Are City a better all round team without Haaland?

jrb said:
The team are more fluid without Haaland. Like we used to be with a false 9.

Managers and teams have worked Haaland out a bit, bar those moments of pure striker instinct that he will always have. 2 centre halfs doubling up on Haaland. And when Kev get’s the ball on the right to cross over to Haaland, teams are doubling up on Kev to stop those crosses that have led to so many goals for Haaland at the start of the season.

Pep needs to tweak his Haaland tactics a bit, just to mix up his movement and the teams movement around him.

But Haaland will always be one of the first names on the team sheet.
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What is this based on? There’s barely any evidence to support this apart from a couple of cup games where the opposition mixed up their line up. We struggled against Fulham and Leicester quiet badly to create chances when he was out injured and only won both games due to set pieces - one of which Haaland converted as a late sub.

That team which started against Chelsea yesterday wouldn’t come close to winning the league if it was our regular XI. It would actually struggle to get top 4.
 
tolmie's hairdoo said:
I wouldn't want to find out!!

It's clear we are now without Kev, sadly.

Haaland has scored 27 goals in a slow build-up, so imagine how many he would get if we move the ball quicker like yesterday!
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Not even close, although you’ve been writing him off for about 2-3 years now and each time he comes back with an incredible run of form.

I certainly wouldn’t have Foden, Bernardo and Gundogan ahead of him. Even on current form those 3 aren’t any better even now when Kev is on a dip.
 
I think the simple way of looking at it is that we perfected the way we played with smaller technically good intricate passing players, to a Europe leading level… we simply haven’t perfected playing with Haaland yet.
 
tolmie's hairdoo said:
I wouldn't want to find out!!

It's clear we are now without Kev, sadly.

Haaland has scored 27 goals in a slow build-up, so imagine how many he would get if we move the ball quicker like yesterday!
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You mean like the derby also? Kev was brilliant that day along with the rest. It’s about tempo not Necesarrily who’s on the pitch
 
jrb said:
The team are more fluid without Haaland. Like we used to be with a false 9.

Managers and teams have worked Haaland out a bit, bar those moments of pure striker instinct that he will always have. 2 centre halfs doubling up on Haaland. And when Kev get’s the ball on the right to cross over to Haaland, teams are doubling up on Kev to stop those crosses that have led to so many goals for Haaland at the start of the season.

Pep needs to tweak his Haaland tactics a bit, just to mix up his movement and the teams movement around him.

But Haaland will always be one of the first names on the team sheet.
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I agree with a lot of your post but he has still scored 4 in 4 after the world cup.
 
We just need to get better service from wide areas when he is playing. The Everton game was shite as we had no overlapping or underlapping full backs and Mahrez and Grealish didn't have great individual games. Haaland has to start in every big game for me so we need to get the balance right elsewhere
 
Cambijao said:
Haaland has 27 goals in 22 goals in all comps this season and broke multiple goalscoring records this season. The man is on track to score 40 goals in Premier League, which no player came close to do so before. Let's also not forget Haaland's outrageous stats in UCL as well as for Norway.

Aguero was a great striker, but he has never been on Haaland's level if we keep it real.
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I don't think someone who has 'Haaland' under Team Supported could possibly claim to be objective in this discussion.
 
HelloCity said:
Not even close, although you’ve been writing him off for about 2-3 years now and each time he comes back with an incredible run of form.

I certainly wouldn’t have Foden, Bernardo and Gundogan ahead of him. Even on current form those 3 aren’t any better even now when Kev is on a dip.
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I've been saying for nigh on a year that he is physically degrading, his talent for the exceptional will always be with him.

The extra legs yesterday of Bernie and Foden in the middle were telling. Kev's high-risk reward can only be supplemented by high energy in the middle of the pitch to account for the turnover he gives up.

Kev would be perfect in a team that passes far quicker, but we don't, and it's even more required if Kev is playing.

Even when Kev was at his peak, we looked a very different animal winning the title when he was out injured and Bernardo was filling the role.

Perhaps that's why we are in for Bellingham?
 
tolmie's hairdoo said:
I've been saying for nigh on a year that he is physically degrading, his talent for the exceptional will always be with him.

The extra legs yesterday of Bernie and Foden in the middle were telling. Kev's high-risk reward can only be supplemented by high energy in the middle of the pitch to account for the turnover he gives up.

Kev would be perfect in a team that passes far quicker, but we don't, and it's even more required if Kev is playing.

Even when Kev was at his peak, we looked a very different animal winning the title when he was out injured and Bernardo was filling the role.

Perhaps that's why we are in for Bellingham?
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I don’t think we can judge anything based on yesterday. Both teams had makeshift teams out and no one matches up to us in terms of being able to make such changes. Not only that but they are badly out of form as well. I wouldn’t be surprised if we beat Arsenal in the cup comfortably by a couple of goals due to changes being made then as well.

Kev is still the best creative midfielder in the world and certainly the best in our side. Foden and Bernardo might have extra legs but they’re also very quiet in terms of dictating play and controlling the tempo. Kev, even on his very worst days, is always there trying to make things happen. This is one of the best attributes a player can ever have. His form in the second half of last season was also arguably his best ever and played a huge part in us winning the league, something we wouldn’t have done without him. He’ll be back to his best again soon enough, just as he always is.
 
tolmie's hairdoo said:
I wouldn't want to find out!!

