United thread 2018/19

[prestonibbo_mcfc]

Ederson comes out of his penalty area, that trait alone has cost us goals but not something I'd change? Lets remove the bitter blue tag and accept when a red twat is good.

He is a good keeper, imo. Just shows how Utd's setup helps him as opposed to Spain's.

 

[Tom_mcfc]

It's because of the keeper. Even John Terry is going to get beaten in the air sometimes, which is why you want the bloke who can catch the ball above everyone's head to come and sort it out as often as possible.

This isn't news either, or one man's crazy opinion, a lot of United fans have known for a long time he doesn't come for crosses enough and it costs them goals.

Look at the derby last season for a perfect example. 1st goal, corner comes in on the 6 yard box line, Otamendi beats lukaku for a header. Neuer, Oblak, Courtois all come off their line and claim that ball.

Second goal ball flies harmlessly over every City player on the line of the 6 yard box where Lukaku tries to volley clear. Every other top keeper catches that ball for fun, unchallenged, no need to jump. De Gea rooted to the line.

That happened at least 10 times last season, I used 10 as it's the number of set piece goals they conceded, but in truth some of those won't have been his fault, while there will be some crosses from open play he cocked up for as well.

No, them Chelsea defenders were an awful lot more stronger than Smalling and pissing Jones. He might not come as much as he should but he certainly isn't an issue in that team and wasn't an issue when Real Madrid were going to spend big money on him. You cant predict what keepers will come out and claim it, they could come out and drop it. At least you will admit he can't be blamed for every one. Defenders need to do their bit too. It is interesting why you only focus on that side of his game and when he "costs" United (very rare) instead of the many points he will have single handed won them sadly. Golden glove, team of the year (again) and conceded the second least in the league would suggest he is better than the disaster you are making out.

It cost us one v the dippers, don't recall any others.

Done it pre season too, we have conceded goals through him coming out. Saved us many times too, it isn't a pop but someone defended Neur because he comes out as if it is relevant.

 

[TheThirdDeano]

I’m not having it.
De Gea is not, will never be and never has been a world class keeper.
A combination of camera saves and playing for the Worlds biggest club have given him everything needed to be pushed to the public perception of a top keeper.
It’s no coincidence he’s won 1(one) golden glove, and Madrid haven’t come back for another sniff and has done nothing of note on the mean time.

 

[Tom_mcfc]

That's exactly my point. Teams who sit back and defend deep face a lot of shots from frustrated that don't bother the keeper at all, which is why keepers like De Gea, Pope and co. have such inflated "saves per goal" statistics, which is why it's not a measure of how good a keeper is.

Put a keeper like that in a team that's more open, and their numbers absolutely plummet.

Tom is arguing that teams who sit back and defend deep face fewer shots (factually wrong) so that when a keeper has a higher "saves per goal" stat it's even more impressive.

No, my argument was when someone said he plays well at United because he has 6 defenders in front of him. He plays well at United because most matches he makes good saves. I used it because it shows he faces shots when people suggested he didn't because of their approach to games. The measure of how good a keeper is their match performance. You cant comment on him with balance so why not just say I don't care he is a rag so I refuse to give him any credit.

 

[Tom_mcfc]

I’m not having it.
De Gea is not, will never be and never has been a world class keeper.
A combination of camera saves and playing for the Worlds biggest club have given him everything needed to be pushed to the public perception of a top keeper.
It’s no coincidence he’s won 1(one) golden glove, and Madrid haven’t come back for another sniff and has done nothing of note on the mean time.

What of note would you like him to do? Score a goal?

 

[inchy14]

What of note would you like him to do? Score a goal?

De Gea, like Rashford, like Pogba, like any fucker who has played for them in the last 40 years are raised to levels in the press far above where they actually are. He's a very good keeper but limited in what he can do, makes many mistakes like he has for Spain yet is rarely called out on it.

We've got the better keeper imo, certainly suits our style of play.

 

[domalino]

it isn't a pop but someone defended Neur because he comes out as if it is relevant.

You seem to be confusing "coming out of the box" with "going into the opposition box for a corner because you're seconds away from bombing out of the world cup".

 

[roj]

We often talk about players' transfer value rising after world cups. I think the opposite may have happened with the hapless doughnut thief.

 

[Vienna_70]

How is it I immediately thought of David Silva's 5th goal in a well-known match, where De Gea was pounding the floor in frustration?

What match was that, then?

 

[Vienna_70]

Massive weaknesses? What crazy wording. You are also aware Real Madrid, one of the best teams in the world were seconds away from signing him? If it fell through for anything their end do you think it was because last second they went oh he isn't as good as we think actually? No chance.

Having a very quick look he made 3.58 saves per every goal whereas Ederson only had 2.17 saves per goal. As I said I would rather Ederson for us but it is beyond delusional to think he isn't a fantastic shot stopper. For every Ronaldo goal in this world club there are many examples of class saves from shots outside the area. That stat puts to bed that he is good because United are defensive too, he still faces a lot of shots because no matter how defensive they go their defence still isn't great.

