UEFA FFP investigation - CAS decision to be announced Monday, 13th July 9.30am BST

[Centurions]

I expect @SWP's back was taking into account the ones who also think it’ll get reduced to 1 year ban.

Ahh, yes. I should have finished my morning coffee before posting, a common mistake I'm afraid.

 

[its grim up north]

My Dad often tells me that Allison had said we would terrify Europe.

He just didn't say when.

 

[SWP's back]

Don’t think it’s anything to do with that. I wouldn’t rate our chances as any better than 50:50 and personally I think we’ll get punished, and I went to my first City match in 1974

Was that because it was a Derby?

 

[SilverFox2]

All this FFP nonsense, G14 getting what they want, different rules for different clubs, referees favouring certain teams in reds (on var, pens, handballs offsides), the PL openly saying it’s better for the league when the scum and dippers win it, just goes to show the world is fucking unfair and corrupt. It goes on all over the place, and the elite at the top always prosper at the expense of the masses. To think that people talk about the UK and Europe as free and fair. It’s a fucking nonsense

You are right of course but why should they not feather their own nest by skewing rules to suit the top table expectations for themselves?
They pretend fairness of course but apparently the legal system allows their "club" to make self serving rules.
Our owner joined the "club" and its rules so expecting fair competition is a little naive.

I think the best we can expect is to use their own rules against them in an attempt to explode the myth of fairness.
Any legal wrongdoing via separate legal Court proceedings but even if we achieve a near 100 percent win at CAS we have to accept that we are unable to change the coop of greed the g14 have apparently built for themselves, so accept ie be accepted or destroy it legally.

My thoughts may change but just an opinion.

 

[Gordyola]

Now a thousand posts about the poll! Yes, we can all see it an interpret it

 

[BringBackSwales]

You are right of course but why should they not feather their own nest by skewing rules to suit the top table expectations for themselves?
They pretend fairness of course but apparently the legal system allows their "club" to make self serving rules.
Our owner joined the "club" and its rules so expecting fair competition is a little naive.

I think the best we can expect is to use their own rules against them in an attempt to explode the myth of fairness.
Any legal wrongdoing via separate legal Court proceedings but even if we achieve a near 100 percent win at CAS we have to accept that we are unable to change the coop of greed the g14 have apparently built for themselves, so accept ie be accepted or destroy it legally.

My thoughts may change but just an opinion.

Hoping for or even expecting fairness isn’t really naive is it? Not making things fair is fucking disgusting

 

[blue b4 the moon]

Given that none of us know what evidence either the club or UEFA have, that doesn’t really surprise me. Thought it’d be closer to 50/50 tbh.

I'd hope we win and piss all over them but without knowing what's really going on...and none of us do even though some shout out they do....I've gone for other.

I think ultimately some sort of deal will be cut partway through the hearing as one party hopefully UEFA will have an arse like a 50p piece at how it's going.

I don't buy into the smoking gun stuff, if we held these cards we could have caused chaos months/years ago.

 

[Kazzydeyna]

Surely the Chinese investors, and silver lake, would have had full access to our accounts before fronting their money up?

Surely if there were any funny accounting practises going on they would have been spotted and their investment postponed or cancelled?

If you were an international investor would YOU very publicly invest in an organisation that wasn't honest in its own accounts knowing you'd be dragged into it if the shit hit the fan?

I wouldn't.

 

[Dirty Harry]

I put "other", that other being, the ban etc will be overturned, but no way we get "exonerated", enter "legal loophole", "technicality", "bribes" etc etc etc ......

 

[Kazzydeyna]

I put "other", that other being, the ban etc will be overturned, but no way we get "exonerated", enter "legal loophole", "technicality", "bribes" etc etc etc ......

In the first instance getting the ban overturned is the most important thing. The How is less important initially.
Win this battle and we can and will win the war. Lose it and City as we've grown to know them are over.

 

[Xhavenjoe]

I put "other", that other being, the ban etc will be overturned, but no way we get "exonerated", enter "legal loophole", "technicality", "bribes" etc etc etc ......

Can CAS increase the ban
If they thought we were wasting their time.

 

[iwasthere1968]

Aren't they just following the club's lead?

Appeasement fits the clubs' strategy towards UEFA and the media over the last 10 years perfectly.

Haha interesting point of view , which I find hard to respond to immediately, I suppose it depends on whether you define your whole strategy as one of appeasement or a shorter term tactic.
I think the club have passed through the shorter term tactic.

 

[SilverFox2]

Hoping for or even expecting fairness isn’t really naive is it? Not making things fair is fucking disgusting

Probably my wrong choice of word there. I agree our owner is more worldly wise than any of them and that is why his business capability into their sector has been resented.

Boils down to fair competition and football for some reason being legally allowed to operate a "Barrier to Entry" which is a legally enforceable offence as a form of Cartel in the real world that has competition rules by protecting the use of investment phase cash by new entrants into a sector of business.
The fact remains that that our owners have had to war continuously with the g14 to protect a business model that has delivered. Perhaps our expectation would be that all would be forgiven and we would be given a gentlemanly handshake for upsetting their "club" arrangements.?

I feel the real reason is that their fear of our owners business acumen started the barrier so their fears have been totally realised.
We have played chess with them whilst they play draughts, so rather than accepting our victory they are claiming an illegal move by one of our pawns at the start.

 

[Dirty Harry]

Can CAS increase the ban
If they thought we were wasting their time.

I think they've already gone on record to say they have concerns about this case and how it's been conducted, and, that our grounds have merit, so even if they could, I find that the most unlikely of outcomes.

