EU referendum

[hilts]

Everyone should visit the war graves, a sober sober reminder of what a divided competing Europe did to humanity for many many centuries.

A good point, it has fuck all to do with the eu referendum mind

 

[EalingBlue2]

What I am missing is, whilst I acknowledge we could do our own trade deals etc. we are so tangled up in EU policy and law (that we were part of creating) that to unravel it will require people to do this work. We know trade deals can take years in the making and in some places, they are very complex negotiations to make. Just to get a mayor for Manchester has taken approx two years in parliament to pass the bill! Imagine passing new bills as a result of coming out of the legal framework in the EU!

I'm also grappling the notion that we will need to employ more government ministers, lawyers, civil servants and businesses people to achieve this. Thus creating a possible hefty bill - for us normal tax paying people to fund. We're already burdened with high taxes and face more austerity over the next 5 years so, does austerity carry on longer and for what? A trade deal that ends up at the same level as we already have now... As for our legal system do we employ more lawyers to help change what we have that is so bad according to the outers!

Moving onto immigration, let's sort out the non EU migration which we have total control of and is higher Before we moan about Europeans coming here!

I have little doubt that once the UK government has got its hands on this money every penny we will have saved from the EU will have been spent on the UK civil service needed to deal with the tens of thousands of responsibilities, negotiations, trade management, regulations etc we will have to make and manage . As for immigration the big issue is that I don't think the highly skilled, highly able immigrants are going to be pouring in to the UK , from weather , to tax, to the future of the economy as the UK on a world scale is not as attractive as it would like to believe. apart from London and maybe the south east nowhere will gain. What's more if immigration stops the economy will stop growing, the deficit won't close and everyone will have to accept either higher taxes, higher superannuation or a massive decline in services

 

[blueish swede]

Maybe I'm missing something here? If you sell me more stuff than I sell you then it's in your best interests to have a free trade deal not mine.

You are missing something very significant. The coutries in the EU/EEA pay a membership fee to be part of the club. Giving away the benefits of membership for free to a rogue nation like a post out vote UK is not in the interests of the paying members and therefore will never happen. Unfortunately like many "outers" you only seem to be able to grasp one side of the situation.

And the future of the UK is not sitting cross-legged on a beach trading tin plates and shiny things with swarthy peoples in exchange for their jet engines and digital technology, as Nigel would have you believe.

 

[hilts]

You are missing something very significant. The coutries in the EU/EEA pay a membership fee to be part of the club. Giving away the benefits of membership for free to a rogue nation like a post out vote UK is not in the interests of the paying members and therefore will never happen. Unfortunately like many "outers" you only seem to be able to grasp one side of the situation.

And the future of the UK is not sitting cross-legged on a beach trading tin plates and shiny things with swarthy peoples in exchange for their jet engines and digital technology, as Nigel would have you believe.

So you are saying that this club might not be big on democracy, tend to fuck up big time on immigration and refugees but we should stay in because they will see their arses and hold a grudge? Is bending over a Swedish thing or just personnel to you?

 

[EalingBlue2]

You are missing something very significant. The coutries in the EU/EEA pay a membership fee to be part of the club. Giving away the benefits of membership for free to a rogue nation like a post out vote UK is not in the interests of the paying members and therefore will never happen. Unfortunately like many "outers" you only seem to be able to grasp one side of the situation.

And the future of the UK is not sitting cross-legged on a beach trading tin plates and shiny things with swarthy peoples in exchange for their jet engines and digital technology, as Nigel would have you believe.

It certainly isn't there is little the UK trades today that it is likely to have a competitive advantage in of any significance in a decade twos time, in many ways that is an issue for the UK if in or out though more stark and immediate if out.

I just hope the thousands of civil service jobs that will be created if England votes out will go to areas like Cornwall, the north east, Scotland and Wales as the Celtic fringes and areas like these will be totally fucked the other an out vote as any of the gains Boris is hoping for will mainly be in a square mile or two of central London.

