Have many of our “fans” become entitled?

I want City to be the best they can be given the quality of players, coaching staff and training facilities.
We have the best players (apart from Jordan Ibe obviously), we have the best head coach and we have the best training facilities. - Oh, and the best owners too. Therefore I want us to be the best all the bloody time.
And I don't really give a shit if that makes me "entitled". Rags and dippers believing they should be the best because they used to be the best are entitled. We have one of the best teams the world has ever produced therefore we should expect the best from them.
I didn't revel in being shite when we endured a dodgy decade or three as we had below average players, awful coaches and a couple of ridiculous chairmen. Those days are behind us for the moment; lets enjoy the success and demand we maximise it.
See you on Sunday; I'll be the one in the mask.
 
Dribble said:
Chelsea have beaten us the last two times we've played them. Quite why some of us believe all we have to do is turn up to be victorious, is beyond me.
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I agree with a lot of what you said but I don't think this is in the conversation for entitlement. Clearly nobody has said that they just have to turn up and it IS right to make City favourites. That's confidence in the team(they've earned it) not entitlement, the team will still have to be at their best and even then there are no guarantees. The favourites don't always win. Teams have been played off the pitch and still found a way to win in cup games.

From what I can see, there are some that refuse back the team before a big game. Before the Dortmund and PSG ties, it was the same, gave us no hope some did. So there's no way they are taking credit(not that any fans should) by not backing the team, what kind of logic is that?

Some have glossed over the weakened teams, where we took two defeats in two close games and are saying Chelsea are favourites. Disagreeing with that, is not entitlement, far from it. I've read comments like "Their defence is better than ours" and "their attack is more ruthless than ours" etc when that's nonsense in my opinion . Confidence is not entitlement, best 11 for best 11, if we play to our best, then we are the favourites but that doesn't mean we will definitely win.

Some may feel they are guarding against complacency by spreading panic before a big game and predicting doom but it doesn't help the team or anyone else in my view. City do not play to their best that way, Gundogan said it himself after the Dortmund game. City started the game fearful of losing what they had, rather than thinking about what they have to do to win and only started playing well when they snapped out of it.

Having said all that, I really doubt any of the team will read or be influenced by posts by City fans on BM or anywhere else before a big game for that matter. So both sides are wasting their energy in truth. It seems to be human nature, to think we can influence or control things that we can't in reality.
 
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I don't think we've reached that level of entitlement where we expect to win every time simply because of who we are. If we start tossing out insufferable shite like "European royalty" or "Theatre of Dreams" then we know we've gone full red club wanker. Thankfully we're not there yet and I pray to God we never get there
 
Gundog’s Gundog said:
I never really understand where this point of view comes from. Total confidence / arrogance / entitlement call it what you will is a natural state of mind to a 20 yr old blue who can barely remember a time when we weren’t successful. Middle aged blues have the memories of the bad old days to keep us miserable / negative / sensible call it what you will.

I’m sure he means well but I think the OP’s post is divisive. An over confident blue isn’t necessarily an entitled JCL **** and nor is a cautious blue a miserable bitter old twat. In the end we all want the same thing even though we’re all different.
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Who said I meant well!?

I’ll give them a right slap!
 
SebastianBlue said:
I come back from a long, difficult absence toward the end of another amazing season in which the club has again achieved things beyond my wildest dreams as a young lad and what do I find?

Far too many posts on here and elsewhere calling players “shitebags”, complaining about players’ commitment, criticising Pep’s management, and just generally moaning about the club.

After one loss in a dead rubber with one of the single worst (read: bent) refereeing performances I have seen in three decades of supporting City, a few weeks before our first ever Champions League final!

And on Twitter I see many abusing our players (some racially, especially when it comes to Sterling) after less-than-stellar performances or runs of form.

How have so many of our “fans” become so ****ing entitled, bordering on ragish. Or abhorrent, full stop. I know it’s not everyone — there are plenty admonishing and rebuking these impish idiots (at best). But there are still too many of these “fans” for my comfort. They are not what our club is about. They aren’t representative of our values. Perhaps United’s or Liverpool’s, bit not City’s.