 

[dadnlad]

cheers @Ric for the poll but think swing-o-meter might have been better option as mood changes over the hour never mind day's

 

[HalfwayUpTheKippax]

I'd hope we win and piss all over them but without knowing what's really going on...and none of us do even though some shout out they do....I've gone for other.

I think ultimately some sort of deal will be cut partway through the hearing as one party hopefully UEFA will have an arse like a 50p piece at how it's going.

I don't buy into the smoking gun stuff, if we held these cards we could have caused chaos months/years ago.

Are you thinking of a statement by UEFA on day 2 saying that they have withdrawn City's ban on the basis that City have presented evidence at the CAS proving that they did not break FFP rules as all sponsorship payments have been demonstrated as having been paid in full by the sponsors. Acknowledgement that this evidence was presented by City to the CFCB IC but not considered by either the IC or AC, probably with emphasis that the CFCB is fully independent of UEFA. UEFA apologise to City and state that they will continue to treat City with impartiality, as they have always done (ie they will now treat City with impartiality including an end to corrupt reffing against us in the UCL( perhaps already started). A full investigation will be made into the CFCB... Complete victory would be a place on the high table, the real war then begins.

I am optimistic because of the total confidence that appears to come from the highest levels at City. It could be that they are trying to stay alive as long as possible for some chance of rescue from a disaster but they have shown how successful they are in the rarified air of the highest levels of business. They know what they are doing and I believe their confidence is rooted in their knowledge of their chance of success.

 

[blue b4 the moon]

Are you thinking of a statement by UEFA on day 2 saying that they have withdrawn City's ban on the basis that City have presented evidence at the CAS proving that they did not break FFP rules as all sponsorship payments have been demonstrated as having been paid in full by the sponsors. Acknowledgement that this evidence was presented by City to the CFCB IC but not considered by either the IC or AC, probably with emphasis that the CFCB is fully independent of UEFA. UEFA apologise to City and state that they will continue to treat City with impartiality, as they have always done (ie they will now treat City with impartiality including an end to corrupt reffing against us in the UCL( perhaps already started). A full investigation will be made into the CFCB... Complete victory would be a place on the high table, the real war then begins.

I am optimistic because of the total confidence that appears to come from the highest levels at City. It could be that they are trying to stay alive as long as possible for some chance of rescue from a disaster but they have shown how successful they are in the rarified air of the highest levels of business. They know what they are doing and I believe their confidence is rooted in their knowledge of their chance of success.

Yeah that's about it, couldn't be arsed typing that much in the sun. ;)

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

Are you thinking of a statement by UEFA on day 2 saying that they have withdrawn City's ban on the basis that City have presented evidence at the CAS proving that they did not break FFP rules as all sponsorship payments have been demonstrated as having been paid in full by the sponsors. Acknowledgement that this evidence was presented by City to the CFCB IC but not considered by either the IC or AC, probably with emphasis that the CFCB is fully independent of UEFA. UEFA apologise to City and state that they will continue to treat City with impartiality, as they have always done (ie they will now treat City with impartiality including an end to corrupt reffing against us in the UCL( perhaps already started). A full investigation will be made into the CFCB... Complete victory would be a place on the high table, the real war then begins.

I am optimistic because of the total confidence that appears to come from the highest levels at City. It could be that they are trying to stay alive as long as possible for some chance of rescue from a disaster but they have shown how successful they are in the rarified air of the highest levels of business. They know what they are doing and I believe their confidence is rooted in their knowledge of their chance of success.

I agree. I just can't get away from the bullishness of our public statements. The comments from Soriano would have been heavily legalled and lawyers are always cautious. As a club we would not have gone out on a limb unless we had a very strong position.
I also believe that the situtation has got worse for UEFA in recent months with the corruption charges brought against Al Khelaifi and the complete collapse of Leterme's reputation over the PSG decison. The people on CAS are not stupid. They can see the Qatari influence at the heart of UEFA. Even the initial CAS statement made reference to the "worrisome" (their word) elements of the investigation process.
It is interesting that leaks are still coming out of UEFA to Tariq Panja at the New York Times (see this week's story about the change in venue for the CL final)

 

[BluessinceHydeRoad]

Bulishness in the public domain is to be expected.

There have been conversations in private that go beyond that, essentially guarantees we will win out.

I'm glad you've reminded us of this because many of those who think that we'll face a ban of some length have forgotten such statements or don't seem to have believed them in the first place. I don't have any contacts at the club, I certainly don't have any at UEFA and my view of the question is based trying to fit what I come across together, rather like the pieces of a jigsaw, to form as near to a coherent narrative I can. I have not seen any of the evidence UEFA has presented, but I presume Khaldoon, the club hierarchy and our legal team have and they've also seen our own evidence. So when Khaldoon speaks of irrefutable proof that we have not breached FFP and Sorriano tells us (after vetting by our lawyers) that the allegations are simply not true, I believe them. I prefer to say I'm confident, but if others wish to say that bluemooners who also believe what the club has told them are bullish then I'll accept that. And, at the risk of appearing an ingratiating crawler, I'll say that I also believe what you have told us about confidence levels within the club and what PB has reported of what he's been told about UEFA's evidence. Keep up the good work!

 

[Holcombe bloo]

Anyone know if the red scums debt interest payments and share dividends count against them in terms of ffp?

With their debt increasing this could really cost them!

Also if Sanchez gets another loan to say for example inter, does his amortisation and wages count against the scum as well?