EU referendum

EU referendum

  • In

    Votes: 503 47.9%
  • Out

    Votes: 547 52.1%

  • Total voters
    1,050
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Spot on regarding the scaremongering.

Just heard Farrage on BBC1 claiming the EU is responsible for the migrant crisis that has led to ISIS coming to Europe. What a load of bollox!

They might not be responsible but they have done precious little about AVOIDING the situation. It seems there has been free passage across the length and breadth of Europe from the moment a boat stuffed with migrants and/or terrorists lands on a Greek island.
 
They might not be responsible but they have done precious little about AVOIDING the situation. It seems there has been free passage across the length and breadth of Europe from the moment a boat stuffed with migrants and/or terrorists lands on a Greek island.

Yes I've got sympathy for the Greeks and Italians who have been in the firing line and the German public whose politically correct police and politicians have let them be the victims of crime.
 
Looks like Cameron has moved on, already, from his pathetic list of concessions he 'won' from the E.U countries. Is this recognition of the fact that the public feel they have been taken for fools by the whole charade?
 
They might not be responsible but they have done precious little about AVOIDING the situation. It seems there has been free passage across the length and breadth of Europe from the moment a boat stuffed with migrants and/or terrorists lands on a Greek island.

I am taking a few Czechs to the home game against Villa in a couple if weeks. I hope they don't set up a squat in the Etihad!
 
I think the whole basis of the no campaign is based on fear, fear of the future , fearnofnthe different, fear of change, etc etc, but it's fair to say much of the in campaign is just fear fear fear too.

Exactly. I expect the campaign to be typically negative and leave masses of people undecided who will just err on the side of caution and vote to stay in.
 
Yes I've got sympathy for the Greeks and Italians who have been in the firing line and the German public whose politically correct police and politicians have let them be the victims of crime.

There are an awful lot of Germans who are totally disgruntled that they are propping Europe up and also with Merkel and her open door for immigrants

But anyone who comes out and says it is just shouted down as a Nazi,which is why we don't really hear about it

Gove, Farage, and Urmston are out. For that reason, I'm in.

But Call me Dave and Gideon want us in!

Whichever side you're aligned to it's like sticking a pin in your eye
 
We need to ask ourselves: What are our biggest problems? Not opinions, not bias, just solid facts.
Is immigration a problem? Yep. Will leaving the EU solve it? Nope.
Is the economy a problem? Kinda. Will leaving the EU help? Not likely.
We stand to gain little, and lose a lot.
Why take the risk?
 
Don't know anyone in my family that even voted to get into the EU..



A growing number of British newspapers are now questioning the value of the European Union. Slowly, but steadily, it is becoming fashionable to question the value of the EU, the European Parliament and the Commissioners. The rejection of the new EU constitution by European voters seems to have given fresh courage to commentators. Very few of these commentators bother to point out that it was the British media which helped trick the electorate into supporting Britain's entry into the Common Market. And once we had been taken in, it was the press which encouraged that Britons voted `Yes' to stay in the Common Market.

By 1971, it was obvious that most British newspapers were wildly committed to Britain becoming a member of the EEC. Only the Express titles were not clamouring for membership.

The Financial Times and the Daily Mirror had both been strong advocates of membership from the early 1960s, but politicians took to the idea a little later.

The first Prime Minister to try to lead Britain into the EEC was Harold Wilson who, from 1966, was convinced that Britain could not survive outside the EEC. His Government's application to join, in May 1967 was vetoed by General de Gaulle, the French president, whose life and career had been saved by the British during the Second World War but whose loyalties were first to himself, second to France and not at all to Britain. Actually, French President Charles de Gaulle rejected Britain's application to join the Common Market twice. In public he argued that Britain, a traditional island nation, was not suited to be part of a European superstate. That was just political flim-flam. In reality he rejected Britain (despite everything that Britain had done for him and France during the Second World War) because he wanted to delay Britain's entry until the Common Agricultural Policy (designed to give huge subsidies to French peasant farmers) had been properly set up. Once the CAP was in place the loathsome de Gaulle suddenly decided that Britain's island history no longer mattered, and he became enthusiastic about Britain joining the Common Market. Naturally, he really wanted Britain to join the Market in order to help pay for the costs of running the CAP and keeping French farmers satisfied. There are a lot of French farmers, and they have always been a powerful voting block. Right from the start of the EU Britain has been used by both America and France. And it is still happening.