The biggest guarantee is the hedge funds will be the big winners with an out vote so I suspect they will start dipping into their pockets soon.

 

[EalingBlue2]

So you are saying that this club might not be big on democracy, tend to fuck up big time on immigration and refugees but we should stay in because they will see their arses and hold a grudge? Is bending over a Swedish thing or just personnel to you?

The Vikings were always big on bending over little englanders or were they Anglanders in those days - when they came and plundered though most were Danes and Norwegian that came out way!

If the UK votes out there is going to be a lot of bending over and taking it over the next few years - the Chinese , Indians, Russians etc cannot wait to give the UK a great rogering.

A lot of these countries are truly delighted at a weaker Europe

 

[hilts]

The Vikings were always big on bending over little englanders or were they Anglanders in those days - when they came and plundered though most were Danes and Norwegian that came out way!

I have a fondest for the Danes, good people, the swedes though like the belgians are a bit beige, if you like boxy cars and bright coloured flat pack furniture one might disagree but the general consensus is if Sweden disappeared tomorrow almost no one would notice

 

[EalingBlue2]

I have a fondest for the Danes, good people, the swedes though like the belgians are a bit beige, if you like boxy cars and bright coloured flat pack furniture one might disagree but the general consensus is if Sweden disappeared tomorrow almost no one would notice

I think Stokholm is one of the greatest most liveable cities in Europe (at least it is April to October when I lived there) the north of the country is stunningly beautiful and most other countries could learn a hell of a lot from Swedens culture.

There is nothing beige about Sweden geographically and your comment is as valid as some of the nonsense people spout about the UK being cold wet and full of gay shopkeepers

 

[blueish swede]

So you are saying that this club might not be big on democracy, tend to fuck up big time on immigration and refugees but we should stay in because they will see their arses and hold a grudge? Is bending over a Swedish thing or just personnel to you?

Ok First off I'm from Ancoats, so I don't give a fuck what your preferences are in tems of companionship in Scandinavian saunas.

Secondly what is not democtatic about it? You vote out - you're out. You vote in - you're in. Easy enought for the rest of Europe to understand, just the little Englanders who think they can vote out but still be in. This is the truth about Europe: No one likes you. No one needs you.

It pains me to write this but he Aussies were right all along: a bunch of whinging pommes is all that's left of the UK. When you leave you'll be forced to give up the only thing that keeps you remotely interesting from a world perspective - your nukes - and then you'll fade away in a self-obsessed oblivion of Last night of the proms and re-runs of Miss Marple.

 

[hilts]

Ok First off I'm from Ancoats, so I don't give a fuck what your preferences are in tems of companionship in Scandinavian saunas.

Secondly what is not democtatic about it? You vote out - you're out. You vote in - you're in. Easy enought for the rest of Europe to understand, just the little Englanders who think they can vote out but still be in. This is the truth about Europe: No one likes you. No one needs you.

It pains me to write this but he Aussies were right all along: a bunch of whinging pommes is all that's left of the UK. When you leave you'll be forced to give up the only thing that keeps you remotely interesting from a world perspective - your nukes - and then you'll fade away in a self-obsessed oblivion of Last night of the proms and re-runs of Miss Marple.

Bless you and your insignificant little country, the U.K. In global terms is still way more important than Sweden, you have meatballs well done, and if no one in Europe wants us why are they telling us how disastrous it will be if we leave, anyhow I'm off to listen to my favourite Swedish music, film or comedy, the choice is rather extensive

 

[hgblue]

Ok First off I'm from Ancoats, so I don't give a fuck what your preferences are in tems of companionship in Scandinavian saunas.

Secondly what is not democtatic about it? You vote out - you're out. You vote in - you're in. Easy enought for the rest of Europe to understand, just the little Englanders who think they can vote out but still be in. This is the truth about Europe: No one likes you. No one needs you.

