VAR Discussion Thread | 2024/25

No straws being clutched, I’m happy Liverpool didn’t get away with a offside goal that’s all.
Nothing wrong with that, but Liverpool may not have gotten away with that offside had it not been for the existence of VAR. As you well know, VAR has caused linos to keep the flag down on anything close so VAR can check, leading to these maddening situations in which they keep the flag down and let play go on then check after, but only if something major happens like a goal.

The whole linos keeping their flags down nonsense then needing VAR to come to the rescue if something happens, then pretending like an error has been corrected is entirely contrived. VAR would have never needed to come to the rescue on offsides if linos were allowed to do their jobs the normal way, i.e. make the correct call on the pitch.

In pre-VAR days, without linos being trained to keep the flag down on anything close, chances are (a very high probability) that a pre-VAR lino would have gotten the call correct on the pitch, and if he didn't, that it would have been so close (toenail, armpit or something) that no one would ever have cared, and most fans I know are far more accepting of a goal standing in a borderline situation then seeing a goal chalked off for controversial reasons, which is all VAR is.
 
Nothing wrong with that, but Liverpool may not have gotten away with that offside had it not been for the existence of VAR. As you well know, VAR has caused linos to keep the flag down on anything close so VAR can check, leading to these maddening situations in which they keep the flag down and let play go on then check after, but only if something major happens like a goal.

The whole linos keeping their flags down nonsense then needing VAR to come to the rescue if something happens, then pretending like an error has been corrected is entirely contrived. VAR would have never needed to come to the rescue on offsides if linos were allowed to do their jobs the normal way, i.e. make the correct call on the pitch.

In pre-VAR days, without linos being trained to keep the flag down on anything close, chances are (a very high probability) that a pre-VAR lino would have gotten the call correct on the pitch, and if he didn't, that it would have been so close (toenail, armpit or something) that no one would ever have cared, and most fans I know are far more accepting of a goal standing in a borderline situation then seeing a goal chalked off for controversial reasons, which is all VAR is.
Amen
 
So var has improved nothing. they still get abuse and we still get analysis every week

one controversial VAR incident is amplified to the max nowadays, aided by social media and forums of course.

before VAR vast majority of games had so many controversial incidents, left to a ref to make a blind guess and constant outcries from the fans and panelists - lets not forget that's why VAR was bought in the first place.

I've never believed and never stated VAR will get everything right, i believe (and it is a fact) that it reduces the amount of injustice and wrong decisions.

Also, VAR will always look at way to improve, trial new methods to speed up accuracy. we never had that luxery with just the officials.
 
one controversial VAR incident is amplified to the max nowadays, aided by social media and forums of course.

before VAR vast majority of games had so many controversial incidents, left to a ref to make a blind guess and constant outcries from the fans and panelists - lets not forget that's why VAR was bought in the first place.
I doubt that.
I've never believed and never stated VAR will get everything right, i believe (and it is a fact) that it reduces the amount of injustice and wrong decisions.

Also, VAR will always look at way to improve, trial new methods to speed up accuracy. we never had that luxery with just the officials.
The problem is once you decide to use tech to get things right then there is an appetite for it to get everything right.
 
one controversial VAR incident is amplified to the max nowadays, aided by social media and forums of course.

before VAR vast majority of games had so many controversial incidents, left to a ref to make a blind guess and constant outcries from the fans and panelists - lets not forget that's why VAR was bought in the first place.
Incidents were not amplified to the max like they are nowadays which is due to VAR. Ref's making decisions on the pitch before VAR was merely "a blind guess"? There was nothing blind about it, it was all quite visible to the ref. "Constant outcries"? Give me a break, what we have now is constant outcries due to VAR reviews driving people up a wall!!

What you're referring to is post-match banter in pubs about what everyone remembered happened, which was recalled on fan's own often in jest and fun, from their own actual memory of what happened on the pitch not from 5 minutes delays to review decisions made that it would be impossible for anyone to forget, which causes an immense amount of disturbance and controversy to the whole match. Before VAR you had to actually remember what happened to describe how your club had been wronged, now we're merely spoon fed it by which VAR the VARs in the Ivory Tower decide to stop the match and obsess about, with little standards or consistency to any of it. And even when matches are somewhat flowing nowadays, you're always on edge as a fan wondering when VAR will rear its ugly head.

