EU referendum deal (title edited)

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I was only about 10 in the seventies when we entered the common market as it was called. I remember my grandparents and their peers(wartime fighters and wives) voting in and giving the reason that it will make war less likely. Perfectly understandable given their own experience. But the EU has ballooned in size reach. Not decided which way to vote yet. Scratches head!!!
 
I expect the next few months to be a beauty parade as both sides try to tempt the biggest slice of the electorate, i.e., those that have lost interest in politics, the millions that live in "safe" seat areas, where their vote is meaningless.
A parade of popstars to sway the younger ones, Michael Parkinson and the like to lure the grannies and granddad's, Ids
Redwood, Gove et all for the daily mail lot, Cameron (for reasons I cannot fathom ) leading the inners.
The mail express telegraph will have more and more lurid headlines, they are after all the voice of their owners who have waged war on the EU since it's inception. The trouble is, it works as Murdoch so clearly demonstrated many times.
Debate on a forum is time wasted, both sides are already committed and will not be swayed. The apolitical types would not even give a second glance to something that had no connection to big brother or music or Facebook.
I was agnostic regarding the pros and cons, until IDS threw his weight on the side of the outers. I have learned that what he wants is guaranteed to be bad for me and a great slice of the population ( the old, the infirm, the unemployed, NHS users, those on benefits, doctors nurses firemen children etc) so I know which way I will vote.
 
To be honest most of those 28 get more than they put in so of course they'd stay in.

And we don't too bad. Give said we are the fifth biggest economy in the world and our trade balance with EU Countries would be better if we had a stronger economic base. Instead, our focus has largely been on expanding Service Sectors.

Sometimes we've not been smart enough in accessing EU regional development funding. The Scousers have coined it in with the redevelopment of their docks etc.
 
And we don't too bad. Give said we are the fifth biggest economy in the world and our trade balance with EU Countries would be better if we had a stronger economic base. Instead, our focus has largely been on expanding Service Sectors.

Sometimes we've not been smart enough in accessing EU regional development funding. The Scousers have coined it in with the redevelopment of their docks etc.

There is also plenty of research to suggest that we are net positive with the EU. CBI did one not too long ago, I believe.

Though I do admit these types of cost-benefits analysis are relatively hard to measure, so have a little sympathy with those who cast a weary eye over such reports.
 
And we don't too bad. Give said we are the fifth biggest economy in the world and our trade balance with EU Countries would be better if we had a stronger economic base. Instead, our focus has largely been on expanding Service Sectors.

Sometimes we've not been smart enough in accessing EU regional development funding. The Scousers have coined it in with the redevelopment of their docks etc.
Eh? Costs us 10 billion quid a year and rising to be told what we can and can't do, and we have a massive trade deficit with the EU.
 
There is also plenty of research to suggest that we are net positive with the EU. CBI did one not too long ago, I believe.

Though I do admit these types of cost-benefits analysis are relatively hard to measure, so have a little sympathy with those who cast a weary eye over such reports.

Would this be the same CBI who want to maintain the trading treaties with Europe and don't care about anything but their own members profit?
So must be true as there is clearly no conflict of interest!
 
I expect the next few months to be a beauty parade as both sides try to tempt the biggest slice of the electorate, i.e., those that have lost interest in politics, the millions that live in "safe" seat areas, where their vote is meaningless.
A parade of popstars to sway the younger ones, Michael Parkinson and the like to lure the grannies and granddad's, Ids
Redwood, Gove et all for the daily mail lot, Cameron (for reasons I cannot fathom ) leading the inners.
The mail express telegraph will have more and more lurid headlines, they are after all the voice of their owners who have waged war on the EU since it's inception. The trouble is, it works as Murdoch so clearly demonstrated many times.
Debate on a forum is time wasted, both sides are already committed and will not be swayed. The apolitical types would not even give a second glance to something that had no connection to big brother or music or Facebook.
I was agnostic regarding the pros and cons, until IDS threw his weight on the side of the outers. I have learned that what he wants is guaranteed to be bad for me and a great slice of the population ( the old, the infirm, the unemployed, NHS users, those on benefits, doctors nurses firemen children etc) so I know which way I will vote.

So IDS is the only Wrongdoer in the whole of right wing politics and shoulders the blame for everything? can't wait for him to retire the right wing will walk evry election after that for decades!
 
Eh? Costs us 10 billion quid a year and rising to be told what we can and can't do, and we have a massive trade deficit with the EU.

It could get worse than 10 Billion if we fail to make the goods and services the rest of Europe want and leave the EU. This is one of the uncertainties.

I think the investment in the EU is a better bet than the billions we spent bombing Libya, and Govenhas the cheek to blame the EU for the scale of immigration that his Government has helped to create.

We have focussed on services and goods that are more appealing to other parts of the World. This could of course reduce the risk of leaving the EU but as I have pointed out there are bigger issues like peace in Europe for the last 70 years.
 
