US Presidential Election, Nov 5th 2024

[robbieh]

The democrats might want to rethink their strategy. Whilst Republicans ridiculously call them communist, Marxist etc, the reality is they represent middle class professionals and as such spend a lot of time on issues that said class are interested in. Abortion, civil rights, all of which are worthy things.

However vast swathes of poorer people are obviously voting for the borderline fascist.

So as they're called Marxists anyway why don't the Democrats actual move to the left and start attracting people who are currently voting against their own economic self interest.

 

[KS55]

It bullshit, China is in a far, far better position than the west tells you.

Not even China shies away from their weakness. Xi held an economic summit recently to address it. The first fruit of that is increased gov spending, as they look like missing their 5% growth target this year.
What evidence have you got for your assertion?

 

[BTH]

Labour seem pretty good at that.

Guessing you've been in a coma for 14 years. Or a prison cell.

 

[Keeper!]

Not even China shies away from their weakness. Xi held an economic summit recently to address it. The first fruit of that is increased gov spending, as they look like missing their 5% growth target this year.
What evidence have you got for your assertion?

I live in that part of the world, the economy has slowed down but the infrastructure put in place is incredible.

Just look at the car industry, the cars they are putting out are simply mind blowing compared to even a couple of years ago, and the quality of them is improving enormously.

Don't dismiss the Chinese.

 

[moomba]

So you are a supporter of using cheap foreign labour to do our dirty jobs? Yep, lets exploit the desperate.
I've found people will do any job if it pays well or their working conditions are good. Paying a unlivable wage and treating people like shit tends to put people off.
Most foreign workers i've met say they either plan on getting a better job, or saving as much as possible and then go home with the money. Cheap foreign labour is only a short term fix. And it lowers people living standards.
We should be increasing base living standards, not reducing them. Big business loves cheap foreign labour. That should tell you something.

Selective immigration is a positive to a country. Uncontrolled immigration is not. Countries with selective immigration have much better and fairer work markets.

My company uses a high percentage of foreign labour, and if we didnt there wouldn't be a company.

We pay above minimum wage, there are plenty of opportunities for progression, it's tough work and we couldn't get enough Brits to fill all the jobs if we tried.

People have an opinion of foreign labour that doesn't match up with reality.

 

[supercity88]

I don’t think some here understand the meaning of this.

If a convicted felon, serial liar, enemy-cozier, possible pedophile, nearing dementia, fascist-rhetoric spewing, insurrection-encouraging, near if not actual fascist racist can win the POPULAR vote in what is a factually reasonable economy . . . what in the world is the hope for any election in the future?

It’s not just Trump. It’s what it says about the electorate here. Harris was right when she said “We are never going back” . . . we are never going back to a rational, reasoned electorate with a moral center.

Ever.

Things are very polarised right now, but one election doesn't form a marker for future ones. Circumstances dictate what happens in elections. We had years of decline under the Tories who partied their way through a pandemic and lied about it. They were always going to take a battering in the last election. But the slate is then wiped clean and it's on Labour to justify their win. If they do then they might win the next one, if they don't then the Tories are back in the fight.

Similarly in the US, the economic situation was the driving force behind this win. But in 4 years there either he's delivered growth and therefore more people might actually be happy with things so it's less polarised, or things are completely fucked and so the Republicans are out on their arse.

There were lots of rational people in this country that could see the bullshit behind Brexit. And then there were those that couldn't and voted for it. It was, and still is a car crash. But plenty of those would vote differently now and not only that, went from supporting a movement from the right of the conservatives to voting for a left of centre MP in the general election. I believe the swing states will still see that shift in balance.

It's bonkers people have voted for Trump. But people will always look past the clear and obvious if someone is saying the right things and they want change. Again, not as extreme here, but Boris was always a bumbling idiot it's just some people found it endearing and liked his charisma before they realised it wasn't an act and he was just a fucking moron.

 

[The blue phantom]

The democrats might want to rethink their strategy. Whilst Republicans ridiculously call them communist, Marxist etc, the reality is they represent middle class professionals and as such spend a lot of time on issues that said class are interested in. Abortion, civil rights, all of which are worthy things.

However vast swathes of poorer people are obviously voting for the borderline fascist.

So as they're called Marxists anyway why don't the Democrats actual move to the left and start attracting people who are currently voting against their own economic self interest.

They need to do something as this **** and his Family will take some shifting.

 

[BTH]

Luckily the institutions and the constitution are strong enough to deal with it. Apparently.

They weren't strong enough to put him behind bars.

 

[Keeper!]

Then those jobs need to pay more. The problem isn't getting people to do the jobs, it's other people's perception how much a job should pay. People have been programmed to think unskilled jobs shouldn't pay as much as skilled jobs.

The change is already happening. Jobs that involve heavy labour are attracting higher wages. Brickies now earn more than the site managers for example. Labourers now want a minimum of £180 a day, many are on way higher.
Look at bin men. Was the lowest paid job. They have to pay bigger wages to get/retain the staff.

Carers get paid minimum wage. It can be one of the hardest jobs out there. So why it is paid so low?
Because people think it should be paid low because anybody can do it. Nobody thinks, "hey it's bloody hard work and mentally tiring so should pay well".
If the pay rises, more people will be interested in doing it. Getting somebody desperate from abroad, doesn't fix the problem. It just continues it.

100% agree, the gap between rich and poor has what has caused all these problems and the blue collars mans issues.

Trump and his like are opportunists, they have seen that and make out they are blue-collar mans saviour, when in reality they don't give a **** about them.

 

[hilts]

What you’ve said there makes me fully understand why he got in the first time around. However, given the shit he pulled during his first term in office, I’d have thought there was next to no chance of Americans voting him in again, regardless of how sick to death they are of those standard bullshitting politicians. Give me one of those over a non-standard bullshitting politician who also happens to be a racist, sexist, narcissistic, gaslighting, bullying sex case, and is a traitor to his country and a convicted felon to boot!

He is an awful human being, the truth is he has shit loads of company.