No one's forgetting why VAR was brought in the first place. In fact everyone has their own theory as to why VAR was brought in. Social media, forums??? Really, that's how VAR was brought in? Or was it the sports media pundits always carrying on about an injustice on the pitch. Which on its own would be perfectly fine only they created excessive outrage, often times claiming injustice for things that weren't and getting everyone all riled up. Which again, on its own wouldn't be a problem, but if someone heard that and thought it was a bright idea to go on this agenda to rid football of injustice, which regardless of what you might say was what those behind it at FIFA said VAR was brought in to do. And we heard catch phrases like clear and obvious, it was brought in to deal with those. But how many damn non- clear and obvious decisions get reviewed? It has played out in a different way than it was brought in for, on many levels, and far more controversial and annoying than anyone who promoted it in its early stages could have ever dreamed, or nightmared. But of course they're so flipping invested in its success it's essentially been too big to fail even though it clearly has, and it's gotten plenty of time to iron out the problems which was another excuse for why we should give it time. VAR has fundamentally eroded the very basic elements of how football works, and it's been a complete and utter failure.

VAR needs to be Hammered Out of Football along with Forward Kickoffs returning, only then will Football be back in order. Make no mistake about it, football is in Severe Disorder in this current VAR-induced state. It has a strange hold on the sport and the oxygen and spirit is being sucked out of football one VAR decision at a time.
 
Wasn't tight at all with the naked eye and at first sight. Was amazed the flag didn't go straight up.
Still doubt the angle and timing of the VAR pic.
Not only didn’t the flag not go up but the linesman actually pointed his flag out and towards the ground in a “he’s onside “ gesture. He only raised his flag after the VAR decision which was bizarre.
 
Not only didn’t the flag not go up but the linesman actually pointed his flag out and towards the ground in a “he’s onside “ gesture. He only raised his flag after the VAR decision which was bizarre.
Right and the lino is doing it that way as a direct result of the new complications added to offsides caused by VAR. Linos are now literally afraid of calling an offsides on the pitch because then VAR can't work and they'll be chastised by the VAR police if they do. So it's caused them to create all these situations of play continuing when it shouldn't only to then have VAR check to see if it needs to get involved depending on what happens next which is madness. And think about this too, which I don't think anyone talks about, ask yourself how many times VAR has changed the course of history in ways that we can't even begin to quantify due to the the lino keeping the flag down out of being unsure and causing play to continue when pre-VAR he would have had the confidence and instinct to correctly put the flag up. And as play continues on in this VAR bizarro world of officiating, and as a result lets say a goal isn't scored and the ball is being kicked around, well then often VAR wouldn't feel the need to get involved because nothing major happened (i.e. no goal, no penalty, etc) after the play was allowed to continue. Well then the rest of the match is affected by play continuing due to allowing a VAR check if need be, but now we're into a fraudulent phase of the game that likely wouldn't have occurred before VAR existing. In the past there would have been a completely different scenario that now no longer exists, you know the player being whistled for offsides, and it going quickly to a free kick with a possession change.

That's what I'm trying to get through to Hammer about, that VAR has caused this whole offsides situation to become fundamentally broken and immensely more aggravating than before. Obsessing over fine margins that never used to matter to fans, fan only got riled up about the "clear and obvious" ones, you know the ones that VAR was supposedly brought in for.
 
Right and the lino is doing it that way as a direct result of the new complications added to offsides caused by VAR. Linos are now literally afraid of calling an offsides on the pitch because then VAR can't work and they'll be chastised by the VAR police if they do.

No, that's rubbish, the lino didn't think it was offside so didn't flag. pre VAR that would have been given as a goal.

It was proved the other weekend when VAR was not in use and Maguire scored a last min offside goal. It happned week in without prior VAR.
 
No, that's rubbish, the lino didn't think it was offside so didn't flag. pre VAR that would have been given as a goal.

It was proved the other weekend when VAR was not in use and Maguire scored a last min offside goal. It happned week in without prior VAR.
That's a vast assumption.. Just because a lino in a VAR world keeps the flag down doesn't mean a lino pre-VAR would have done the same. That's the false equivalency you're relying on.

It wasn't proven the other weekend because again, as we've pointed out, since VAR has been introduced, over the last 5-7 years, it has been so ingrained in linos to keep the flag down that even when they find themselves in a rare VAR-less match, that "keep the flag down" mantra is difficult to detach from especially when it's only a rare VAR-less match after tens or hundreds of VAR matches in a row. They don't just go back from being a VAR lino to being a normal lino again in a heartbeat. They would have to go through a VAR decontamination period to remember what being a pre-VAR lino is like before you can start to feel confident in putting the flag up again. This is just human nature, linos as well as referees have been re-programmed due to VAR and they clearly and abundantly do not officiate the sport in the same way as they did before. So therefore we cannot assume that today's VAR-induced linos would make the same decisions as pre-VAR linos would have. Today's VAR-induced linos keep the flag down on anything remotely close, whereas in the past many of those (maybe 50%) they would put the flag up, creating a completely different sequence of events than anything that the VAR way of doing it does.
 