There is also plenty of research to suggest that we are net positive with the EU. CBI did one not too long ago, I believe.

Though I do admit these types of cost-benefits analysis are relatively hard to measure, so have a little sympathy with those who cast a weary eye over such reports.

This is one of those 'facts' that I find very difficult to swallow. We pay in squillions and yet we screw back more than that? Does the £10b include the millions being sent out of the UK in terms of benefits? A fair number of EU economies are basket cases, others are paupers. From what I read from the business pages, it seems that the only economies that are strong enough to carry the spending of these Eurocrats and their ambitions is Germany and the UK. A good majority of the remaining 26 would be as miserable as fuck if our £10b had to be funded from the remaining 27!!
 
There is also plenty of research to suggest that we are net positive with the EU. CBI did one not too long ago, I believe.

Though I do admit these types of cost-benefits analysis are relatively hard to measure, so have a little sympathy with those who cast a weary eye over such reports.

Good point. I've been involved in a bit of ROI work in the Health Sector where we use the industry standard Phillips model where cost benefit analysis is one of five or six indicators of ROI.

I mention this because I believe there are cultural benefits that we have enjoyed through closer ties to Europe. I am thinking of the many millions who turned out to watch the Tour de France when it came here a couple of years ago.

This isn't linked directly to EU membership but reflects a closer connection with the continent of Europe.
 
Good point. I've been involved in a bit of ROI work in the Health Sector where we use the industry standard Phillips model where cost benefit analysis is one of five or six indicators of ROI.

I mention this because I believe there are cultural benefits that we have enjoyed through closer ties to Europe. I am thinking of the many millions who turned out to watch the Tour de France when it came here a couple of years ago.

This isn't linked directly to EU membership but reflects a closer connection with the continent of Europe.
Oh no, will they take the Tour De France away if we leave? The bastards.We're not thinking of turning into South Korea you know?
 
Oh no, will they take the Tour De France away if we leave? The bastards.We're not thinking of turning into South Korea you know?

And where will all our chavs go for there jollies. Cos obviously Europe will be so upset with us leaving that they might not let us go over there.
 
Oh no, will they take the Tour De France away if we leave? The bastards.We're not thinking of turning into South Korea you know?

Haha! It's the love of the Tour de France that's grown here I was on about. Maybe the Tour of Ebgland would get bigger if we left the EU lol!

Going back to earlier points about balance of trade etc. As well as products we produce and services that we sell, things like our relatively shit weather affect where people want to go on holiday and will impact on the figures. As will distribution networks with our ageing railways and very congested roads! Our Governent(s) could have sorted the latter over the decades!
 
Haha! It's the love of the Tour de France that's grown here I was on about. Maybe the Tour of Ebgland would get bigger if we left the EU lol!

Going back to earlier points about balance of trade etc. As well as products we produce and services that we sell, things like our relatively shit weather affect where people want to go on holiday and will impact on the figures. As will distribution networks with our ageing railways and very congested roads! Our Governent(s) could have sorted the latter over the decades!
Look on the bright side, we'll have an extra 10 billion quid a year to spend on them.
 
I'm not sure the 10 Billion number that is being bandied about i not a very sound figure and I don't think anything like that much will be the net result for the Chancellor. A lot of that money is never the UK's to start with.

About 3.5 billion is from import dutes etc on goods that are imported in to the EU through British ports. That money would not be available if the UK were to leave the EU/EEA. At the moment the UK gets to keep 25% of these duties (=1.17 billon & 75% = 3.5b goes to the EU) which are not shown in the EU to-and-fro. I suspect only a small portion of that 4.6 billion would stay in the UK.

There will be no free trade agreement between the EEA and the UK. That has been stated clearly from the start. There is no "Norway" option for the UK. Out is Out.
In the Guradian piece linked earlier it says "Michael B Froman, the United States trade representative, said last year that no free trade agreement would exist with Britain if it left the EU, and the US would have no interest in negotiating one."

So that is two major trading blocks with restricted import/export if the UK were to leave the EU.

The two largest imports by value from the EEA are oil and food - both pretty important. What does the UK have that is so important to the EU?

If the UK were to leave suffer huge economic crisis and be forced to re-apply to join
- there would be no rebate and
- it would ahve to join the Euro, as all states taht join the EU have to now.

Unfortunately this is what I think will happen.
 
The majority of the countries that are members of the EU are in need financially. If we pull out the burden on Germany and France would be immense. Personally I think it's a mess and getting worse. They have no solution for the refugee situation or the euro crisis. Get out now and save ourselves the pain.
 
The majority of the countries that are members of the EU are in need financially. If we pull out the burden on Germany and France would be immense. Personally I think it's a mess and getting worse. They have no solution for the refugee situation or the euro crisis. Get out now and save ourselves the pain.

The French can just open up the Channel tunnel to let the immigrants through! They will be laughing their cocks off!
 

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