew he had to win over the parliamenary party. I think the attacks now come because they see a party controlled by unnaccountable unelected members and can't see how they can win power back so in that sense yes you are probably right a new party is the best option but it will need a pretty charismatic leader and there may be one but I can't see one.

 

[Ban-jani]

Fair enough but many people have voted SNP because of their domestic policies then voted no in the independence referendum, I know my wife and myself are 2 of them. So it is possible to seperate that one policy and judge them on their domestic manifesto.
That said if the UK were to turn to Boris Johnson , Davis, Mogg government and crash out of europe I would serioulsy consider voting yes.if there was a guarantee for rejoining the EU. IMO brexit and tory hardliners are the biggest current danger to th UK not the SNP.

I don’t disagree with any of that.

It’s hard for someone living in England to get on board though I’m sure you will agree? Their policies only affect me on the basis of breaking up the nation in which I live and as someone who believes in the EU and nations working closer together, I see them as another nationalist party who, dare I say it, dislike the English.

I know they are pro-EU, as am I, but I’m more-so pro-UK and the thought of Scotland and England being separated fills me with sadness.

 

[blueparrot]

I don’t agree with any of that.

It’s hard for someone living in England to get on board though I’m sure you will agree? Their policies only affect me on the basis of breaking up the nation in which I live and as someone who believes in the EU and nations working closer together, I see them as another nationalist party who, dare I say it, dislike the English.

I know they are pro-EU, as am I, but I’m more-so pro-UK and the thought of Scotland and England being separated fills me with sadness.

Yes, obviously we are talking about a UK party so the SNP doesnt really come into it other than it's a model of a party breaking up the 2 party system. But its also an example of the time it can take for a party to develop a complete wide ranging manifesto and find politicians charismatic enough to win general support.

 

[Ban-jani]

Yes, obviously we are talking about a UK party so the SNP doesnt really come into it other than it's a model of a party breaking up the 2 party system. But its also an example of the time it can take for a party to develop a complete wide ranging manifesto and find politicians charismatic enough to win general support.

Sorry I’ve just realised my post doesn’t say “I don’t disagree with any of that” at the beginning.

I’ll change it now.

I did agree with your post, just a typo from me.

 

[robbieh]

What most seem to be missing on all these arguments is that we reside in an enormous pyramid scam where the top less than 1% just take what they want out of the system.

This fucks up the economy for everyone else, especially those at the bottom. It doesn't have to be like this given all the advances in technology.

As people across the globe notice that things are not going well for them individually, they are faced with a choice.

They can blame foreigners or poorer workshy people in their own countries. This is the approach of right wing parties such as the one in Sweden who have done well tonight

Or they can wake up smell the coffee and realize that regardless of our nationalities we are all being taken for a huge ride by the global cspatalist elite.

 

[blueparrot]

Sorry I’ve just realised my post doesn’t say “I don’t disagree with any of that” at the beginning.

I’ll change it now.

I did agree with your post, just a typo from me.

No worries, thought it was a sentence that didnt go with your post. I have just been pondering this new 3rd party thing. What occurs to me though is a new UK party to win power would need to win seats in all parts of the UK. There may well be a gap in the landscape of England, but it would be very difficult to find room for a new party in Scotland and Wales were a 3rd party already exists. A revitalised Liberal party seems to me the vest option for disillusioned Labour or Conservatives, not a new party.

 

[Ban-jani]

No worries, thought it was a sentence that didnt go with your post. I have just been pondering this new 3rd party thing. What occurs to me though is a new UK party to win power would need to win seats in all parts of the UK. There may well be a gap in the landscape of England, but it would be very difficult to find room for a new party in Scotland and Wales were a 3rd party already exists. A revitalised Liberal party seems to me the vest option for disillusioned Labour or Conservatives, not a new party.

I think that is just it, the gap is in England. For me if there was a vote tomorrow it would be Lib Dem but I’ve never particularly been inspired by them previously. They are currently the only party opposing Brexit and the only party resembling the centre, so will get my vote.

We need another option though. The Labour Party is full of far too many talented people stuck in the reserves, if you will, that could lead another centrist party.

With regards to Scotland, I genuinely worry it may go if Brexit is that much of a disaster. What is striking is how poorly Corbyn has done there, considering the whole point of the IndyRef was bringing Scotland further to the left from the Tories, it’s surprising someone on the left has bombed north of the border.

 

[Cityfan]

considering the whole point of the IndyRef was bringing Scotland further to the left from the Tories, it’s surprising someone on the left has bombed north of the border.

I don't think that was ever the 'point' of it , just a useful selling point when the Tories were dominant down south and not popular in Scotland.