That's a vast assumption.. Just because a lino in a VAR world keeps the flag down doesn't mean a lino pre-VAR would have done the same. That's the false equivalency you're relying on.

It wasn't proven the other weekend because again, as we've pointed out, since VAR has been introduced, over the last 5-7 years, it has been so ingrained in linos to keep the flag down that even when they find themselves in a rare VAR-less match, that "keep the flag down" mantra is difficult to detach from especially when it's only a rare VAR-less match after tens or hundreds of VAR matches in a row. They don't just go back from being a VAR lino to being a normal lino again in a heartbeat. They would have to go through a VAR decontamination period to remember what being a pre-VAR lino is like before you can start to feel confident in putting the flag up again. This is just human nature, linos as well as referees have been re-programmed due to VAR and they clearly and abundantly do not officiate the sport in the same way as they did before. So therefore we cannot assume that today's VAR-induced linos would make the same decisions as pre-VAR linos would have. Today's VAR-induced linos keep the flag down on anything remotely close, whereas in the past many of those (maybe 50%) they would put the flag up, creating a completely different sequence of events than anything that the VAR way of doing it does.

So basically officials on the pitch can do no wrong then ? if they don't flag because they thought it was onside you will excuse them and say 'yeh thats VAR fault that is', same for Refs not giving any decision.

Linos have a very tough job to do to spot the run and point of contact, often so many are absolute fractional margins - I don't blame them for getting it wrong at all - and i don't want them flagging wrongly every time, i would rather they have some tech help especially when it leads to a goal.
Semi auto being bought it 'should' be even more accurate and faster - why would we not want that in the game?! madness to just put the onus on one bloke with a flag expected to get these marginal decisions correct - Yes, that's how it was before and if you look at some old highlights it was a shambles some of the decisions (often labelled corrupt)

You want to go back to this, i don't.


 
That's a vast assumption.. Just because a lino in a VAR world keeps the flag down doesn't mean a lino pre-VAR would have done the same. That's the false equivalency you're relying on.

It wasn't proven the other weekend because again, as we've pointed out, since VAR has been introduced, over the last 5-7 years, it has been so ingrained in linos to keep the flag down that even when they find themselves in a rare VAR-less match, that "keep the flag down" mantra is difficult to detach from especially when it's only a rare VAR-less match after tens or hundreds of VAR matches in a row. They don't just go back from being a VAR lino to being a normal lino again in a heartbeat. They would have to go through a VAR decontamination period to remember what being a pre-VAR lino is like before you can start to feel confident in putting the flag up again. This is just human nature, linos as well as referees have been re-programmed due to VAR and they clearly and abundantly do not officiate the sport in the same way as they did before. So therefore we cannot assume that today's VAR-induced linos would make the same decisions as pre-VAR linos would have. Today's VAR-induced linos keep the flag down on anything remotely close, whereas in the past many of those (maybe 50%) they would put the flag up, creating a completely different sequence of events than anything that the VAR way of doing it does.
Without VAR - he should have flagged it offside, but VAR can't rectify it
With VAR - he should have flagged it offside, but VAR can rectify it
 
Var was very strange, shit as usual but also strange.
They actually showed a still of our goal and how it was offside. I have never seen that before and of course nothing shown for their 3rd goal.
Was at the match sat pretty much level and it was clearly offside the Lino choose not to flag I don't know why Yet with the City goal same place on pitch and also offside he couldn't wait to get his flag up So, bullocks trying to claim that VAR kept it at 2:0 he would have flagged the LFC goal in the good old days
 
madness to just put the onus on one bloke with a flag expected to get these marginal decisions correct - Yes, that's how it was before and if you look at some old highlights it was a shambles some of the decisions (often labelled corrupt)
Madness is not how football functioned for 150 years. Madness is how football has been dysfunctioning for the last 5-7 years. You can cherry pick moments of outrage from howlers in the past but that pales in comparison to the amount of outrage and aggravation in football nowadays due to VAR. And it's not even close.
 
Was at the match sat pretty much level and it was clearly offside the Lino choose not to flag I don't know why Yet with the City goal same place on pitch and also offside he couldn't wait to get his flag up So, bullocks trying to claim that VAR kept it at 2:0 he would have flagged the LFC goal in the good old days
It's corrupt. On top of all the fundamental problems having to do with doing offsides this way, we have a new level of inconsistency. And that inconsistency is much more glaring than before. Because before VAR you really had to pay attention, rely on your memory not to forget something that happened in the match, which created more nuanced and interesting discussions. It showed who was paying attention more and there was balance to everything because you had uninterrupted flow in matches. Now with VAR everyone is intensely fixated almost entirely on what VAR hand picks to review or doesn't review, or the decision they make there that all that noise dominates everyones attention instead of all other things that happened throughout the match.
 

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top