Three years later, when the foul and repulsive Ted Heath got into Number 10 Downing Street he began negotiations again, and a treaty was agreed in January 1972. This was the infamous treaty in which the treasonous Heath lied to everyone and betrayed his country.

In the months prior to Heath's betrayal the British public had not been convinced that they wanted their country to enter the EEC. Many, perhaps, simply didn't trust the politicians' claims that membership would be merely a commercial convenience. One opinion poll in early 1971 showed that the British people were against entry by the astonishing ratio of three to one. This opposition came despite the expenditure by the European Commission Information Service of around £10 million on trying to persuade opinion formers of the benefits of membership of the EEC.

With it looking as though joining the EEC might be political suicide the Government became desperate. Heath's Government paid for the distribution of propaganda extolling the virtues of membership, and produced a White Paper which was full of unsubstantiated claims for the EEC and which deliberately omitted any mention of the costs of membership or the fact that joining the EEC was the first step towards a federal states of Europe.

Heath only got away with his Great Betrayal because the press had decided that entry was a `good thing' (for them and their proprietors), and so did not question any of the claims made by Heath's Government.

Editors and columnists slavishly obeyed the dictates of their proprietors. If the press had done its job properly (and had investigated and analysed the purpose and value of the Common Market) Britain would have almost certainly never joined the EEC and would now be a considerably wealthier and more powerful nation.

The Financial Times, the Times, the Guardian, the Daily Telegraph, the Sunday Times, the Observer, the Daily Mail, the Sun and The Economist were all wildly enthusiastic about Britain joining the EEC. (As, indeed, most of them still are.) Throughout the run up to the day of our joining, the daily news in Britain was delivered with a preposterous pro-EEC slant designed to suppress the truth and to convince the public that without membership of the EEC neither they nor their country had much of a future. Only occasionally did the papers admit that the politicians were spinning like tops. The Times remarked that Geoffrey Rippon, the Cabinet Minister responsible for negotiating Britain's entry, was behaving `almost as though he has something to hide'. (He certainly did.) The Daily Mirror (which, at the time, had by far the largest sale in Britain) was unrelenting in describing the prizes of membership as immense and warning readers that if they voted against membership of the EEC they would become `mere lookers-on from an off-shore island of dwindling insignificance'.'

When Prince Philip took his foot out of his mouth long enough to claim that the EEC's Common Agricultural Policy was an example of bad management, the Daily Mirror called him a `chump'. (So, now who's the chump?)

The pro-EEC line appeared on news and feature pages and was supplemented with huge numbers of full page advertisements paid for by the European Movement.

Heath took Britain into the EEC with the help of the nation's press and without ever giving the electors a chance to say whether or not their country should become part of the European `project'.

Only the Daily Express `stood alone - with the people' against membership of the EEC. They praised Philip's scepticism about the Common Agricultural Policy announcing that `The People applaud his good sense...and wish it were more widely shared by our rulers.' But once the vote for membership had been won even the Daily Express capitulated and accepted the verdict.


http://www.vernoncoleman.com/howthebritishmedia.htm

I'm out!!
 
In, don't particulary think the EU is working right and needs reform, and Cameron has really secured nothing but stuff to appease parts of his party. At present though the outers have not given me a sufficient answer or vision of why we will be better off out
 
There are an awful lot of Germans who are totally disgruntled that they are propping Europe up and also with Merkel and her open door for immigrants

But anyone who comes out and says it is just shouted down as a Nazi,which is why we don't really hear about it



But Call me Dave and Gideon want us in!

Whichever side you're aligned to it's like sticking a pin in your eye

Hopefully this debate will reveal if Urmston and Chippy Boy are the same person?
 
as a power within the EU I simply cant understand why we are finding it so hard to get a better deal for ourselves.
The UK should be sat at the head of the table making demands not asking meekly...
 
as a power within the EU I simply cant understand why we are finding it so hard to get a better deal for ourselves.
The UK should be sat at the head of the table making demands not asking meekly...
Well it has to be agreed by all countries and quite literally the people of the other countries are getting a great deal from the uk so why would they agree to change?
 
Just what someone on the bbc say if we vote no it would take up to 2 years to be official and then the European courts have to agree to let us leave! If this is true it's utter bollocks and why we should vote NO.
 
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