Am I seeing more than are actually there? Am I falling in to just another trap of football tribalism, except creating more “us v them” amongst our own?

That could be the case and I am happy to be convinced I am.

But as of late, it seems like there has been a surge of the worst sort of “fan” in our ranks and I worry that the various aspects of the pandemic (isolation, shift to online engagement, return to the hooligan culture for many disaffected in order to find community/purpose/lost power, etc.) has them quickly taking over. At least the most visible, vocal realm of our support, anyway.

What do you think? Am I exaggerating the issue? Is it really that bad? Or is it just a prominent minority of “fans” that will eventually be drowned out as things get back to whatever “normal” is once the virus is under relative control?

I won’t be able to respond to all posts, or quickly to any, but I do appreciate everyone’s thoughts as I have been ruminating on this for some time, especially in light of the recent ESL debacle.

I think the general reaction of supporters — especially those in Manchester — really showed who we are and what we want the club to represent, but I also saw plenty of questionable stances among those claiming to be City fans. And I wonder what would have been the response of the club if the seemingly “entitled” contingent, who mostly appeared to love the idea of the ESL, had more time to rise in the ranks. And whether that means a similar situation in the future, if things progress as they are in my view, may result in a very different outcome.

Perhaps this is all down to my loss of sympathy for those that don’t know how good they have it. Maybe I’ve become even more of a miserable **** than I was before.

Regardless, although I can only mostly read threads these days, @Ric, it’s probably best to remove my mod privileges as seeing these daft, entitled, ragish posts throughout, it’s only a matter of time before I muster the energy to wildly swing the hammer. And, at any rate, I can’t really properly moderate any more, and have shed most of my diplomatic skills, so best I go back to being limited to addlebrained contributions like this.

Up the Blues!
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I don't know you or your circumstances but as someone who joined BM a few months after you did, welcome back & I don't believe you have become more miserable. I am glad you are back from your absence and your perspective is much appreciated by me and I believe some others, as you have by and large recorded what I have felt for a long time. I have ongoing health issues and it does tend to change one's "diplomatic skills", it becomes a little easier to swim against the flow and call what we see as crap as just that even when it is not popular.
"Am I seeing more than are actually there?" Sorry I cannot convince you otherwise.
"Far too many posts on here and elsewhere calling players “shitebags”," and not just players/club personnel but fellow posters who dare to exercise their right to disagree. I believe in some cases it is the type of Liverpool/Utd entitlement we always thought (naively) was not a City thing, but not always. Ironically some of the likes you get will be from posters who call players/other Blues, "shitebags" and they won't even recognise themselves, such is human nature. I am slow to agree that the pandemic or age or geographical location have had a huge part in the "surge" you noticed, I think the surge has swollen as the numbers of keyboard warriors has surged. Freedom of expression was once a gift to be cherished, it still is (old fashioned idea, I know.), now it means, say what you want, when you want, without thought or consequence, the cloak of anonymity providing cover for comment without responsibility, a reflection on societal change maybe, more than a City thing. I don't know how long you have been away from BM, but there is no doubt a break is often worthwhile. There are many posters who want reasoned debate on City and football, open to others opinions but your observations I feel would be confirmed if you were to follow some of the threads backwards, over a period of time, but for your general well being I would not advise that. I hope that you will be able to continue to be able to read and post here and await the "swing the hammer" posts with interest. Up the Blues !.
 
I think the self entitled is a dig at the younger element. Those of us that have suffered the depressing lows of yesteryear to achieving the ultimate highs of the past decade (AD Sheik Mansour era) may feel that way. It is not a crime to whine and whinge about certain games, players, performance etc. It is what we do as football fans and is symptomatic of ALL football fans. You don't have to hold a Pro Licence to see when something is not right or when to to make changes to formations etc etc, it is what we all do. Trust me, we whinged and moaned back in the 70s too and we were proper shite at times but we were also good at times too.
 
No.

When you have the best manager in the world managing the most expensive squad in the world then you should expect to win every game.

