Var debate 2019/20

[cibaman]

Because ..... numbers

Is it being suggested that a player should only be ruled offside if VAR shows him to be more than 20cm or 7.5 inches offside?

Imagine we’re playing united and they have a corner. The ball richochets about in the box before landing at the feet of Phil Jones, standing like a statue a couple of yards out. He turns it into the net, the Lino raises their flag, but VAR indicates that he was only 7 inches offside so the “goal” is awarded. Imagine our reaction.

I think there probably does need to be a tolerance in VAR offsides but no more than 4 or 5 cms. If we can’t live with that we should scrap VAR and leave it to the linos. After all this analysis has proved that for decades they’ve being getting dogs abuse over offside decisions when they might have been right all along!

But if we did scrap VAR would we be more accepting of decisions? Now that we know that the the officials are probably better than we’ve given them credit for, would we be more accepting of offside decisions if the cameras show the Lino was wrong by 4 or 5 inches ? Somehow I doubt it. For me the question really should be will VAR get significantly more decisions right than wrong? There needs to be a very clear advantage from using VAR otherwise its not worth the delays it causes. But if VAR is significantly better then human beings then we should just accept that it’s not going to be 100% accurate.

 

[Rolee]

Does it worry anyone else that the head of VAR has reffed just 132 games at the top level? What qualifies him for his position?

 

[give it to gordon]

Does it worry anyone else that the head of VAR has reffed just 132 games at the top level? What qualifies him for his position?

Easy he's a yes man !!

 

[whp.blue]

Swarprick has said Rodri was looking for the pen and minimal contact.
Wonder what he thought about Pogbad when the defender brushed his big toe and both his legs crumpled?

Var is going to help Salah a lot this season by those standards.

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Paul, aka Florida Blue - Can I make a suggestion? Perhaps you would like to respond to Tommy at the Premier League and ask him to let you have a copy of or link to the Laws of the Game that he has mentioned and which their officials follow when refereeing our matches. We should all know. The Rules must be publicly available. It is the letter of the Law 12 which must be applied.

You are acting perfectly reasonably and correctly in pursuing this.

There is no point in asking them which laws they are applying - they will obviously say all of them. He'll just link to the pdf version.

What is the key point is what the law covers. Which phrase of the law relates to what happened, and what is the interpretation of 'gains control/possession' - is it just for the player whose arm is hit, or does the possession part relate to anyone on his team? Is there a guideline on what constitutes a GSO?

Oh, and thank him for replying! If the question is for clarification, Tommy probably can't tell us, but it may get passed on to someone who can, if asked. Maybe explain that the spectators had no idea, and offer some constructive feedback about how the VAR process could be improved as well.

 

[BlueSkyBlue]

keeper had one foot on the line, replay on whichever stream I was tied into at the time showed it

The rule makers have said they will not use VAR to review goalkeepers position at the moment of hitting the ball....I imagine that will change if Eddie saves a penalty :D

 

[asahartford1]

I think he's just embarrassed with his challenge. Leaden-footed and a sitting-duck for Pogba.

He did look cumbersome.

 

[Brendan110_0]

Is it being suggested that a player should only be ruled offside if VAR shows him to be more than 20cm or 7.5 inches offside?

Imagine we’re playing united and they have a corner. The ball richochets about in the box before landing at the feet of Phil Jones, standing like a statue a couple of yards out. He turns it into the net, the Lino raises their flag, but VAR indicates that he was only 7 inches offside so the “goal” is awarded. Imagine our reaction.

I think there probably does need to be a tolerance in VAR offsides but no more than 4 or 5 cms. If we can’t live with that we should scrap VAR and leave it to the linos. After all this analysis has proved that for decades they’ve being getting dogs abuse over offside decisions when they might have been right all along!

But if we did scrap VAR would we be more accepting of decisions? Now that we know that the the officials are probably better than we’ve given them credit for, would we be more accepting of offside decisions if the cameras show the Lino was wrong by 4 or 5 inches ? Somehow I doubt it. For me the question really should be will VAR get significantly more decisions right than wrong? There needs to be a very clear advantage from using VAR otherwise its not worth the delays it causes. But if VAR is significantly better then human beings then we should just accept that it’s not going to be 100% accurate.

This has already been debunked, VAR cameras run at 120 FPS not 50-60 as Sky/ BT cameras so the margin for error is under a few CM.

 

[Bunchofdickovs]

He did look cumbersome.

The movement of pogba was like when you put an ironing board up . I think coady turned away and probably only felt the contact . He would likely have fouled him but for me he should have been booked for diving .

 

[Florida Blue]

You know something isn't right when even Duncan the rag Castles is on our side :)



Duncan Castles
@DuncanCastles
This is the new handball law that cost Manchester City a win today. Not entirely convinced it has been correctly applied by the VAR. Did Aymeric Laporte either ‘gain possession’ or ‘control of the ball’? No, the ball bounced straight off him.


Didn’t Laporte create a goal scoring opportunity (albeit accidentally) via the ball hitting his arm?

Duncan Castles
@DuncanCastles
·
Aug 17Doesn’t matter. As the Law is framed Laporte first has to gain possession/control of the ball and THEN create a goal-scoring opportunity to be penalised. As he did not do the former, he should not be penalised under this Law.
@DuncanCastles
·
Aug 17Second week of the Premier League season; second demonstration of the absurdity of the new handball rule. Manchester City comprehensively outplay Tottenham, but lose two points for a foul no one on the pitch saw.

