United thread 2012/13 (inc merged IPO thread)

[Pam]

Now we know what Raffa said in his team talk last Monday.

 

[Latics Fan SJK]

Easy draws? Among other soft draws in recent seasons the rags have got 3 non-league teams - Exeter, Crawley and Burton - the first two at home as well. They actually needed replays to get past Exeter and Burton but 2 years ago thrashed Crawley (surely the softest ever 5th round draw) 1-0. They came a cropper the season before though when in the 3rd round they got 3rd tier Leeds at home but lost 0-1.

Whilst it can be said that they often get the easier ride in the CL, mainly due to seeding system, Fergie has actually got a point in his little rant about how Chelsea's success in the last 6 years can be largely down to favourable draws.

Not including the Semi Finals or the Finals themselves (as Fergie said it was the earlier rounds where Chelsea have tended to benefit), Chelsea have played the following teams:

2007/08 - QPR (H), Wigan (A), Huddersfield (H), Barnsley (A)
2008/09 - Southend (H), Ipswich (H), Watford (A), Coventry (A)
2009/10 - Watford (H), Preston (A), Cardiff (H), Stoke (H)
2010/11 - Ipswich (H), Everton (H)
2011/12 - Portsmouth (H), QPR (A), Birmingham (A), Leicester (H)
2012/13 - Southampton (A), Brentford (A), Middlesbrough (A), Man United (H)

Out of 22 FA Cup draws, only 5 have been against Premier League opposition, of which 1 was against a "Top 4" side, which was Man United on Monday.
You have to agree, 17 out of 22 Fa Cup draws since the 07/08 season against teams outside the top flight is a remarkably fortunate run.

As for United:

2007/08 - Aston Villa (A), Tottenham (H), Arsenal (H), Portsmouth (H)
2008/09 - Southampton (A), Tottenham (H), Derby (A), Fulham (A)
2009/10 - Leeds (H)
2010/11 - Liverpool (H), Southampton (A), Crawley (H), Arsenal (H)
2011/12 - Man City (A), Liverpool (H)
2012/13 - West Ham (H), Fulham (H), Reading (H), Chelsea (A)

Out of 19 FA Cup draws, 14 of those have been against Premier League opposition, of which 8 of those have been against the likes of Tottenham x2, Arsenal x2, Liverpool x2, Man City & Chelsea.
You have to agree, 5 out of 19 Fa Cup draws since the 07/08 season against teams outside the top flight is a hardly an example of "luck of the draw".

Chelsea have largely benefitted from fortunate draws in recent seasons, without doubt.

well that's alright then, I mean when he gets a group containing Juve and Shakhtar then he can start complaining.

What's the CL got to do with it? He's just hinted at Chelsea being fortunate with FA Cup draws in recent times, that's all.

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

Whilst it can be said that they often get the easier ride in the CL, mainly due to seeding system, Fergie has actually got a point in his little rant about how Chelsea's success in the last 6 years can be largely down to favourable draws.

Not including the Semi Finals or the Finals themselves (as Fergie said it was the earlier rounds where Chelsea have tended to benefit), Chelsea have played the following teams:

2007/08 - QPR (H), Wigan (A), Huddersfield (H), Barnsley (A)
2008/09 - Southend (H), Ipswich (H), Watford (A), Coventry (A)
2009/10 - Watford (H), Preston (A), Cardiff (H), Stoke (H)
2010/11 - Ipswich (H), Everton (H)
2011/12 - Portsmouth (H), QPR (A), Birmingham (A), Leicester (H)
2012/13 - Southampton (A), Brentford (A), Middlesbrough (A), Man United (H)

Out of 22 FA Cup draws, only 5 have been against Premier League opposition, of which 1 was against a "Top 4" side, which was Man United on Monday.
You have to agree, 17 out of 22 Fa Cup draws since the 07/08 season against teams outside the top flight is a remarkably fortunate run.

As for United:

2007/08 - Aston Villa (A), Tottenham (H), Arsenal (H), Portsmouth (H)
2008/09 - Southampton (A), Tottenham (H), Derby (A), Fulham (A)
2009/10 - Leeds (H)
2010/11 - Liverpool (H), Southampton (A), Crawley (H), Arsenal (H)
2011/12 - Man City (A), Liverpool (H)
2012/13 - West Ham (H), Fulham (H), Reading (H), Chelsea (A)

Out of 19 FA Cup draws, 14 of those have been against Premier League opposition, of which 8 of those have been against the likes of Tottenham x2, Arsenal x2, Liverpool x2, Man City & Chelsea.
You have to agree, 5 out of 19 Fa Cup draws since the 07/08 season against teams outside the top flight is a hardly an example of "luck of the draw".

