The Conservative Party

The perfect fumble said:
If the left continues down this path it'll be in opposition forever.

The right wing have built solid support in this country by dog whistling racist bullshit to a specific ethnic group, a group which a few in here says doesn't exist.

Even if it's true, the group, at least a sizeable chunk of it, doesn't see it that way.

What's the left going to do? Patronise them? Wait for them to die? That's a winning strategy.

We defeat the problem of ethnic friction, by denying the existence of the largest group! How could that possibly go wrong.
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It’s not denying the existence of the largest group, it’s cementing the historicity of the largest group as being from this island for much longer than we originally thought.
 
Psychedelic Casual said:
Black African is a race not an ethnicity.

All of those ethnicities are different ethnicities within the same race.
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You're right.

As I stated Black African is not an ethnicity

But even the idea of Black African as a race is becoming redundant. Current consensus in scientific circles is that race has comparatively little value as there is more genetic variation within than between groups. but the idea of race persists because it is an important political and psychosocial concept. And of course with so many ethnicities in just one black African nation like Nigeria, in order to make sense of it all broad brush terms are commonly used by everyone if it serves a purpose and they are discarded when they do not.

I have no idea of the ethnicity of David Lammy, I couldn't care less, I don't recall him denying being of Afro-Caribbean origin, so that might well be what he ticked on the census and here were his choices....

Black, African, Caribbean or Black British​

  • African
  • Caribbean
  • Any other Black, African or Caribbean background
 
Fode N The Hole said:
I noticed you posted links to Graham Linehan's blog the other day, are you a paid subscriber? (you have to be to comment on his articles).

Somebody who has fucked up his career as a well regarded TV writer and his marriage because of his unhealthy obsession.
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Did I? It's possible but I'm not a subscriber, it was probably that female poster you bullied.

Fode N The Hole said:
.I wouldn't expect you to care. You just come across as a bitter old bigot with an increasingly bizarre world view.
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Better that than a misogynistic piece of shit.
 
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The perfect fumble said:
You're right.

As I stated Black African is not an ethnicity

But even the idea of Black African as a race is becoming redundant. Current consensus in scientific circles is that race has comparatively little value as there is more genetic variation within than between groups. but the idea of race persists because it is an important political and psychosocial concept. And of course with so many ethnicities in just one black African nation like Nigeria, in order to make sense of it all broad brush terms are commonly used by everyone if it serves a purpose and they are discarded when they do not.

I have no idea of the ethnicity of David Lammy, I couldn't care less, I don't recall him denying being of Afro-Caribbean origin, so that might well be what he ticked on the census and here were his choices....

Black, African, Caribbean or Black British​

  • African
  • Caribbean
  • Any other Black, African or Caribbean background
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Yeah I agree. I can tell the difference between an East and a West African, as much as I can between a Middle Eastern and a Sri Lankan. I think we’re on the same page here, I think I just went about agreeing with you a strange way.
 
The perfect fumble said:
Did I? It's possible but I'm not a subscriber, it was probably that female poster you bullied.



Better that than a misogynistic piece of shit.
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forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk

Transgender Children

There but for the grace of god. Most of us just cannot imagine what those children are going thru, not to mention the anguish of parents. Just best wishes to them all; hope it works out for them.
forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk

Yes.

What an earth are you talking about?

If you are talking about Blueandwhitestripes, then you are mistaken because I have deliberately not engaged with them after they started posting content from a hate mongering American Conservative group in the transgender athlete thread.

I would have thought you would know better than get on board with this hateful bandwagon and see it for the sham it is. An identity politics circus whipped up by the right to divide and distract.

You are this era's equivalent of the people that rallied against lowering the homosexual age of consent and supported section 28.

Why on earth you are obsessed by something that involves a tiny minority of the population and doesn't affect your life only you know.
 
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The perfect fumble said:
So how does this square with....
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Knowing that the genes I have that are from this island go back further than the Anglo-Saxon migration, I think of that as a positive rather than a negative.
 
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The perfect fumble said:
If the left continues down this path it'll be in opposition forever.

The right wing have built solid support in this country by dog whistling racist bullshit to a specific ethnic group, a group which one or two in here say doesn't exist.

Either ways, a sizeable chunk of something or other doesn't see it that way.

What's the left going to do? Patronise these people? Wait for them to die? That's a winning strategy!

So Labour believes we defeat the problem of ethnic friction, by denying the existence of the largest ethnic group!

How could it possibly go wrong?
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So essentially, you want "the left" to join "the right".
 
Vic said:
So essentially, you want "the left" to join "the right".
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I want the left to stop abandoning these people to the right.

What Lammy did was to deny their very existence, in a way he would never have done with any other ethnic group.

Labour used to square this circle by swerving the issue of race and ethnicity and instead appeal to class. The world was full of the oppressed and the oppressor, what mattered was which group you were in, and Labour stood for the oppressed. and if you're oppressed the skin colour of the person next to you was immaterial.

But the Labour Party now is synonymous with soft Tory Cameron/Blairism.

And Starmer is a Blair/Cameron clone, economically right wing, socially liberal.

Under Blair, Brown and Cameron social mobility was no better than under Thatcher and Major, which is par for the course, they were all to varying degrees right wing economically, but Blairism added social liberalism to the Thatcher cocktail and from 1997 to 2015 that's how we rolled.