It pains me to write this but he Aussies were right all along: a bunch of whinging pommes is all that's left of the UK. When you leave you'll be forced to give up the only thing that keeps you remotely interesting from a world perspective - your nukes - and then you'll fade away in a self-obsessed oblivion of Last night of the proms and re-runs of Miss Marple.

Hell hath no fury like a former European ally and friend scorned. The debate must be going badly for project fear,

 

[KenTheLandlord]

I think he has realised that the world has moved on since the Victorian era you and Hilts still think is the real world.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

Ok First off I'm from Ancoats, so I don't give a fuck what your preferences are in tems of companionship in Scandinavian saunas.

Secondly what is not democtatic about it? You vote out - you're out. You vote in - you're in. Easy enought for the rest of Europe to understand, just the little Englanders who think they can vote out but still be in. This is the truth about Europe: No one likes you. No one needs you.

It pains me to write this but he Aussies were right all along: a bunch of whinging pommes is all that's left of the UK. When you leave you'll be forced to give up the only thing that keeps you remotely interesting from a world perspective - your nukes - and then you'll fade away in a self-obsessed oblivion of Last night of the proms and re-runs of Miss Marple.

What's Swedish for "she's got a right strop on"?
Who's going to force the UK to disarm, Sweden?

 

[KenTheLandlord]

pmsl, as if the UK would use them.

 

[hilts]

I think he has realised that the world has moved on since the Victorian era you and Hilts still think is the real world.

From the guy who lives in the 70's British Leyland la la land

 

[KenTheLandlord]

From the guy who lives in the 70's British Leyland la la land

Yup, and it really is that bad for you, that i am 70 years ahead of you.

 

[EalingBlue2]

Hell hath no fury like a former European ally and friend scorned. The debate must be going badly for project fear,

far from that the veneer of an outer comes off for a second and shows the arrogant contempt and bigotry that is a huge part of the out vote and the reasons behind it. If you turn against the swedes likes that God knows what it'll be like when blueish German posts.

When times get a little but hard and you choose to turn your back on everyone why should they not be scorned!

Britains Nukes will be in a warehouse as there won't be working submarines to house them and if there were there won't be a deep water port they can come in to anyway. It's time Britain and France gave up the pretence to be honest

 

[EalingBlue2]

What's Swedish for "she's got a right strop on"?
Who's going to force the UK to disarm, Sweden?

Not being able to afford it and being irellevant will take them away

It's the thing about this vote , yes there is fear mongering by I need yes there is a lot needed to improve Europe but.......

The outters have no concept at all about WHT Britains future is, what industries we can compete in long term, how we will replace immigration needed or the money coming from growth it brings. I have not heard once any argument about what we offer long term to China to NAFTA to India or anyone other than a market that they can flood with their cheap goods.

I think the inners do lack a strategy and ideas but it is fairly obvious now that the outters are quite happy jumping out of a plane with a rucksack on because everything will be ok. The ground loves us, the clouds will help cushion our fall and a couple of pheasants we were shooting yesterday will sacrifice their lives to save us.

 

[EalingBlue2]

Yup, and it really is that bad for you, that i am 70 years ahead of you.

70 I would say 2-300 we still have America and Handel is still working on his fireworks music

 

[grunge]

Ok First off I'm from Ancoats, so I don't give a fuck what your preferences are in tems of companionship in Scandinavian saunas.

Secondly what is not democtatic about it? You vote out - you're out. You vote in - you're in. Easy enought for the rest of Europe to understand, just the little Englanders who think they can vote out but still be in. This is the truth about Europe: No one likes you. No one needs you.

It pains me to write this but he Aussies were right all along: a bunch of whinging pommes is all that's left of the UK. When you leave you'll be forced to give up the only thing that keeps you remotely interesting from a world perspective - your nukes - and then you'll fade away in a self-obsessed oblivion of Last night of the proms and re-runs of Miss Marple.

I've seen some very weird claims in this debate but that one has to be the weirdest one ever!. We independently developed our nuclear program, were the 3rd country to test one and have the 4th largest stockpile of warheads in the world.

What makes you think we would have to give them up?