Where do we start

[Rascal]

That was partly my point Rascal, many of the mini Che's on this forum can't quite grasp the ideas of Marxism either.

My remark was tongue in cheek because as you know mate Marxism isn't going to roost at Westminster at any day soon.

I can dream though pal.

 

[mexico1970]

I can dream though pal.

You certainly can mate, and your other post about people confusing lefties (Mainly good) with liberals (Mainly bad) is a fair one.

 

[Rascal]

You certainly can mate, and your other post about people confusing lefties (Mainly good) with liberals (Mainly bad) is a fair one.

The left has been infused with Liberalism, i am not a liberal, Starmer et al are Liberal left. The tories have banished their liberal right into obscurity. I am quite happy to state that i am on the authoritarian left, i believe in the state rather than liberal individualism. The new right like Reform etc are authoritarian as well, they are not statist though they are hyper individualists.

We are though as a nation a small "c" conservative electorate who believes in British values such as fairness, equality, family and community.

In my view rampant individualism "dog eats dog society" destroys the very fabric of our nation. That is what makes me a Socialist, I believe people are better when people work together, when communities stand together, when we have solidarity of class against the interests of those with wealth and as a nation we distribute the wealth of the nation in a more equitable manner.

Nobody should be homeless, no one should be hungry or afraid to put the heating on, everyone should have the very best education available and everyone should have cradle to grave healthcare for free at the point of use.

We need to find ourselves again, a country that does not look down on those less fortunate, but applauds those who have done well, the divisive rhetoric of the idiotic "culture" wars has to subside. We Brits are good people, I love my country, OK i might not have a bulldog avatar or call myself a patriot but I want the very best for every person in this country and only then can we be a better country.

 

[KS55]

The establishment believed in the ‘peace dividend’, they believed in Francis Fukuyama’s ’End of History’ but neither was true. The adoption of those beliefs promised the saving of money to be redirected elsewhere. A bad mistake.

 

[KS55]

The left has been infused with Liberalism, i am not a liberal, Starmer et al are Liberal left. The tories have banished their liberal right into obscurity. I am quite happy to state that i am on the authoritarian left, i believe in the state rather than liberal individualism. The new right like Reform etc are authoritarian as well, they are not statist though they are hyper individualists.

We are though as a nation a small "c" conservative electorate who believes in British values such as fairness, equality, family and community.

In my view rampant individualism "dog eats dog society" destroys the very fabric of our nation. That is what makes me a Socialist, I believe people are better when people work together, when communities stand together, when we have solidarity of class against the interests of those with wealth and as a nation we distribute the wealth of the nation in a more equitable manner.

Nobody should be homeless, no one should be hungry or afraid to put the heating on, everyone should have the very best education available and everyone should have cradle to grave healthcare for free at the point of use.

We need to find ourselves again, a country that does not look down on those less fortunate, but applauds those who have done well, the divisive rhetoric of the idiotic "culture" wars has to subside. We Brits are good people, I love my country, OK i might not have a bulldog avatar or call myself a patriot but I want the very best for every person in this country and only then can we be a better country.

Interesting post. I don’t disagree with the values you describe, but are they really authoritarian left or socialist? They sound more like left liberalism to me.

 

[hilts]

Interesting post. I don’t disagree with the values you describe, but are they really authoritarian left or socialist? They sound more like left liberalism to me.

There will always be crossovers but to me liberalism is more about the individual and socialism is more about the group.

The danger, there is danger in most things, is that liberalism can develop into self interest which if we are being honest has infected the modern world.

 

[flook]

I forgot to say that at the very least unearned income and earned income should be taxed at exactly the same rate, or unearned income to be at a higher rate.

Why on earth should dividends be taxed at lower rate than hard earned pay?

Well for 1 reason, money invested to buy the shares which bring the dividend has already being taxed, so taxing the dividend is in effect double taxation of the earned income.

I'm talking here about the working man (or woman for the PC brigade) using his earned money to build a better future for his family rather than pissing it all up the wall or on the latest iphone every 6 months.

 

[Alvin-blue-qhd]

The left has been infused with Liberalism, i am not a liberal, Starmer et al are Liberal left. The tories have banished their liberal right into obscurity. I am quite happy to state that i am on the authoritarian left, i believe in the state rather than liberal individualism. The new right like Reform etc are authoritarian as well, they are not statist though they are hyper individualists.

We are though as a nation a small "c" conservative electorate who believes in British values such as fairness, equality, family and community.

In my view rampant individualism "dog eats dog society" destroys the very fabric of our nation. That is what makes me a Socialist, I believe people are better when people work together, when communities stand together, when we have solidarity of class against the interests of those with wealth and as a nation we distribute the wealth of the nation in a more equitable manner.

Nobody should be homeless, no one should be hungry or afraid to put the heating on, everyone should have the very best education available and everyone should have cradle to grave healthcare for free at the point of use.

We need to find ourselves again, a country that does not look down on those less fortunate, but applauds those who have done well, the divisive rhetoric of the idiotic "culture" wars has to subside. We Brits are good people, I love my country, OK i might not have a bulldog avatar or call myself a patriot but I want the very best for every person in this country and only then can we be a better country.

This is the most impressive post I have ever read in this forum so far.

 

[KS55]

There will always be crossovers but to me liberalism is more about the individual and socialism is more about the group.

The danger, there is danger in most things, is that liberalism can develop into self interest which if we are being honest has infected the modern world.

Equally, if you put group interest first you run the danger of shunning or worse those who somehow offend the group ethos.
Personally, I tend towards the individual rather than the group, while recognising that the welfare of the whole is most important.
City is a great team, made up of disparate individuals. Pep has somehow found the secret, witness how team orientated they all are without losing their individuality. Crikey, City as moral philosophy!

 

[hilts]

Equally, if you put group interest first you run the danger of shunning or worse those who somehow offend the group ethos.
Personally, I tend towards the individual rather than the group, while recognising that the welfare of the whole is most important.
City is a great team, made up of disparate individuals. Pep has somehow found the secret, witness how team orientated they all are without losing their individuality. Crikey, City as moral philosophy!

If you think the welfare of the whole is the most important and know Pep would discard the individual if it affected the whole team then you don't actually lean towards the individual.

Its not a case of being only one and not the other and that view is what causes the problems in life. Its just a matter of importance really.