And then a pathetic individual in Nigel Farage and a handful of oddballs and cranks seized the political moment and changed the course of this country forever. The country was not Cool Britannia at ease with itself, global, multi cultural Britain of dancing NHS nurses at the Olympics and dancing coppers at Notting Hill.

Nigel Farage realised there was a huge forgotten constituency he could appeal to, who were still stuck where they'd always been under Blair/Cameron right wing economics, in fact after 2010 things got worse, resources got stretched down there and suddenly difference mattered, and Farage told this group what that difference was, it was immigration, the little englander term for race.

And the rest is history.

Farage gave us Brexit, UKIP created Johnson. Because of that movement and the fear it engendered in the Tories, we are out of Europe with an inept government of right wing gangsters and reprobates, looking at a generation of economic decline, and why?

Because a buffoon like Farage and a clown like Johnson realised there was an enormous undercurrent of anger and frustration that they could tap, a group that felt left behind and dismissed, that desperately wanted answers and was therefore susceptible to lies, really big lies and these charlatans supplied them.

So what's the left's response?

David Lammy says this group doesn't exist.
 
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The perfect fumble said:
Labour used to square this circle by swerving the issue of race and ethnicity and instead appeal to class. The world was full of the oppressed and the oppressor, what mattered was which group you were in, and Labour stood for the oppressed. and if you're oppressed the skin colour of the person next to you was immaterial.
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Its been an interesting few pages and at last we get to the crux of the matter. As i have said many many times, it is all about class.

The problem Labour have which you have identified is that this appears to be no longer the case.

I have far more in common with an Asian lad who goes to City and works on a market stall than I do with say a Tory from the home counties who works in the banking industry and has a box at OT.

The whole point of these culture wars however and diminishment of the working class solidarity through accusations of Class War, tropes such as SJW, snowflake, wokeism, is that they are all designed to split the working class in any way they can as they know a united working class can be a powerful opponent to their vested interests.

Me personally i am not arsed what anybody's ethnicity is, where they were born, what sex they class themselves as, who they shag, what i am arsed about is what social class they are.
 
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Rascal said:
Its been an interesting few pages and at last we get to the crux of the matter. As i have said many many times, it is all about class.

The problem Labour have which you have identified is that this appears to be no longer the case.

I have far more in common with an Asian lad who goes to City and works on a market stall than I do with say a Tory from the home counties who works in the banking industry and has a box at OT.

The whole point of these culture wars however and diminishment of the working class solidarity through accusations of Class War, tropes such as SJW, snowflake, wokeism, is that they are all designed to split the working class in any way they can as they know a united working class can be a powerful opponent to their vested interests.

Me personally i am not arsed what anybody's ethnicity is, where they were born, what sex they class themselves as, who they shag, what i am arsed about is what social class they are.
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"Hello, I'm calling from the Labour party. Can you tell me what social class you are?"

Have you not yet realised? "Ye are many, they are few" was true 200 years ago. Now, there aren't enough poor people to elect a majority government that only attracts the working class.
 
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Vic said:
"Hello, I'm calling from the Labour party. Can you tell me what social class you are?"

Have you not yet realised? "Ye are many they are few" was true 200 years ago. Now, there aren't enough poor people to elect a majority government that only attracts the working class.
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You do not have to be poor to be working class.

You do not have to be rich to be middle class

You do not have to be a posh **** to be upper class

But class still exists and class barriers still exist.

Who gets the PPE contract from the Tories........the rich working class man or the poor upper class man?
 
Vic said:
I'd have added depends on who they're shagging, but not many PPE contracts have gone to pigs' heads.
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Yet. Now a slight change in legislation to allow the pigs head to open a bank account and you might see that change.
 
Rascal said:
Its been an interesting few pages and at last we get to the crux of the matter. As i have said many many times, it is all about class.

The problem Labour have which you have identified is that this appears to be no longer the case.

I have far more in common with an Asian lad who goes to City and works on a market stall than I do with say a Tory from the home counties who works in the banking industry and has a box at OT.

The whole point of these culture wars however and diminishment of the working class solidarity through accusations of Class War, tropes such as SJW, snowflake, wokeism, is that they are all designed to split the working class in any way they can as they know a united working class can be a powerful opponent to their vested interests.

Me personally i am not arsed what anybody's ethnicity is, where they were born, what sex they class themselves as, who they shag, what i am arsed about is what social class they are.
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Then you and I are part of the problem.

If David Lammy was out knocking on doors canvassing and a black afro-Caribbean Brit asked him what he was going to do for the black community he'd answer.

If a white English Brit asked what he was going to do for the white community, he'd get out of there as fast as he could.
 
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The perfect fumble said:
Then you and I are part of the problem.

If David Lammy was out knocking on doors canvassing and a black afro-Caribbean Brit asked him what he was going to do for the black community he'd answer.

If a white English Brit asked what he was going to do for the white community, he'd get out of there as fast as he could.
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It would be interesting to find out if Lammy had ever been asked that.

But then i live in an almost exclusively white community, i do have Nigerian neighbours and on the other side the girl is of Moroccan descent. The rest of my street is white and working class. The local councillor is a white British Labour councillor, the first Labour councillor we have ever had and he is actually very good at asking what the community wants but whether that is the case in a minority white community I do not know. My MP is a white British Tory, i live on a council estate in a well to do constituency and we never see our MP, she took the seat from the Lib Dems and we never saw that white British **** either, that might have been due to the email i sent him though :))
 
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