 

[mccity]

wolves goal was backpass, that can't be an offside

Believe it or not the direction of the pass doesn't actually matter. You can be offside from a backwards pass.

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

So which is it, incidents are viewed in real time by VAR or not?

Swardick says that is the case, so how would anyone have seen a supposed handball from Laporte?

Oliver didn't.

It can only have been ascertained by confirmation bias and slow motion replays on loop.

Swardick states Oliver made the call on Rodri in real time, not VAR, yet proceeds to then provide his view that Rodri dived and they came to the same conclusion on VAR. Bastards are covering each others' backs and getting stories straight during actual play.

Mic this bastards up, just like NFL and Rugby, there is no accountability (which is convenient, considering Swardick proudly states there have only been five overturns out of 20 so far this season and we have been involved in three)

Wolves' equaliser against United was offside, based on the margins of Sterling last week and Jesus this week, no doubts about that. They bottled it because of the perception and controversy it would have caused, coming so soon after our late 'winner'.

And, for the matter of balance, I have watched it back a few times and I think Sergio was offside for our second goal last weekend.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

It all comes down to whether there is a statement somewhere of how this is being applied and what is intended to be covered.

Anyone can have an interpretation of the laws, but the only one that matters is what the refs are told to apply.

Well so far no one has produced any statements other than the ones published on the FA and IFAB websites and re-published on here. In these there is a discrepancy between the FA advice and what the IFAB rules actually say. Neil Swarbrick claimed on Radio 5 that the officials here were bound by the IFAB rules. Something does not add up.

 

[Florida Blue]

Castles shows what is presented on the Premier league website is NOT the same as the IFAB guidelines.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ECMk65LX4A8Lfix?format=jpg&name=4096x4096


Duncan Castles‏Verified account @DuncanCastles Aug 17


Replying to @dannyjbradders @TransferPodcast and

Sorry, but what is presented on the Premier League webaite is not the Law of the game. There is only one handball Law and it’s the one written by IFAB (under the influence of the Premier League, in this case). You can read them here: http://www.theifab.com/laws

Amazing a united supporting journo has done his homework on it and nobody else.

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

Swardick also claims City players were sat in the dressing room at the Etihad in mid-July having the rules explained to them.

We were in China?

 

[FantasyIreland]

Wolves' equaliser against United was offside, based on the margins of Sterling last week and Jesus this week, no doubts about that. They bottled it because of the perception and controversy it would have caused, coming so soon after our late 'winner'.

Spot on,ive been saying exactly that.

The goal should not have stood given the precedent they have set.

 

[kaz7]

Its beyond pathetic after 2 games. These ****s will never accept being wrong.

They said every thing reviewed in real time so they are breaking what was promised,if it was a dive why did they need to look at it multiple times? looking for a reason to say no ****s

 

[blueinsa]

2 games into the season and already they are battling to save face over the use and introduction of tech that is clearly not for for purpose right now (offsides) or its interpretation by the same officials that still apply their own slants and bias on to a decision meaning that teams will never be treated fairly or impartially.

Get rid and lets go back to the ref and his linesman.

 

[CatMan]

So which is it, incidents are viewed in real time by VAR or not?

Swardick says that is the case, so how would anyone have seen a supposed handball from Laporte?

Oliver didn't.

It can only have been ascertained by confirmation bias and slow motion replays on loop.

Swardick states Oliver made the call on Rodri in real time, not VAR, yet proceeds to then provide his view that Rodri dived and they came to the same conclusion on VAR. Bastards are covering each others' backs and getting stories straight during actual play.

Mic this bastards up, just like NFL and Rugby, there is no accountability (which is convenient, considering Swardick proudly states there have only been five overturns out of 20 so far this season and we have been involved in three)

Wolves' equaliser against United was offside, based on the margins of Sterling last week and Jesus this week, no doubts about that. They bottled it because of the perception and controversy it would have caused, coming so soon after our late 'winner'.

And, for the matter of balance, I have watched it back a few times and I think Sergio was offside for our second goal last weekend.

Sergio was behind the ball but admittedly in front of the defender. You cannot be offside if you are level or behind the ball when it is played regardless of the position of any opposition player so he was onside.

 

[Chi-town blues]

You know something isn't right when even Duncan the rag Castles is on our side :)



Duncan Castles
@DuncanCastles
This is the new handball law that cost Manchester City a win today. Not entirely convinced it has been correctly applied by the VAR. Did Aymeric Laporte either ‘gain possession’ or ‘control of the ball’? No, the ball bounced straight off him.


Didn’t Laporte create a goal scoring opportunity (albeit accidentally) via the ball hitting his arm?

Duncan Castles
@DuncanCastles
·
Aug 17Doesn’t matter. As the Law is framed Laporte first has to gain possession/control of the ball and THEN create a goal-scoring opportunity to be penalised. As he did not do the former, he should not be penalised under this Law.
@DuncanCastles
·
Aug 17Second week of the Premier League season; second demonstration of the absurdity of the new handball rule. Manchester City comprehensively outplay Tottenham, but lose two points for a foul no one on the pitch saw.

First of all , is there any clear footage that shows Laporte handled the ball ?
From what I’ve seen so far it deflected from spuds player . Loris would be the first one to appeal if it came off Laporte but non of the spuds players reacted instead the smirk on loris face after decision says it all.