PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

[Stockton Heath Blue]

6000!! So bloody bored with this!

Can’t keep up with this thread ;-)

 

[Cobwebcat]

What would people guess as to the result of the two cases?

My guess would be

City fail to prove this first case
The PL fail to prove 115

The lawyers hire an island and have a big party even though nothing has materially changed from before the time the cases were brought.

 

[nmc]

But how could any party prove these emails/txt message exist?

Forensic specialists will be able to see if there has been unusual activity I.e. huge volumes of deleted messages on specific days. Moreover, emails involve more than one party so discrepancies in who produces what may be important. Close scrutiny will uncover a great deal as well. You received an email asking for info. But there’s no record of your reply…. Where is your reply. Just deleting isn’t a complete answer.

 

[heslops barnet]

He might get excited if one or two hidden secrets come out of it

They’ll be hidden alright

 

[Cobwebcat]

6,000 pages in 489 days so 12.27 per day.

We probably have at least 200 days to go so around 8,454 pages in total….without further appeals.

Probably nearer 9,000 when you include the big celebration and slap up lunch at Mrs Miggins’ pie shop.

 

[BlueRockape]

Forensic specialists will be able to see if there has been unusual activity I.e. huge volumes of deleted messages on specific days. Moreover, emails involve more than one party so discrepancies in who produces what may be important. Close scrutiny will uncover a great deal as well. You received an email asking for info. But there’s no record of your reply…. Where is your reply. Just deleting isn’t a complete answer.

I would love to see a raid on the PL HQ and lift all there computer's

 

[halfcenturyup]

The big positive for me is that things are obviously happening behind the scenes, it isnt a case that everything is mothballed until November. Why after all this time are the IC suddenly requesting these communications from the PL?

I am hoping this has something to do the IC having concerns about a witch hunt against the club, I cant see this being anything about the accounts submitted per say, however if we can show there has been a targeted movement of the rules to hamper our development then it has to help our case. Likewise it could be that they are looking for evidence in how the Red top shite have pressured the PL into these actions.

Who knows but it is certainly perking my interest.

I am not sure whether there being a witch hunt against the club at all affects the substance of the PL's case against City. The allegations are effectively that the club fraudulently filed incorrect accounts and did some other stuff against PL financial rules. Not sure how there being a witch hunt or not is relevant. The club either did those things or they didn't irrespective of whether there was a witch hunt or not.

But if we like conspiracy theories, how about this one:

The club knows there has been some correspondence between the PL and a club that, for example, the PL has insufficient evidence to prove the most serious of the 115 allegations, but they are going ahead anyway because that is what the other club wants. The club don't want to disclose the provenance of the correspondence (for one reason or another ;) ) but they want to raise it with the panel.

What does the club do? It counter-claims on an issue that will require the PL to disclose all its correspondence. They can identify all the incriminating documents in that case, and, once documents have been submitted in one, they can use them in the other. If the PL doesn't disclose the correspondence the club knows about, they are in bigger trouble. Win-win.

I like a good conspiracy theory, me :)

 

[Plays By Sense Of Smell]

Makes me wonder what Khaldoon did to so utterly convince Pep that we were right and clean, that Pep came put and backed us so vehemently.

He must have shown him some absolutely clear and damning evidence that we already had, ready to unpack at the right time..

The only possible doubt around which would be if we had made it up, like for example cutting amd pasting out of context pieces of what people had said...hence that statement about trust from Pep...

 

[old blue]

And I am non the wiser;)

Did you not read page 2. :-)

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

I expect it's been covered on here but Stefan isn't getting hugely excited over the disclosure news. His view is that it's just the standard two way disclosure request that is typical in these types of hearings.

Much as I respect Stefan he's not really in a position to judge yet. I don't think he has seen City's full 165-page documents yet for the APT case so he doesn't know the full context. The texts and emails for the 115 case go back to 2009 well before the Spiegl stuff had seen the light of day and few people know what's in those documents. There is a good chance there will be some embarrassing content. In my experence football club directors are very indiscrete people.

 

[BlueRockape]

I am not sure whether there being a witch hunt against the club at all affects the substance of the PL's case against City. The allegations are effectively that the club fraudulently filed incorrect accounts and did some other stuff against PL financial rules. Not sure how there being a witch hunt or not is relevant. The club either did those things or they didn't irrespective of whether there was a witch hunt or not.

But if we like conspiracy theories, how about this one:

The club knows there has been some correspondence between the PL and a club that, for example, the PL has insufficient evidence to prove the most serious of the 115 allegations, but they are going ahead anyway because that is what the other club wants. The club don't want to disclose the provenance of the correspondence (for one reason or another ;) ) but they want to raise it with the panel.

What does the club do? It counter-claims on an issue that will require the PL to disclose all its correspondence. They can identify all the incriminating documents in that case, and, once documents have been submitted in one, they can use them in the other. If the PL doesn't disclose the correspondence the club knows about, they are in bigger trouble. Win-win.

