Var debate 2019/20

[ballinio]

I have binned watching live matches. Enough is enough. Yesterday i didn't watch the match. The first time in forever i have deliberately not watched City live. Football was my release. When we scored i went ape. My only moments of total abandon in my ordinary life. At the Etihad in May 2012 I literally lost my shit at 93:20.
The most amazing, emotional experience of my long life. Now, the thrill has gone. Stolen from me by technocrats and nerds. Pedantic tossers and bent referees. I will watch the match in retrospect. Passionless and knowing the score and any potential flash points. My TV can rest easy in the knowledge that my fever has been been quashed, my language neutured and behaviour capped. What a grey world it has become.

100% where I am at now, only thing that will get me back is if they scrap VAR , I think many more will be joining us at the end of the season.

 

[TheThirdDeano]

I was thinking recently as well;

this whole not wanting to overrule the red is bullshit.

the ref gave the goal against Tottenham and then it was overruled by VAR And ruled out.

it’s an excuse they hide behind to not give decisions they should have but didn’t want to.

 

[willipp]

Coldest of stone cold pen's. Ball going on way, Zaha moving in almost opposite direction before clattering into De Bruyne and pushing him over.
To not give that after a review just shows how shit the whole idea is.

We won so we all kind of accept it. However it’s influencing far too many results. Watford should of had an absolute stone wall pen at 1-0 and then go on to draw the game after alli scores when the ball hits his arm. Pretty much every game yesterday had really bad decisions from VAR.

 

[Allnightlong]

VAR is complete bollocks. How can your player be goal-side of a defender with the ball at his feet then be shoved over with from behind with two hands and you don’t get a penalty? Same as when Rodri was pushed over against Spurs, there is no explanation for either of those not being given

De Bruyne run was stopped by a blatant challenge/push and Salah a couple of weeks ago was impeded slightly by a tug on his shirt. Strange

 

[Chippy_boy]

I was thinking recently as well;

this whole not wanting to overrule the red is bullshit.

the ref gave the goal against Tottenham and then it was overruled by VAR And ruled out.

it’s an excuse they hide behind to not give decisions they should have but didn’t want to.

This is so obviously true, I don't know why anyone is debating it anymore.

 

[balotellishaircut]

As I said, cheating bent cunnts. The refs, Riley, the Premier league, the fucking lot of them

Agreed yep from top to bottom.

 

[carlosthejackal]

With the inept and random way it’s being used I honestly believe it will kill the game in the eyes of many match going fans .

 

[franksinatra]

I will need some convincing that the variation is down to 'poor implementation', Frank. These are supposed to be experienced referees who should be able to recite the laws of the game blindfolded, although I think some of them enter the field of play with the blindfold still in place, and how two of these jokers can suggest for one bloody minute that the foul on KdB did not meet every single criterion the LotG require for the award of a penalty just beggars belief. Similarly for the DirtyAli handball - the ball clearly hits the badge on his arm - and for the foul on Delufeou. Three examples where VAR should provide a definitive statement that matches WTF we have all seen, and fudges it. It was interesting to hear Lineker mention that in all the 90 games played this season VAR has not overturned one single decision!

As you have highlighted not one decision has been overturned and that highlights its poor implementation, which is not just affecting us but effecting everybody, unless no one else has had a poor decision against them.

I do not think it matters if the refs can recite the laws blindfolded as every decision comes down to interpretation and so you will never get consistency especially when relying on the naked eye making split second decisions. That is where VAR should come in to assist with that but it isn’t and that is what is completely wrong. The KDB pen not being given by VAR is hardly evidence of bias as some want us to believe as its consistent with all other VAR decisions, that the decision never gets overturned.

 

[bluetonium]

Watched the replay of the incident this morning again, if anything I've gone from a probable penalty to a definite one. Zaha just leans into him with no intention or chance to get the ball.

The way they are using VAR right now is confusing to say the least as hilighted above by others it takes only a brushing of mane's arm to give one, bit a shovel on one of ours is handled differently.

The only difference is that input case the ref didn't initially give it, but the ref did for Mane. So, if the issue is not wanting to leave the referees embarrassed then that is a direct perversion of the laws and fairness of the game, and has lead yet again to overruling a clear and obvious error.

The other possibility is that the VAR official didn't think it was a penalty due to not sufficient contact. Which brings us back to the question of what is enough contact, and why is it seemingly a lower threshold for Mane, Salah for example? The next step up would have been zaha pushing Kevin over, so as Kev stays on his feet we are punished?

 

[franksinatra]

Why should football be any different to life.
It’s money. It’s bent.

Because not all of life is bent and the majority of people are honest.

 

[Silva2021]

Watched the replay of the incident this morning again, if anything I've gone from a probable penalty to a definite one. Zaha just leans into him with no intention or chance to get the ball.

The way they are using VAR right now is confusing to say the least as hilighted above by others it takes only a brushing of mane's arm to give one, bit a shovel on one of ours is handled differently.

The only difference is that input case the ref didn't initially give it, but the ref did for Mane. So, if the issue is not wanting to leave the referees embarrassed then that is a direct perversion of the laws and fairness of the game, and has lead yet again to overruling a clear and obvious error.

