Cashless society

[awest]

The CBDC is what is mentioned more and more. So digital payments connected to everything. All very interesting but how will pensioners cope who don't trust banks in the first place?

 

[metalblue]

I work in the service industry, 80% domestic homes

Id say 75% is BACS and 25% cash

I wont have a card machine as they are too costly
Trouble is, cash is a dirty word and its always the presumption no tax is paid on it. But most of mine is used paying other supplier's etc and i guess it just goes round and round.

Tax will always be paid on it, eventually. The government will always get every penny we ever earn. Unless you burn it.

 

[117 M34]

Passports are merely for when you enter or leave a country. Driving licences are simply for driving offences.
Phones are a problem but unless you are a criminal plod aren't interested. And whilst i know you are being flippant about a tesco meal deal, if you trust a government to have all your information, who you bank with, where you go what you spend etc. Great. I don't. I fell foul of the tax man, neither my employer nor my union would support me to take them on even though both said I was right. That's how powerful they are. There was a recent case where H M Taxwanks bankrupted an innocent woman. Even after the intervention of a judge they refused to back down.

But if they wanted to find that information out about you, they would already know it.

I've got a mate who had to visit Mi5 office because he was doing some building work for them. When he arrived, they already knew that he stopped at the petrol station on the way and how much he had spent.

They can find it all out already so there is no need for the big conspiracy.

 

[staffsblue]

But if they wanted to find that information out about you, they would already know it.

I've got a mate who had to visit Mi5 office because he was doing some building work for them. When he arrived, they already knew that he stopped at the petrol station on the way and how much he had spent.

They can find it all out already so there is no need for the big conspiracy.

If you've ever watched "Hunted" on TV you'll already know how easy it is to trace people through phone calls, and phone GPS, numberplate recognition, CCTV and cash withdrawals from ATMs
I have nothing to hide, so not at all concerned about any of this, but it does seem difficult to go "off grid" in modern society.

 

[BrianW]

Almost everyone has a mobile phone these days, which means they can track exactly where you are if they want to do so. That's just the start.

The technology is in place for an absolute tyranny, but how do you avoid it? Go off-grid and live in a cave, eating only what you can scavange?

In reality, I don't think the government gives a shit, or ever will, whether I buy a coffee or not, spend half my income on Airfix kits, or buy 200 books a month. Quite apart from anything else, just think of the number of clerks they would need to monitor everyone. The truth is they haven't even the resources to monitor known terrorists properly. They certainly are not going to bother with people living quiet, uneventful lives.

 

[N1985]

As long as they don't know what I've hidden in the gap behind the kitchen bin cupboard, I'm fine.

That Latvian prostitute isn't it? Don't worry it's one less for them to throw on a boat

 

[SkyBlueFlux]

I live near London and I genuinely have not handled a British bank note in what… maybe two years?

I pay for everything on my phone. Cash ruins my budget analytics and makes it far harder to manage my money.

 

[blue44]

Keep seeing leaflets about the dangers of a cashless society. Will it be that bad if we go totally digital?

Not about cash, about smartphones etc.
I work with a bloke who is 63, been a season ticket holder since way back at MR.He gave it all up and hasn't returned once since we went digital a few years back,very sad.

 

[Summerbuzz]

Almost everyone has a mobile phone these days, which means they can track exactly where you are if they want to do so. That's just the start.

The technology is in place for an absolute tyranny, but how do you avoid it? Go off-grid and live in a cave, eating only what you can scavange?

In reality, I don't think the government gives a shit, or ever will, whether I buy a coffee or not, spend half my income on Airfix kits, or buy 200 books a month. Quite apart from anything else, just think of the number of clerks they would need to monitor everyone. The truth is they haven't even the resources to monitor known terrorists properly. They certainly are not going to bother with people living quiet, uneventful lives.

That's not the point. Who are you? One bod. Now if I could tell them all about 500 guys all like you, in your constituency. That's how elections are won.

That's why they really are all into the data. All parties. Trust me. All into it. All the time. Every single policy, every statement. Run through the data. Everyone is grouped and typified, forgotten, regrouped along different lines. A hundred times a week. To try and predict what they might get away with by messaging to certain groups. It might be more specific, the parties and affiliated organisations may well have long term lists for facebook accounts and data to go with them. Honestly, I'm not sure.

Cambridge Analytica got caught. But there seems little reason you can't do it in a 'clean room', away from any official party duty or links. And then you can tell people what to do, how to use this stuff.

It's also true that the job of managing your data is routinely handed (by this government) to overseas shitbags like Peter Thiel. I'm not sure what sort of access they have or how it can reasonably be restricted.

 

[Summerbuzz]

That Latvian prostitute isn't it? Don't worry it's one less for them to throw on a boat

Lol, no.