When you don’t win every game, everyone has a right to have a moan just like they had a right to moan about a poor pass from David Silva or a sitter from Sergio Aguero.

Football is an emotive game with many opinions. It doesn’t make you any less of a supporter if you don’t agree or like the way the team or the club are performing as long as it’s done without any abuse or gets too personal.

One of the worst traits of City fans IMO is being happy with not winning because we played Macclesfield away a long long long time ago.

If we perform badly next week in the final, you will get some supporters saying “oh well, look at the bright side, we were in the champions league final, when I was in Block HH of the Maine Stand v Grimsby Town in 1997, I could never have dreamed of seeing us in the champions league final”
 
Metalartin said:
I agree with a lot of what you said but I don't think this is in the conversation for entitlement. Clearly nobody has said that they just have to turn up and it IS right to make City favourites. That's confidence in the team(they've earned it) not entitlement, the team will still have to be at their best and even then there are no guarantees. The favourites don't always win. Teams have been played off the pitch and still found a way to win in cup games.

From what I can see, there are some that refuse back the team before a big game. Before the Dortmund and PSG ties, it was the same, gave us no hope some did. So there's no way they are taking credit(not that any fans should) by not backing the team, what kind of logic is that?

Some have glossed over the weakened teams, where we took two defeats in two close games and are saying Chelsea are favourites. Disagreeing with that, is not entitlement, far from it. I've read comments like "Their defence is better than ours" and "their attack is more ruthless than ours" etc when that's nonsense in my opinion . Confidence is not entitlement, best 11 for best 11, if we play to our best, then we are the favourites but that doesn't mean we will definitely win.

Some may feel they are guarding against complacency by spreading panic before a big game and predicting doom but it doesn't help the team or anyone else in my view. City do not play to their best that way, Gundogan said it himself after the Dortmund game. City started the game fearful of losing what they had, rather than thinking about what they have to do to win and only started playing well when they snapped out of it.

Having said all that, I really doubt any of the team will read or be influenced by posts by City fans on BM or anywhere else before a big game for that matter. So both sides are wasting their energy in truth. It seems to be human nature, to think we can influence or control things that we can't in reality.
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I've heard some of us speaking in much the sane way I've had to endure the Rags talking about themselves over the last 3 decades. As City fans we hated it. We knew they were better than most, & they knew it too, but was their any need for them to rub it in every opponents face?

They became so confident their supremacy over us would never end, they even made a count up banner! I think it's this level of arrogance which the OP & many City fans are sensing. The world of football hates us because of our perceived "Oil Money", I'd hate to think we were ever living up to the arrogance many in football believe we've acquired since essentially winning the football lottery with our fantastic owner.
 
Gundog’s Gundog said:
I never really understand where this point of view comes from. Total confidence / arrogance / entitlement call it what you will is a natural state of mind to a 20 yr old blue who can barely remember a time when we weren’t successful. Middle aged blues have the memories of the bad old days to keep us miserable / negative / sensible call it what you will.

I’m sure he means well but I think the OP’s post is divisive. An over confident blue isn’t necessarily an entitled JCL **** and nor is a cautious blue a miserable bitter old twat. In the end we all want the same thing even though we’re all different.
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As explained earlier, it's not how we see ourselves, it's how others perceive some of us. Yeh, we may see it as confidence, others will see it as the superior team rubbing everyone else's nose in their superiority.

Isn't this what we City fans coined as "Raggish Behaviour" over the decades, when that lot at Old Toilet did it to us? If we start doing the same, aren't we turning into those we despise? I think this is the OP's point, & whilst it doesn't apply to the vast majority of us, I've 100% noticed it creeping into the way some of our fans view football today where City are concerned.
 
