16 | Rodri - 2021/22 Performances

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

One of those players, like GazBaz, who largely go unnoticed until the game comes when they don't start, and their absence is painfully obvious!

 

[mccity]

@ws01 Reckon this is just lazy analysis?

I say this as someone who has been a huge Rodri fan from way back when he was poorly rated on here, that yes it is lazy analysis.

The three games without Rodri were today, Southampton, and Tottenham. All three games we were way under the level we should have been at throughout the team.

Tottenham we were awful. Fernandinho had a poor game, but I think he was helpless given how tired we looked. Southampton everybody sucked and we were outwitted and outworked by a fresher team again. And today we got complacent against one of the best counter attacking teams going after racing into a two goal lead. But significantly once the team got their heads on after Leicester's third we looked at relative ease again.


Admittedly Fernandinho played his part in all of those games, and I would consistently make the argument that Rodri should definitely be the starter and is better for us this season. Rodri's ability to help us control play negates counters before they happen. But I do think the above is lazy analysis and does Fernandinho a disservice. It reads to me like when people point out we tend to get worse results when Aké starts (or Gundogan back in 17/18).

 

[ws01]

@ws01 Reckon this is just lazy analysis?

Umm.... yes. It doesn't look and individual situation or context. Correlation does not imply casuation.

Rodri out = goal scored against us = must be because Rodri's out is not analysis. It's lazy rubbish.

 

[jollylescott]

According to what I have just read (@premierinjuries) on Twitter, both he and Walker have coronavirus with no return date at this stage. Gulp!

 

[MCFC1993]

Had his best game of the season in the 2nd half.

 

[SebastianBlue]

I say this as someone who has been a huge Rodri fan from way back when he was poorly rated on here, that yes it is lazy analysis.

The three games without Rodri were today, Southampton, and Tottenham. All three games we were way under the level we should have been at throughout the team.

Tottenham we were awful. Fernandinho had a poor game, but I think he was helpless given how tired we looked. Southampton everybody sucked and we were outwitted and outworked by a fresher team again. And today we got complacent against one of the best counter attacking teams going after racing into a two goal lead. But significantly once the team got their heads on after Leicester's third we looked at relative ease again.


Admittedly Fernandinho played his part in all of those games, and I would consistently make the argument that Rodri should definitely be the starter and is better for us this season. Rodri's ability to help us control play negates counters before they happen. But I do think the above is lazy analysis and does Fernandinho a disservice. It reads to me like when people point out we tend to get worse results when Aké starts (or Gundogan back in 17/18).

I understand your position but I do not agree that presenting data that potentially demonstrates a recent correlation between Rodri’s absence and increased negative defensive outcomes is “lazy analysis”. Especially one that gets stronger over time. The stronger it gets the less likely it can be reasonably and adequately explained by other mitigating factors. If it gets weaker over time then it is still important and I may change my assessment of the necessity of his involvement.

I tend to trust data analysis more than observational analysis for obvious reasons, particularly because trends in quantifiable aspects of life are abundantly useful in establishing and testing hypothesises outside of personal bias. Whereas, for instance, someone that has always disliked Rodri will usually only ever observe the negative aspects of his game and argue against his positive contributions, citing their qualitative analysis of his contributions (or lack there of) as support. Observational bias and misattribution can be broken with data.

I have many times in the past posted data-driven analysis of players and their performances but do not have the energy nor time these days to do so. However, my earlier post regarding Rodri’s general contribution to our success is based on my review of other data-driven analysis that I have stumbled upon over the last year.

Umm.... yes. It doesn't look and individual situation or context. Correlation does not imply casuation.

Rodri out = goal scored against us = must be because Rodri's out is not analysis. It's lazy rubbish.

See above.

By the way, I am a data scientist (or was before I was forced to retire recently), so I know in excruciatingly boring detail that correlation does not imply causation and I never seriously claimed our lacklustre defensive display was solely because Rodri’s absence. I made a slightly tongue-in-cheek comment on the match thread and you decide to take umberage, then create a much more hardline argument on my behalf to argue against.

I decided against responding in earnest to your retort later because I remembered—as I was reading your post—that you’ve always been a Rodri detractor, so there wasn’t much point to debating you on the merits. I am never going to change your mind, regardless of the evidence I could present now or in the future supporting my stance.

 

[Phil1]

I understand your position but I do not agree that presenting data that potentially demonstrates a recent correlation between Rodri’s absence and increased negative defensive outcomes is “lazy analysis”. Especially one that gets stronger over time. The stronger it gets the less likely it can be reasonable and adequately explained by other mitigating factors. If it gets weaker over time then it is still important and I may change my assessment of the necessarily of his involvement.

I tend to trust data analysis more than observational analysis for obvious reasons, particularly because trends in quantifiable aspects of life are abundantly useful in establishing and testing hypothesises outside of personal bias. Whereas, for instance, someone that has always disliked Rodri will usually only ever observe the negative aspects of his game and argue against his positive contributions, citing their qualitative analysis of his contributions (or lack there of) as support. Observational bias and misattribution can be broken with data.

I have many times in the past posted data-driven analysis of players and their performances but do not have the energy nor time these days to do so. However, my earlier post regarding Rodri’s general contribution to our success is based on my review of other data-driven analysis that I have stumbled upon over the last year.



See above.

By the way, I am a data scientist (or was before I was forced to retire recently), so I know in excruciatingly boring detail that correlation does not imply causation and I never seriously claimed our lacklustre defensive display was solely because Rodri’s absence. I made a slightly tongue-in-cheek comment on the match thread and you decide to take umberage, then create a much more hardline argument on my behalf to argue against.

I decided against responding in earnest to your retort later because I remembered—as I was reading your post—that you’ve always been a Rodri detractor, so there wasn’t much point to debating you on the merits. I am never going to change your mind, regardless of the evidence I could present now or in the future supporting my stance.

Yeah, you'd definitely be wasting your time and energy on that one, mate.
We miss Rodri big time when he's not in there, those denying that are probably best left alone.

 

[skillman]

Somebody bit back at me for saying we missed Rodri yesterday seeing Fernandinho not stopping counters. Rodri’s positional play is brilliant, don’t need pace to effective.

 

[Irishblue93]

Hope he's back for arsenal

 

[kaz7]

ya I have noticed the biggest difference between the two is their passing. Ferna always takes 3 touches to pass. what this does is allow the opposition to set their defense and then our players get frustrated and the move away from their intended position to receive the ball. this leaves the space for them to exploit when the turnover occurs. remember how pep said stay in the position and the ball comes to you. this is the entire basis of our play and what Rodri gives us

Dinho is one of the best foward passing players we have