So you slag off Raheem like your life depends on it and defend the alpaca just as vehemently?

A very strange stance for a City supporter.

 

[Vienna_70]

If a team has ten men behind the ball then surely they are facing less shots otherwise it is pointless if they are relying on their goalkeeper? I like how you are quick on the stats when it suits? He hasn't had a good world cup, just like Neur who you have a hard on for? A Neur who conceded 4 goals in 3 games, against 3 very average sides, played poorly and plays for a club team where he rarely gets tested. You have used the World Cup as a stick to beat De Gea with whilst defending Neur. Very selective if you ask me. He costs United ten goals a season? Do you genuinely believe that or is making that up a straw for you to clutch at? He is the only reason United haven't been mid table or worse the last few years. He certainly saves them more than he costs them.




No I don't, going in on De Gea is crazy talk though.

It Neuer.

 

[crazyg]

What match was that, then?

Must have been a derby match, but which particular one I can't quite remember. Something to do with knocking buildings down, I think.
;-)

 

[Vienna_70]

Must have been a derby match, but which particular one I can't quite remember. Something to do with knocking buildings down, I think.
;-)

Oh yeah, I remember now.

Wasn’t there a dead bird involved too?

 

[foggy1974]

He is a good keeper but how many of his saves are as good as when he saved Agueros header in the derby. A lot of his save are straight at him, now that could be down to his positional sense of beinf in the right place, but rarely you see him clawing it out of the top corner.
The strikers in the world cup havent shot straight at him. The one save he did make the defender pushed the striker wide, the only place he could put it was straight at De Gea.

 

[KentBlue]

You cant comment on him with balance so why not just say I don't care he is a rag so I refuse to give him any credit.

You come on here defending DeGea and because someone disagrees you bring that tired old clichè up. Is that your go-to retort to any City fan who criticises a rag? People are making valid points about his goalkeeping skills but you assume they're just being nasty because of who he plays for. It makes no difference which club he plays for, if people (and I am one of them) don't particularly rate him it's because we see faults in his game that you apparently do not. These are called opinions, mate. We all have 'em. Suggesting a football fan (a knowledgeable and articulate fan at that) judges the ability of a player simply because of the club he's representing is a rather shallow attitude to take.

 

[crazyg]

Oh yeah, I remember now.

Wasn’t there a dead bird involved too?

Not dead, but not well iirc. You're thinking of a Norwegian Blue.

 

[blue by birth]

So you slag off Raheem like your life depends on it and defend the alpaca just as vehemently?

A very strange stance for a City supporter.

Let's give him some credit...the alpaca is a better keeper than Raz.

 

[mat]

He makes the harder saves to be fair, as non deluded blues have pointed out some shots straight at you are sometimes the hardest. I like the questioning of him as a goalkeeper though it is pretty funny. Not biased in the slightest. One of the best in the world but I would rather have Ederson for how we play.

Rag.

 

[mat]

At least Neur will come out of his penalty area

In fact you'll find him on the edge of the opponents!

DeGea, undoubtedly a good keeper otherwise he wouldn't be rags number one. We saw how ruthless Mourinho was when he took over at Chelsea and replaced Cudicini with Cech
I do think though that some of his "spectacular" saves are glamorised by him and really are just "good" saves. That Arsenal game last season being a typical example. DeGea had a very busy game,played extremely well and didn't make any errors. I honestly don't think he made any worldies, just made good saves look spectacular. Every keeper will have an exceptional match, but as DeGea plays for the worlds greatest and biggest club "(TM)", he will always generate more plaudits (see every other good but hugely overrated rag player in the last 40 years)

In fact it was DeGea trying to make an ordinary bread and butter save look good that cost the rags vs Sevilla

I'd add Pickford to the list of Hollywood ball savers.

 

[mat]

No, them Chelsea defenders were an awful lot more stronger than Smalling and pissing Jones. He might not come as much as he should but he certainly isn't an issue in that team and wasn't an issue when Real Madrid were going to spend big money on him. You cant predict what keepers will come out and claim it, they could come out and drop it. At least you will admit he can't be blamed for every one. Defenders need to do their bit too. It is interesting why you only focus on that side of his game and when he "costs" United (very rare) instead of the many points he will have single handed won them sadly. Golden glove, team of the year (again) and conceded the second least in the league would suggest he is better than the disaster you are making out.



Done it pre season too, we have conceded goals through him coming out. Saved us many times too, it isn't a pop but someone defended Neur because he comes out as if it is relevant.

One v Rags - pre season friendly, meant fuck all

One v Shaktar - CL dead rubber, meant fuck all

One v Dippers - only one that mattered.

We wouldn't have got the hundred without him giving us I'd say 15 points on his own.