I like a good conspiracy theory, me :)

When they read like above so do I :)

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

I am not sure whether there being a witch hunt against the club at all affects the substance of the PL's case against City. The allegations are effectively that the club fraudulently filed incorrect accounts and did some other stuff against PL financial rules. Not sure how there being a witch hunt or not is relevant. The club either did those things or they didn't irrespective of whether there was a witch hunt or not.

But if we like conspiracy theories, how about this one:

The club knows there has been some correspondence between the PL and a club that, for example, the PL has insufficient evidence to prove the most serious of the 115 allegations, but they are going ahead anyway because that is what the other club wants. The club don't want to disclose the provenance of the correspondence (for one reason or another ;) ) but they want to raise it with the panel.

What does the club do? It counter-claims on an issue that will require the PL to disclose all its correspondence. They can identify all the incriminating documents in that case, and, once documents have been submitted in one, they can use them in the other. If the PL doesn't disclose the correspondence the club knows about, they are in bigger trouble. Win-win.

I like a good conspiracy theory, me :)

It's funny how so many of the so-called conspiracy theories before the CAS decision quickly turned into facts. I think your theory has certainly got legs.

 

[KS55]

I think you’ll find that certain clubs have been doing a lot more than just asking the PL about the investigation. Namely, pretty much forcing the PL to bring the charges in the first place.

Yes, the Arsenal letter is just part of a much bigger campaign. They wanted UEFA Rules they said but when that didn’t work, they lobbied for more rules such as associated sponsors and got them.
They didn’t campaign for control of debt, though. I wonder why.

 

[blueyorkie]

Is there a way to check any deleted emails? Besides the junk folder which they would obviously empty? ie, could a computer specialist if required confirm if any emails were indeed deleted?

Forensic IT is very sophisticated, if there were any suspicious matters they would confiscate the computers, phones etc. In such circumstances they would uncover anything that had been altered or deleted.

 

[Gorton_Tubster]

Can they not widen this and get the texts and emails from utd, lfc ,arsenal, levy?

I'm also confused as to why members club rules are enough to warrant such an action as investigating personal business information. I thought that was more the remit of legal or inquiry boards.

 

[WARBABY]

I am not sure whether there being a witch hunt against the club at all affects the substance of the PL's case against City. The allegations are effectively that the club fraudulently filed incorrect accounts and did some other stuff against PL financial rules. Not sure how there being a witch hunt or not is relevant. The club either did those things or they didn't irrespective of whether there was a witch hunt or not.

But if we like conspiracy theories, how about this one:

The club knows there has been some correspondence between the PL and a club that, for example, the PL has insufficient evidence to prove the most serious of the 115 allegations, but they are going ahead anyway because that is what the other club wants. The club don't want to disclose the provenance of the correspondence (for one reason or another ;) ) but they want to raise it with the panel.

What does the club do? It counter-claims on an issue that will require the PL to disclose all its correspondence. They can identify all the incriminating documents in that case, and, once documents have been submitted in one, they can use them in the other. If the PL doesn't disclose the correspondence the club knows about, they are in bigger trouble. Win-win.

I like a good conspiracy theory, me :)

we all like a good conspiracy theory on here

 

[KS55]

The press/media might not have a choice but to go big against the 3 red tops +1
If its proven that they were the reason the pl lost the case, pl had to pay damages. That it proves the 3 red tops are in control of the pl.

Can you imagine the 16 other clubs voting to throw out the 3 red tops +1 lol

I wonder if Simple Simon would say they should all be thrown out of the PL.

 

[mancboy]

I am not sure whether there being a witch hunt against the club at all affects the substance of the PL's case against City. The allegations are effectively that the club fraudulently filed incorrect accounts and did some other stuff against PL financial rules. Not sure how there being a witch hunt or not is relevant. The club either did those things or they didn't irrespective of whether there was a witch hunt or not.

But if we like conspiracy theories, how about this one:

The club knows there has been some correspondence between the PL and a club that, for example, the PL has insufficient evidence to prove the most serious of the 115 allegations, but they are going ahead anyway because that is what the other club wants. The club don't want to disclose the provenance of the correspondence (for one reason or another ;) ) but they want to raise it with the panel.

What does the club do? It counter-claims on an issue that will require the PL to disclose all its correspondence. They can identify all the incriminating documents in that case, and, once documents have been submitted in one, they can use them in the other. If the PL doesn't disclose the correspondence the club knows about, they are in bigger trouble. Win-win.

I like a good conspiracy theory, me :)

where is bigfoot ;)

 

[blueju]

Not a British interest. Only interesting to those who hate Liverpool.

You’re comparing it to what would be explosive for one of our institutions

It really is a British interest when the press lean so heavily towards and in favour of the redshirts and considering their current favourite receives tens of millions every year from SC.

 

[mancboy]

Is there a way to check any deleted emails? Besides the junk folder which they would obviously empty? ie, could a computer specialist if required confirm if any emails were indeed deleted?

if something is stored locally you could in essence drill the hard drive so its gone, but if we are talking about emails, texts etc then it is nigh on impossible to ever truly erase them if that level of info was required a forensic computer analyst or a decent hacker would get you them , now where could we get some of them, i think china have a few ;)