Chelsea have largely benefitted from fortunate draws in recent seasons, without doubt.

well that's alright then, I mean when he gets a group containing Juve and Shakhtar then he can start complaining.

What's the CL got to do with it? He's just hinted at Chelsea being fortunate with FA Cup draws in recent times, that's all.

Those in glass houses etc.

Difference is Chelsea make far more of their easy draws than United do in Europe.

 

[Latics Fan SJK]

well that's alright then, I mean when he gets a group containing Juve and Shakhtar then he can start complaining.

What's the CL got to do with it? He's just hinted at Chelsea being fortunate with FA Cup draws in recent times, that's all.

Those in glass houses etc.

Difference is Chelsea make far more of their easy draws than United do in Europe.

What a bizarre statement.

Regardless of some of the easy teams that United have been drawn with in the group stages in the past, it's a hell of a lot harder to beat Champions League opposition than it is to beat teams from lower than the Premier League!

2007/08 - Roma, Sporting, Dynamo Kiev, Lyon, Roma
(Before beating Barcelona and Chelsea to lift the CL)

2008/09 - Villarreal, Aalborg, Celtic, Inter Milan, Porto
(Before beating Arsenal but losing to Barcelona in the final)

2009/10 - CSKA Moscow, Wolfsburg, Besiktas, AC Milan, Bayern Munich

2010/11 - Valencia, Rangers, Bursaspor, Marseille, Chelsea
(Before beating Schalke but losing to Barcelona in the final)

2011/12 - Benfica, Basel, Otelul-Galati

2012/13 - Galatasaray, Cluj, Braga, Real Madrid

With the exception of probably Aalborg, Otelul-Galati and possibly Bursaspor, every single one of those teams, at the time United met them, would beat every team outside England's top flight.

You can't really compare Chelsea's success in the last 6 yrs of the FA Cup to United's relative lack of success in the most difficult cup competition in the world to win. Surely even you can understand that?

In fact, looking at the teams Chelsea have faced in the last 6yrs of the FA Cup and the teams United have faced in the CL in the same period, I would say United have faced far more difficult competition and, if it wasn't for the greatest club side to ever play the game preventing them, United may well have had 3 instead of 1 CL trophies in that 6yr period.

There's no doubt with the squads Fergie has had to work with at United over his long tenure there, that he could/should have won more than 2 CL titles. However, considering this debate is over his little rant at Chelsea's recent (last 6 yrs) success in the FA Cup, I'd say his side's respective performance in the last 6yrs of the CL, winning 1 title and reaching the final in 2 others, is not a bad return and, in actual fact, can only be bettered by none other than Barcelona.

 

[City Raider]

What's the CL got to do with it? He's just hinted at Chelsea being fortunate with FA Cup draws in recent times, that's all.

Those in glass houses etc.

Difference is Chelsea make far more of their easy draws than United do in Europe.

What a bizarre statement.

Regardless of some of the easy teams that United have been drawn with in the group stages in the past, it's a hell of a lot harder to beat Champions League opposition than it is to beat teams from lower than the Premier League!

2007/08 - Roma, Sporting, Dynamo Kiev, Lyon, Roma
(Before beating Barcelona and Chelsea to lift the CL)

2008/09 - Villarreal, Aalborg, Celtic, Inter Milan, Porto
(Before beating Arsenal but losing to Barcelona in the final)

2009/10 - CSKA Moscow, Wolfsburg, Besiktas, AC Milan, Bayern Munich

2010/11 - Valencia, Rangers, Bursaspor, Marseille, Chelsea
(Before beating Schalke but losing to Barcelona in the final)

2011/12 - Benfica, Basel, Otelul-Galati

2012/13 - Galatasaray, Cluj, Braga, Real Madrid

With the exception of probably Aalborg, Otelul-Galati and possibly Bursaspor, every single one of those teams, at the time United met them, would beat every team outside England's top flight.

You can't really compare Chelsea's success in the last 6 yrs of the FA Cup to United's relative lack of success in the most difficult cup competition in the world to win. Surely even you can understand that?

In fact, looking at the teams Chelsea have faced in the last 6yrs of the FA Cup and the teams United have faced in the CL in the same period, I would say United have faced far more difficult competition and, if it wasn't for the greatest club side to ever play the game preventing them, United may well have had 3 instead of 1 CL trophies in that 6yr period.