The other possibility is that the VAR official didn't think it was a penalty due to not sufficient contact. Which brings us back to the question of what is enough contact, and why is it seemingly a lower threshold for Mane, Salah for example? The next step up would have been zaha pushing Kevin over, so as Kev stays on his feet we are punished?

.

The issue is the original ref, VAR just basically backs up there decision bar offside and handball when it’s City.

It’s ridiculous at the moment and we’re not the only ones who can see it.

 

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

As you have highlighted not one decision has been overturned and that highlights its poor implementation, which is not just affecting us but effecting everybody, unless no one else has had a poor decision against them.

I do not think it matters if the refs can recite the laws blindfolded as every decision comes down to interpretation and so you will never get consistency especially when relying on the naked eye making split second decisions. That is where VAR should come in to assist with that but it isn’t and that is what is completely wrong. The KDB pen not being given by VAR is hardly evidence of bias as some want us to believe as its consistent with all other VAR decisions, that the decision never gets overturned.

Why have we not had one single decision overturned? Ninety odd games, goals galore, decisions to make, not one single decision overturned. The KdB penalty in all probability wouldn't have been given last season and there would have been a cry for VAR to be in place so that the foul could be looked at again from a variety of angles. Lo and behold, we now have VAR and it arrives at the same erroneous decision. How come? What kind of 'interpretion' is afoot that deems that tackle not to be a foul. Just take in Guardiola's annoyance/disbelief that some of those decisions are 'honest'!

 

[Paladin]

For me the biggest problem with VAR is that it's being looked at by other refs. Yesterday in our match it was Michael Oliver and I think they are at the moment genuinely scared of overturning a decision of a fellow work mate. Now it the same in cricket however the 3rd umpire tells the on field umpire what the mistake was and why is being overturned and the crowd and audience can clearly hear it as well. No confusion.

So for me for the time being have VAR done by an independent football committee (not refs) so no impartiality until the refs are re-trained to do that and also let the audience and crowd know what is actually happening

I think cricket is not a good example as a comparison with football. In cricket, the technology can detect the actual outcome of the event that is being judged. It can tell if the ball was going to hit the stumps or miss. It can freeze the frame at the point the ball hits the wicket. It shows the bat or foot in relation to the crease. It detects the slightest touch of the ball on the bat etc. Football decisions remain subjective, apart from goal line technology, which is flawless.

 

[franksinatra]

Why have we not had one single decision overturned? Ninety odd games, goals galore, decisions to make, not one single decision overturned. The KdB penalty in all probability wouldn't have been given last season and there would have been a cry for VAR to be in place so that the foul could be looked at again from a variety of angles. Lo and behold, we now have VAR and it arrives at the same erroneous decision. How come? What kind of 'interpretion' is afoot that deems that tackle not to be a foul. Just take in Guardiola's annoyance/disbelief that some of those decisions are 'honest'!

But nobody has had a decision overturned. This is not unique to us but happening to every club, its not directed at us alone.

You are quite correct VAR, if we have to have it, should be overruling those decisions but it is not across the board, which takes me back to the main issue of how it is being implemented.

 

[blueinsa]

I think cricket is not a good example as a comparison with football. In cricket, the technology can detect the actual outcome of the event that is being judged. It can tell if the ball was going to hit the stumps or miss. It can freeze the frame at the point the ball hits the wicket. It shows the bat or foot in relation to the crease. It detects the slightest touch of the ball on the bat etc. Football decisions remain subjective, apart from goal line technology, which is flawless.

Agree and rugby is a better comparison but the laws of the game are the laws of the game. With VAR the ref, linesmen and VAR officials can look at the numerous camera angles and come to the right decision almost every single time as per the laws of the game.

They simply refuse to do that and they dont care that fans can see them refusing to do that.

 

[blueinsa]

But nobody has had a decision overturned. This is not unique to us but happening to every club, its not directed at us alone.

You are quite correct VAR, if we have to have it, should be overruling those decisions but it is not across the board, which takes me back to the main issue of how it is being implemented.

Certain sides are getting them given, every single time.

Certain sides are not, every single time.

They wont over turn any decision, thus the fix is in.

 

[Paladin]

FWIW I just laughed out loud at the KDB pen yesterday. It was actually funny.

Same. It was such an obvious penalty, but I knew from precedent it would not be given. I had absolutely no expectation of being awarded a penalty there.

 

[franksinatra]

Certain sides are getting them given, every single time.

Certain sides are not, every single time.

They wont over turn any decision, thus the fix is in.

If that is the case, which I do not believe, then the situation is no different to previous years so VAR is not impacting on the fix either way in relation to fouls etc. Offsides /handballs excepted could be different.

 

[blueinsa]

If that is the case, which I do not believe, then the situation is no different to previous years so VAR is not impacting on the fix either way.

VAR is impacting as seen by our goal against Spurs being ruled out because of it and Spurs goal yesterday being given, despite it.

 

[franksinatra]

VAR is impacting as seen by our goal against Spurs being ruled out because of it and Spurs goal yesterday being given, despite it.

See the edit