It's clear we are now without Kev, sadly.

Haaland has scored 27 goals in a slow build-up, so imagine how many he would get if we move the ball quicker like yesterday!
Click to expand...
Agree about Kev and have thought the same for years now. The best football I’ve ever seen us and maybe any team play was in the middle of the 19-20 season when Kev was out injured for a long spell and the whole of the midfield seemed to come out of their shell without him there and we played the most beautiful fluent “total football” week after week after week winning god knows how many games on the bounce.

The man in the street is obsessed with goals and assists and to an extent they’re right and Kev should be in the team but City at our absolute peak can’t feature a man who gives the ball away as often as Kev does.

It must be a terrible dilemma for Pep to face knowing that the one man who is most likely to produce moments of defence splitting magic is also the man who is least suited to the incredible system he’s developed.
 
jrb said:
The team are more fluid without Haaland. Like we used to be with a false 9.

Managers and teams have worked Haaland out a bit, bar those moments of pure striker instinct that he will always have. 2 centre halfs doubling up on Haaland. And when Kev get’s the ball on the right to cross over to Haaland, teams are doubling up on Kev to stop those crosses that have led to so many goals for Haaland at the start of the season.

Pep needs to tweak his Haaland tactics a bit, just to mix up his movement and the teams movement around him.

But Haaland will always be one of the first names on the team sheet.
Click to expand...
I actually think we are more fluid without Kev, and that's not me saying he isn't world class, it's just that so much seems to go through him when he plays

To get the best from Haaland, the passing and movement needs to be quick and crisp, trying to get Kev into the right hand position to put a cross in for Haaland shouldn't be our 'go to' in order to get Haaland into the game
 
HelloCity said:
I don’t think we can judge anything based on yesterday. Both teams had makeshift teams out and no one matches up to us in terms of being able to make such changes. Not only that but they are badly out of form as well. I wouldn’t be surprised if we beat Arsenal in the cup comfortably by a couple of goals due to changes being made then as well.

Kev is still the best creative midfielder in the world and certainly the best in our side. Foden and Bernardo might have extra legs but they’re also very quiet in terms of dictating play and controlling the tempo. Kev, even on his very worst days, is always there trying to make things happen. This is one of the best attributes a player can ever have. His form in the second half of last season was also arguably his best ever and played a huge part in us winning the league, something we wouldn’t have done without him. He’ll be back to his best again soon enough, just as he always is.
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I think he does need a good rest and while he will always be our most incisive passer, there may be coming a time where we have to manage his time and, should we transition towards a quicker way of playing, someone like Bellingham would give him a new lease of life.

I also felt the same when Yaya was sweeping all before him? In European games, he cost us a lot, because we thought the trade off was worth it, but his lack of legs left us a man short at times.
 
Raskolnikov. said:
Agree about Kev and have thought the same for years now. The best football I’ve ever seen us and maybe any team play was in the middle of the 19-20 season when Kev was out injured for a long spell and the whole of the midfield seemed to come out of their shell without him there and we played the most beautiful fluent “total football” week after week after week winning god knows how many games on the bounce.

The man in the street is obsessed with goals and assists and to an extent they’re right and Kev should be in the team but City at our absolute peak can’t feature a man who gives the ball away as often as Kev does.

It must be a terrible dilemma for Pep to face knowing that the one man who is most likely to produce moments of defence splitting magic is also the man who is least suited to the incredible system he’s developed.
Click to expand...
Think there may be a question at the moment and will be in the coming season or 2. Thinking that about him for years now is just bonkers though.
 
No.

Same with Kdb.

Pep needs to find the right balance. Rotation is needed and no one argues with that approach. However, keeping a stable team to allow Haaland to shine will be as important.

The Chelsea win showed us all that the team needs energy and grafters. Any lineup going forward without those players is going to struggle.

How Pep balances this problem will determine how successful this season becomes. I have doubts based on what’s happened up to this point.

Alvarez, Bernie, Phil must start if fit. Haaland will do his part.
 
tolmie's hairdoo said:
I think he does need a good rest and while he will always be our most incisive passer, there may be coming a time where we have to manage his time and, should we transition towards a quicker way of playing, someone like Bellingham would give him a new lease of life.

I also felt the same when Yaya was sweeping all before him? In European games, he cost us a lot, because we thought the trade off was worth it, but his lack of legs left us a man short at times.
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We just beat Fulham with 10 men and De Bruyne produced an all time great performance where he ran himself into the ground for the whole game and delivered some sensational balls. Yaya couldn’t have put that work in when he was 21 never mind 31.
 
Blu3m00n91 said:
Possibly the worst thread ever, played a handful of games without him. The way we played today was all about tempo and quick passing, nothing to do with who was upfront. Do these people forget games like Leicester away a couple months ago? Haaland didn’t feature then and it was the dullest game ever
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Tempo, tempo, tempo. The key to a good performance. We had become too slow and deliberate at times. Against Chelsea the passing in the first half was slicker, quicker and more instinctive.
 
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