There's no doubt with the squads Fergie has had to work with at United over his long tenure there, that he could/should have won more than 2 CL titles. However, considering this debate is over his little rant at Chelsea's recent (last 6 yrs) success in the FA Cup, I'd say his side's respective performance in the last 6yrs of the CL, winning 1 title and reaching the final in 2 others, is not a bad return and, in actual fact, can only be bettered by none other than Barcelona.

Blatant breach of the code of conduct - we are only allowed to use research to either:

a) discredit the scum
b) make us look good

This is neither, a ban is probably forthcoming.

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

What's the CL got to do with it? He's just hinted at Chelsea being fortunate with FA Cup draws in recent times, that's all.

Those in glass houses etc.

Difference is Chelsea make far more of their easy draws than United do in Europe.

What a bizarre statement.

Regardless of some of the easy teams that United have been drawn with in the group stages in the past, it's a hell of a lot harder to beat Champions League opposition than it is to beat teams from lower than the Premier League!

2007/08 - Roma, Sporting, Dynamo Kiev, Lyon, Roma
(Before beating Barcelona and Chelsea to lift the CL)

2008/09 - Villarreal, Aalborg, Celtic, Inter Milan, Porto
(Before beating Arsenal but losing to Barcelona in the final)

2009/10 - CSKA Moscow, Wolfsburg, Besiktas, AC Milan, Bayern Munich

2010/11 - Valencia, Rangers, Bursaspor, Marseille, Chelsea
(Before beating Schalke but losing to Barcelona in the final)

2011/12 - Benfica, Basel, Otelul-Galati

2012/13 - Galatasaray, Cluj, Braga, Real Madrid

With the exception of probably Aalborg, Otelul-Galati and possibly Bursaspor, every single one of those teams, at the time United met them, would beat every team outside England's top flight.

You can't really compare Chelsea's success in the last 6 yrs of the FA Cup to United's relative lack of success in the most difficult cup competition in the world to win. Surely even you can understand that?

In fact, looking at the teams Chelsea have faced in the last 6yrs of the FA Cup and the teams United have faced in the CL in the same period, I would say United have faced far more difficult competition and, if it wasn't for the greatest club side to ever play the game preventing them, United may well have had 3 instead of 1 CL trophies in that 6yr period.

There's no doubt with the squads Fergie has had to work with at United over his long tenure there, that he could/should have won more than 2 CL titles. However, considering this debate is over his little rant at Chelsea's recent (last 6 yrs) success in the FA Cup, I'd say his side's respective performance in the last 6yrs of the CL, winning 1 title and reaching the final in 2 others, is not a bad return and, in actual fact, can only be bettered by none other than Barcelona.

Fergie underachieves in cup competitions, simple as.

Those groups without fail are ones United should get out of every time, he failed last season, the biggest embarrassment in recent CL history.

He shouldn't have a go at Chelsea who went and beat his title winning side(let's be fair) comfortably when he gets easy draws in Europe with games he should win all the time. He gets weaker opposition in the cup and alright they may not be as easy as Chelsea but they win their games, he doesn't. His team continually make life difficult against easy opposition such as Exeter and Leeds etc.

Let's not even go into Carling Cup where again Chelsea beat them and they lost to Palace last season.

Fact is Fergie is an underachiever in cups and putting his own failings on Chelsea getting an easy draw, sorry Fergie you lot have had plenty of easy draws in all competitions and balls'd it up, and even when you get to semi's and have to win the big games you don't, as proved by us, Everton, Madrid, Barca etc. etc.

Fergie's the best Premier League manager, his record in everything else is poor in comparison.

 

[Blootoof]

Easy draws? Among other soft draws in recent seasons the rags have got 3 non-league teams - Exeter, Crawley and Burton - the first two at home as well. They actually needed replays to get past Exeter and Burton but 2 years ago thrashed Crawley (surely the softest ever 5th round draw) 1-0. They came a cropper the season before though when in the 3rd round they got 3rd tier Leeds at home but lost 0-1.

Whilst it can be said that they often get the easier ride in the CL, mainly due to seeding system, Fergie has actually got a point in his little rant about how Chelsea's success in the last 6 years can be largely down to favourable draws.

Not including the Semi Finals or the Finals themselves (as Fergie said it was the earlier rounds where Chelsea have tended to benefit), Chelsea have played the following teams:

2007/08 - QPR (H), Wigan (A), Huddersfield (H), Barnsley (A)
2008/09 - Southend (H), Ipswich (H), Watford (A), Coventry (A)
2009/10 - Watford (H), Preston (A), Cardiff (H), Stoke (H)
2010/11 - Ipswich (H), Everton (H)
2011/12 - Portsmouth (H), QPR (A), Birmingham (A), Leicester (H)
2012/13 - Southampton (A), Brentford (A), Middlesbrough (A), Man United (H)

Out of 22 FA Cup draws, only 5 have been against Premier League opposition, of which 1 was against a "Top 4" side, which was Man United on Monday.
You have to agree, 17 out of 22 Fa Cup draws since the 07/08 season against teams outside the top flight is a remarkably fortunate run.