It's 5 ounces of ground panda cock. I use it to pay for Chinese takeaways.

 

[jazzy]

That's not the point. Who are you? One bod. Now if I could tell them all about 500 guys all like you, in your constituency. That's how elections are won.

That's why they really are all into the data. All parties. Trust me. All into it. All the time. Every single policy, every statement. Run through the data. Everyone is grouped and typified, forgotten, regrouped along different lines. A hundred times a week. To try and predict what they might get away with by messaging to certain groups. It might be more specific, the parties and affiliated organisations may well have long term lists for facebook accounts and data to go with them. Honestly, I'm not sure.

Cambridge Analytica got caught. But there seems little reason you can't do it in a 'clean room', away from any official party duty or links. And then you can tell people what to do, how to use this stuff.

It's also true that the job of managing your data is routinely handed (by this government) to overseas shitbags like Peter Thiel. I'm not sure what sort of access they have or how it can reasonably be restricted.

AI will soon be able to track everything

 

[N1985]

Lol, no.

It's 5 ounces of ground panda cock. I use it to pay for Chinese takeaways.

Oooh nice. Heard a couple of lines of that and you're ready to march on Bejing.

 

[stonerblue]

No way you can pay in a Chinese chippy on a card, cash only !

My go to Chinese knows I'm phoning before they answer, and my address. I can pay on card if I want but do cash.

 

[Summerbuzz]

AI will soon be able to track everything

Like in the shops. Pretty sure they will soon be able to tell if your pockets get bigger between entering and leaving.

What about weighing people in and out? That could work. Shoplifters just remember to have a dump equal in weight to the goods stolen.

Seriously tho, stuff doesn't work that well. 12 people trapped at the exit gate for the self service tonight. Nice.

 

[sir baconface]

Doesn’t bother me. I hardly ever use cash these days. As for the state controlling me, politicians and civil servants couldn’t control the average piss-up in a brewery.

My only concern is the potential impact on that section of older folk who are terrified of change.

 

[I'm With Stupid]

I don't care about the surveillance aspect, but it's definitely way easier to budget with cash. Seeing your physical cash go down is way more impactful than a text from your bank telling you what you've spent. If they sent a summary at the end of the week, maybe that'd work better.

 

[ColinBellsjockstrap]

Do you do driveways?

With a bit of luck he might have a bit of tarmac left from a job he's just done "up the road" sir, but you will have to pay him in cash to cut down on his paperwork. :-)

 

[Kompany Car]

Think some of this comes down to stopping money laundering from criminal enterprises. Car washes, takeaways etc are ideal for taking in money from drug dealing and getting it back into the system.

Like others have said though legitimate small businesses and the elderly will be most impacted.

 

[BrianW]

That's not the point. Who are you? One bod. Now if I could tell them all about 500 guys all like you, in your constituency. That's how elections are won.

That's why they really are all into the data. All parties. Trust me. All into it. All the time. Every single policy, every statement. Run through the data. Everyone is grouped and typified, forgotten, regrouped along different lines. A hundred times a week. To try and predict what they might get away with by messaging to certain groups. It might be more specific, the parties and affiliated organisations may well have long term lists for facebook accounts and data to go with them. Honestly, I'm not sure.

Cambridge Analytica got caught. But there seems little reason you can't do it in a 'clean room', away from any official party duty or links. And then you can tell people what to do, how to use this stuff.

It's also true that the job of managing your data is routinely handed (by this government) to overseas shitbags like Peter Thiel. I'm not sure what sort of access they have or how it can reasonably be restricted.

Say you're right.

What can you do about it? Nothing.

We ain't going back to the Middle Ages, or even 1956. Most people actually like the technology. It makes life easier at a time when most people under retirement age live very, very busy lives.

Democracy is a shite system, precisely because most people - yes, most! - are so easy to manipulate. But we're stuck with it. If people educated themselves - and I mean educated, not reading shite on the internet and swallowing it all down - and ditched their prejudices it would be much harder to manipulate us. Needless to say, this is a vain hope.

 

[awest]

A snippet from the leaflet.

A cashless society poses risks to millions of people, including those without bank accounts, disabled people, rural families, and those who may be at risk of having their finances controlled by an abuser. The psychological implications of cash encouraging self-control while paying by card or a mobile phone can encourage spending, and a cashless society has major surveillance implications. The UK risks drifting into a cashless society that could handicap those who are poor or in debt, disabled people, rural families, and anyone who may be at risk of having their finances controlled by an abuser. The move towards a cashless society has been so rapid that there are concerns it has resulted in financial exclusion, with buses no longer accepting cash and some other providers of basic and essential services, such as chemists, now frequently declining to accept coins. Another danger of a cashless society is cyber security, with identity fraud and cyber security being the biggest growing illegal activity in the world.