US Presidential Election, Nov 5th 2024

[Kamaro011]

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For all the 'BuT GeNoCiDe' folks out there.

Biden administration is not better either, they are the one that makes Gaza looks like hell hole right now. Doesn't matter jack shit both party will support Israel no matter what.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Haha, perfect. History does indeed repeat itself!

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Another point I hope people make note off - don’t rely on and get all giddy about polls, they were all completely well off the mark and have shown up alot of people.
The betting market was a far better reflection.
Polls have a long history of being very wrong.

I still don't understand how they were so wide of the mark.

 

[BlueHammer85]

I still don't understand how they were so wide of the mark.

No idea, presume alot of it is just guesswork, they got it wrong for the 2016 vote, Brexit and many others.
Just hope some can avoid bombarding us with polls in future. They’re a load of shite.

 

[inbetween]

I think he's arguing that the political establishment consider the economical benefits outweigh the problems, despite what either side say in public. Hence why you never really see a reduction in immigration. If the UK cracks down on illegal immigration they will absolutely have to make visa claims and legal process way cheaper because it's only really the upper levels of the working and middle classes that can afford it now.

Illegal migration into the UK is actually a bit different because most of 'illegal' migration into the UK actually ends up being legal because the people who do come on the boats for example are coming to claim asylum. There is an argument for safe routes but that would be problematic and no such thing exists anywhere in the world, not even in Europe where just like the Channel hundreds have drowned in the Meditteranean.

In the US it's very different, the people coming over the Mexican border are not claiming asylum, they're entering to live and work in the US illegally. Illegal immigration is what Trump intends to target and legal migration will broadly remain the same albeit he'll probably stop the green card lottery and maybe tighten the rules on family visas.

In the context of racism or fascism and Trump, this type of border control and immigration policy can't possibly be racist or fascist and I don't even see why it is controversial. A second point is if the US actually was a racist/fascist place then why on earth would anybody of those races want to emigrate there?

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

No idea, presume alot of it is just guesswork, they got it wrong for the 2016 vote, Brexit and many others.
Just hope some can avoid bombarding us with polls in future. They’re a load of shite.

I can understand with Brexit or even the previous US election where it was pretty neck and neck, but they were so far out it's like no effort was made.

 

[bugsyblue]

Illegal migration into the UK is actually a bit different because most of 'illegal' migration into the UK actually ends up being legal because the people who do come on the boats for example are coming to claim asylum. There is an argument for safe routes but that would be problematic and no such thing exists anywhere in the world, not even in Europe where just like the Channel hundreds have drowned in the Meditteranean.

In the US it's very different, the people coming over the Mexican border are not claiming asylum, they're entering to live and work in the US illegally. Illegal immigration is what Trump intends to target and legal migration will broadly remain the same albeit he'll probably stop the green card lottery and maybe tighten the rules on family visas.

In the context of racism or fascism and Trump, this type of border control and immigration policy can't possibly be racist or fascist and I don't even see why it is controversial. A second point is if the US actually was a racist/fascist place then why on earth would anybody of those races want to emigrate there?

Well I agree with you that uncontrolled borders is crazy and undocumented migrants is mad as it simply allows exploitation of those poor folk as well as harder to track, arrest when crimes have been committed, and of course tax said individuals. I agree that's not a racist policy.

But people in Mexico or Venezuela will accept racism over starvation, poverty or violence. It's the lesser of evils.

 

[BlueHammer85]

I can understand with Brexit or even the previous US election where it was pretty neck and neck, but they were so far out it's like no effort was made.

The average Trump voter is less likely to be engaged politically and not spend time talking and filling out poll questions etc is one theory.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

This is just a silly argument. You're arguing for the economic benefits of turning a blind eye to an illegal and suppressed demographic who actually has no rights.

This is like arguing to turn a blind eye to illegal child/underage workers because it's economically beneficial.

The correct answer is that people should immigrate legally and we should measure the economic benefits of that.

Or turning a blind eye to electing a self-confessed pussy grabbing adjudicated rapist and convicted felon?

The 'boogieman' argument on undocumented migrants pails into insignificance compared to the guy who has just been elected POTUS.

 

[Dax777]

Rogan's been pretty open about his disillusionment with the Democratic Party. But that's like a number of people! Musk used to be a democrat. Plus millions of Americans by the look of the latest vote count.

Whilst I would have voted for Harris (if I was a US citizen) I actually don't think criticising people for turning and voting for the other party is healthy nor productive. The question you want to be asking is why? Politics should never be treated like a football team IMO, where you nail your support to the team and live and die by that decision, enjoying the highs and lows. And us city fans can relate to that more than anyone! But in politics I'd argue it's actually important at times to switch as policies and needs and the environment all fluctuate.

The bitter pill to swallow is that people have switched to a party led by a pretty abhorrent individual. I get that. But we still need to ask and figure out why otherwise we'll just remain polarised and angry.

Oy very!!! My God! I never thought I'd see it. You Sir or Madam are more unique than you realize.


My hat.... permanently doffed!