As for United:

2007/08 - Aston Villa (A), Tottenham (H), Arsenal (H), Portsmouth (H)
2008/09 - Southampton (A), Tottenham (H), Derby (A), Fulham (A)
2009/10 - Leeds (H)
2010/11 - Liverpool (H), Southampton (A), Crawley (H), Arsenal (H)
2011/12 - Man City (A), Liverpool (H)
2012/13 - West Ham (H), Fulham (H), Reading (H), Chelsea (A)

Out of 19 FA Cup draws, 14 of those have been against Premier League opposition, of which 8 of those have been against the likes of Tottenham x2, Arsenal x2, Liverpool x2, Man City & Chelsea.
You have to agree, 5 out of 19 Fa Cup draws since the 07/08 season against teams outside the top flight is a hardly an example of "luck of the draw".

Chelsea have largely benefitted from fortunate draws in recent seasons, without doubt.

Hold on! I thought you didn't believe in conspiracies? And before you say "Who mentioned conspiracies"? I've seen you jump down peoples throats for less....Hmmmmm!!

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

Easy draws? Among other soft draws in recent seasons the rags have got 3 non-league teams - Exeter, Crawley and Burton - the first two at home as well. They actually needed replays to get past Exeter and Burton but 2 years ago thrashed Crawley (surely the softest ever 5th round draw) 1-0. They came a cropper the season before though when in the 3rd round they got 3rd tier Leeds at home but lost 0-1.

Whilst it can be said that they often get the easier ride in the CL, mainly due to seeding system, Fergie has actually got a point in his little rant about how Chelsea's success in the last 6 years can be largely down to favourable draws.

Not including the Semi Finals or the Finals themselves (as Fergie said it was the earlier rounds where Chelsea have tended to benefit), Chelsea have played the following teams:

2007/08 - QPR (H), Wigan (A), Huddersfield (H), Barnsley (A)
2008/09 - Southend (H), Ipswich (H), Watford (A), Coventry (A)
2009/10 - Watford (H), Preston (A), Cardiff (H), Stoke (H)
2010/11 - Ipswich (H), Everton (H)
2011/12 - Portsmouth (H), QPR (A), Birmingham (A), Leicester (H)
2012/13 - Southampton (A), Brentford (A), Middlesbrough (A), Man United (H)

Out of 22 FA Cup draws, only 5 have been against Premier League opposition, of which 1 was against a "Top 4" side, which was Man United on Monday.
You have to agree, 17 out of 22 Fa Cup draws since the 07/08 season against teams outside the top flight is a remarkably fortunate run.

As for United:

2007/08 - Aston Villa (A), Tottenham (H), Arsenal (H), Portsmouth (H)
2008/09 - Southampton (A), Tottenham (H), Derby (A), Fulham (A)
2009/10 - Leeds (H)
2010/11 - Liverpool (H), Southampton (A), Crawley (H), Arsenal (H)
2011/12 - Man City (A), Liverpool (H)
2012/13 - West Ham (H), Fulham (H), Reading (H), Chelsea (A)

Out of 19 FA Cup draws, 14 of those have been against Premier League opposition, of which 8 of those have been against the likes of Tottenham x2, Arsenal x2, Liverpool x2, Man City & Chelsea.
You have to agree, 5 out of 19 Fa Cup draws since the 07/08 season against teams outside the top flight is a hardly an example of "luck of the draw".

Chelsea have largely benefitted from fortunate draws in recent seasons, without doubt.

Hold on! I thought you didn't believe in conspiracies? And before you say "Who mentioned conspiracies"? I've seen you jump down peoples throats for less....Hmmmmm!!

it's alright when Fergie moans despite the fact he gets a difficult draw once in a blue moon.

 

[Blootoof]

I've never heard of half the teams they get in the champions league. I swear they are clubs made up from Sky employees, with a backdoor p£ss, just so they can get to play the club they spend their lives arse lickin. They all must pick the daftest club name they can think off and pull it from a hat.

 

[laserblue]

I've never heard of half the teams they get in the champions league. I swear they are clubs made up from Sky employees, with a backdoor p£ss, just so they can get to play the club they spend their lives arse lickin. They all must pick the daftest club name they can think off and pull it from a hat.

Don't talk crap you daft cluj.