The guy fitting our patio doors yesterday turned out to be a City fan. The arm tattoos gave it away. He started watching with his dad in the early 80's , He was confident we'd win against Chelsea in the final, i'm a bit more nervy. We both agreed we'd seen some real shite over the years so we were happy to be where we were. He said he'd been doing a job at an ex City players house recently, thick as mince but a real nice guy ( won't say his name he may be lurking). Fitter will be back in 3 weeks to finish off, one way or another we said we'd have a beer. Might be a generational thing, all this arrogant, entitled billy big bollocks stuff. No question we've attracted fans because of our increasing profile and success, it's only natural. Becoming a 'bigger' club with more fans worldwide there will inevitably be support for an ESL from some of them - what difference does it make to them? Tales of yore, stood on the Kippax, Bell, Lee, Summerbee, violence being shite, will mean nothing to the new generations, they will have had success on a regular basis, they will expect it and they will feel entitled to see it. They know no different unless their Dad, Mum, Grandad tell them how it used to be - and how easy it is for them to return
 
What a shit thread. I don't see why I would be regarded as "entitled" just because I think our rightful place is top of the Premier League and winning the Champions League
 
My brother ( a rag) said to me last week that I wsa likme Rees-Mogg laughing at those with less money

I know its through jealousy seeing how far that shitstain have fallen,- but Jeez,- Rees mogg, that really is below the belt
 
In addition to some of the excellent posts above I do think the media play a part. City losing is big news but winning, relative to the rags and dippers, is underreported.

That in your face, endless reams of news articles of it being “The end for Guardiola”, “They should be winning everything with the team they have” and add to that the “sportswashing” shite it is bound to influence people’s reaction when we lose. It’s all made to be more than a game of football and almost an attack on the individual for daring to be a City fan.

Whilst it’s not only the younger fans, it does seem to affect them more as they tend to place more trust in the things they read online.
 
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Prestwich_Blue said:
You forgot fans who won't be renewing their season tickets because they didn't get an email when they thought they should.
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Well I havent received an apology email about the ESL so City can f...

Oh wait a minute ! So my son got an email lol.

In all serious it's not just the fans its society.
I work for the local council and we get more complaints nowadays than say 10, 15yrs ago. We get more abuse in the streets, than 10, 15 yes ago its society.

Most people can just a email of complaint from their phone, in the 'old' days you had to write a letter , than post it wait for a reply etc
We get at least 3 or 4 people day moan at us for being council workers or verbally abuse us. Most of these people come out of the pubs or betting shops.

So I think it's only natural that City will start to get this type of behaviour on a forum.

I would say it's across all age groups, its do much easier these days to moan and complain, an email sent in minutes, abuse on a forum from a faceless peoples.
We dont all use our really names aka give it to Gordon ! My really name is Gary !.
Would I post so much crap if I used my really name ?

I hear fans moan about some players , something I try not to.

But this year has been stressful, strange, something we have never lived thought before.
For many football has been an outlet away of getting things of your chest.
Hopefully once live gets back to normal, the slacking of of people in general stops.
Personally I don't think well sadly.

People are now in the habit of moaning.

Only the other day two young lads from our place were called into the office and bollocked and told of because a member of the public said she saw them both pissing up a tree in the park when litter picking.
A quick email to the boss. The two lads were leaning on a tree looking at their phones whilst having a fag. Sadly the boss believed the moan straight away. There is no way these lads would do that. We always carry empty bottles in the transit Van's if needed. Mind you with the transit van now gone and replaced with 50 year old milkfloats we cant pee in a bottle now ! But that's another story lol

British people just like to moan and see the worst in people sadly.

That's my rambling thoughts on it ;)
 
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The short answer is probably yes.

However for the older fan like myself who has suffered for years then I would definitely say no. I am grateful for any trophy and just glad to see entertaining football and for our team to actually stand a chance of competing against the top teams. I still think we will make a balls up if we are 2-0 up going into extra time.
 
Gingers Dad said:
What a shit thread. I don't see why I would be regarded as "entitled" just because I think our rightful place is top of the Premier League and winning the Champions League
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Dont think it’s about that, not for me anyway. What bugs me isn’t thinking we now belong at the top, it’s the whining, and blaming,the thinking they know better than the Manager, the sometimes ott criticism of certain players if we happen to lose a game or get knocked out of a competition, think that,# what the op is talking about.
 
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